First Phera Plex cycle

[Panzerfaust]

lookin good so far...Couple days you should start noticing it

What exactly should i notice, just wondering what you think.

[Panzerfaust]

Day 3

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
Taurin

Worked shoulders and Abs today and had a good workout. Finished up with 35minutes cardio, I do not think i can tell any difference just yet.

Anyone have any info on "back pumps" and what exactly they are. I sore the day after each excercise this week which is strange and my upper back feels like it has been worked out but i don't do back until tomorrow. Back pumps?

All is going well...

[rar1015]

Ive heard of people getting some insane back pumps. A friend of mine told me the pumps he was getting were really hurting his back but it went away after a few days.

[Quil]

I had back pumps on SD. Felt extremely tight in my lower back all the time...in fact, it became uncomfortable to sit in certain positions, and feels like it needs to be stretched out, but stretching doesn't help much. Mine stayed for a few weeks before going away when I started PCT. I did not, however, supplement with Taurine, which should help.

[Panzerfaust]

Day 4

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
Taurin

Just got home from working back and traps, goddamn did i sweat today. Holy shit i was soaked like i jumped in a pool. Good workout and finished up with cardio as always.

What can i expect in the coming days as far as telling if this PP has kicked in?

[Papi93]

Day 4

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
Taurin

Just got home from working back and traps, goddamn did i sweat today. Holy shit i was soaked like i jumped in a pool. Good workout and finished up with cardio as always.

What can i expect in the coming days as far as telling if this PP has kicked in?

You should start to notice very good strength gains in the second week. They will not be as great as if you where increasing your caloric intake, though.

[Papi93]

Day 3

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
Taurin

Worked shoulders and Abs today and had a good workout. Finished up with 35minutes cardio, I do not think i can tell any difference just yet.

Anyone have any info on "back pumps" and what exactly they are. I sore the day after each excercise this week which is strange and my upper back feels like it has been worked out but i don't do back until tomorrow. Back pumps?

All is going well...

I didn't experience the lower back pumps that some have. Other members supplement with taurine to help with this. I guess I was lucky. Are you getting enough water?

[Panzerfaust]

I am not having any "back pumps", my upper back seemed a tad sore but did'nt fit the explanations of back pumps i was given. I am getting more than enough water, i am adding a few extra kCals than normal and i hope to see this stuff kick in next week.

[rar1015]

Let us know when it kicks in man!

[Quil]

I didn't start experiencing the back pumps until after the first week or so...that's also about the time that I noticed my strength going way up. I'm sure the taurine will help you out considerably.

[PoisonPen]

Great topic. Just a few questions:


Is Hawthorne Berry required for cycles of PP? Same with Niacin. Obviously it would be better to sue it than not, but is their a high risk if it is not used?

Thanks for the help.

[Panzerfaust]

Day 5

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
Taurin


Off day from the gym as well as the next few because of work, will be back in the gym hitting it hard on Monday. I gotta figure something out because i missed a chest workout, my g/f has Fridays off and i wanna spend time with her so i figure i will have to throw chest into the mix on another day.

No sides to report. I cannot tell anything different so far, should start to see/feel the difference this coming week from what i have read.

[rar1015]

PoisonPen.............Dont hijack someones thread........just start a new one and you will get plenty of answers. Plus you can also use the search function at the top of the page.

[bruinsball22]

Im currently running a cycle of max lmg.. and like you were saying you sweat a lot. That happened to me the first week or so, even felt sick in the gym... I also started getting the back pumps you guys are talking about. Extreme back pumps barely being able to bend over. I use a heat pack on my back to loosen it up. The back pumps are coming i have only like a week left in my cycle. So you still might be looking at them down the road

[Panzerfaust]

Sorry for no updates but my work schedule is crazy over the weekend.

Day 6

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin


Day 7

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin


Day 8

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Although i do not workout on work days due to the night shift plus working 12hrs and have to be back to work 8 hours later so i usually only get 5 hours sleep.

Anyways, i believe PP is kicking in and am anxious to see what happens in the gym in about an hour (Chest/Legs). I feel like my muscles are tighter than usual and i believe it or not i can see some results already and i look leaner than i did last week and i feel like i am ready to lift some heavy shit.

Will update this post later tonight after the gym

Absolutely no side effects at all right now, water intake has been 1.5 gallons a day and will continue as normal.

[rar1015]

Glad to hear its kickin in man. Yeah definetly let us know how you workout goes tonight.......ill be watching for the post.

[CoreyTampa09]

Just curious but, since your diet looks similar to a cutting diet - Im not fully understanding why your doing your 35 minutes of cardio right after your lifts. Do you bring your shake with you to the gym and drink it immediatly after your run, or do you wait even longer to get home. Do you think(other member chime in) the 35 minutes of cardio after your lift could be affecting your gains and muscular growth?

[Papi93]

Great topic. Just a few questions:


Is Hawthorne Berry required for cycles of PP? Same with Niacin. Obviously it would be better to sue it than not, but is their a high risk if it is not used?

Thanks for the help.

Bryan2 has an excellent stickie at the top that will answer all of your questions.

[Panzerfaust]

Had a good workout, realy focused on hitting the chest and proper ROM thanks to this video: http://thefitshow.com/week3/milos_chest_med.htm

I felt as though i did not fatigue as fast as i usually do, Monday is usually a rough day cause i get off at 8am and then am in bed by 9:30am and try to sleep until 3pm, thats not much sleep believe me especially after working 3x12's on 5-6 hours sleep a night.

I am anxious to see what this week entails...


CoreyTampa09:

Yes, i am running a cutting diet and have been doing 32-35 minutes cardio after weights at .75% MHR and of course i bring my PWO and am shaking it and drinking it onm the way to the car but it would not matter if i waited and had it at home.

I am a firm believer in AM cardio but i have been seeing good results this way, and by the way i am not a bodybuilder and have been doing this long enough to not be as anal when it comes to AM vs PM cardio...its a personal choice and people see results both ways.

[CoreyTampa09]

I see, im not on any supplements but i was thinking of adding in a 20 -30 minute run along with my 45 min am cardio after looking to see if it would help burn more fat in my cutting routine. This may sound weird but although Im cutting, im gaining weight but feeling leaner.

[rar1015]

Has you strength been going up that much yet?

[boxingbean]

I am in a hurry here, can i get Niacin OTC like at Wal-Mart, CVS, Walgreens?

ANY NUTRITION STORE, GET SUM TARUINE WHILE YOUR AT IT, YOULL THANK ME LATER

[Panzerfaust]

I see, im not on any supplements but i was thinking of adding in a 20 -30 minute run along with my 45 min am cardio after looking to see if it would help burn more fat in my cutting routine. This may sound weird but although Im cutting, im gaining weight but feeling leaner.

I would not add the running, running is catabolic especially after 45 minutes of cardio. Remember there is such a thing as "over" training. Ifyou have anymore questions, post it in the DIET forum.

[Panzerfaust]

ANY NUTRITION STORE, GET SUM TARUINE WHILE YOUR AT IT, YOULL THANK ME LATER

Sorry but you are a week late giving that advice, thanks anyway!

[Panzerfaust]

Day 9

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Had a good day and felt less tired than normal, made it to the gym a bit later than i had orginally planned. Had a real good workout (Arms/Obliques) and finished up with cardio as normal.

Considering i am not packing on the kCals i am not getting the major strength gains compared to those who bulk but i can tell the difference and my chest is absolutely blown to bits today after yesterday.

I weighed in today at 198lbs (up 2lbs) but am definately looking leaner than last week.

All is going well thus far, no sides whatsoever. Could'nt be happier so far.

[sonar1234]

muriloninja thats pertty good bro, try to get some before and after pics.

If everything goes well i should do my phera plex this mid summer.

Your gains are very encouraging cause i dont plan to bulk up either.

[Panzerfaust]

muriloninja thats pertty good bro, try to get some before and after pics.

If everything goes well i should do my phera plex this mid summer.

Your gains are very encouraging cause i dont plan to bulk up either.

It might be important to add that i am throwing in a few extra Kcals in the form of BBQ sauce on my chicken etc. Nothing major.

Just had some Deer meat with a chicken breast, man that shit is good.

[rar1015]

Dear meat tastes great.
I know you said that you were going to use this more as a cutter right? If that is what your doing even though your up two pounds do you think your starting to reduce some body fat too?

[Panzerfaust]

Dear meat tastes great.
I know you said that you were going to use this more as a cutter right? If that is what your doing even though your up two pounds do you think your starting to reduce some body fat too?

No doubt that is exactly what is happening.

[Panzerfaust]

Day 10

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Had one hell of a shoulder workout today and had to lean on racks just to feel some relief from the pain in my shoulders. Did not do cardio today as i was pressed for time and am helping my g/f move.

Day 11

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Taken today off from the gym to do some housework/bills and help the g/f move. I feel good and my only compaint is that i need to go buy some more gallon water jugs, otherwise i find it hard to get 1.-1.5g in a day. Absolutely no side effects thus far and i feel good.

Diet today is non-existant but that won't kill me. I am sore all over from my workouts this week and loving it.

[rar1015]

Good to hear man!!!

[Panzerfaust]

Day 12

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Had a good day and had a short/intense back workout minus deadlifts (pressed for time) and am headed to work over the weekend so i will not be updating until probably Monday.

Still no sides at all and goddamn i can see my shoulders coming out, last night i got a good angle in a mirror where i could see my back, HOLY SHIT is my back coming along and i was shocked and it took my girlfriend to say "Stop looking at yourself" to get me to stop looking at my new back.
She loves to say "I told you so", hell if i can;t see it how do i know?
I can't wait to lift again on Monday. Lata

[novastepp]

i'm glad it is kicking ass for you. it sounds like you are doing most of the work though i noticed when i did pheraplex that i was lean bulking and i gained strength and size and dropped bf at the same time. so i know you wqill undoubtedly have great succes with it. keep it up bro!

[Papi93]

Day 12

20mg PP
800mg Milk Thistle
1.5g Hawthorne Berry
AX Perfect Cycle
500mg Niacin
1000mcg Vit B-12
500mg Taurin

Had a good day and had a short/intense back workout minus deadlifts (pressed for time) and am headed to work over the weekend so i will not be updating until probably Monday.

Still no sides at all and goddamn i can see my shoulders coming out, last night i got a good angle in a mirror where i could see my back, HOLY SHIT is my back coming along and i was shocked and it took my girlfriend to say "Stop looking at yourself" to get me to stop looking at my new back.
She loves to say "I told you so", hell if i can;t see it how do i know?
I can't wait to lift again on Monday. Lata

It's funny how a lot of women get angry when you look at yourself, in the mirror, to measure your progress. They want all eyes on them. When they are out with you, they like the way you look but just can't understand the dedication it takes to get there. I'm still waiting to find a woman who understands this takes work!

[sonar1234]

It's funny how a lot of women get angry when you look at yourself, in the mirror, to measure your progress. They want all eyes on them. When they are out with you, they like the way you look but just can't understand the dedication it takes to get there. I'm still waiting to find a woman who understands this takes work!

Dont even bother Papi93, girls are funny they dont want you to take stuff to make you look better, but when you do and they see the results they cant get enought.

Damn i cant wait to get my pheraplex cycle going, i lost a huge amount of muscles when i did my protein diet and since i wasnt training i lost even more.

[sonar1234]

I wanna know at the end of the cycle after the pct if all the gains remain, and if you got some nice seperations in the muscles does that remain has well or it sort of does the same thing has when you stop taking say creatine and you see the gains go away gradually?

[Papi93]

I wanna know at the end of the cycle after the pct if all the gains remain, and if you got some nice seperations in the muscles does that remain has well or it sort of does the same thing has when you stop taking say creatine and you see the gains go away gradually?

For me, I have retained my bodyweight and strength. I gained all 14lbs off my first cycle and retained all of the weight. It was not easy because it is challenging at times to keep your caloric intake up, when off-cycle. You have to force yourself to do this though. After your cycle, you could run arimidex , as a natural test booster, to help you retain your gains. 0.5mg for 4 weeks will nearly double your natural test levels. It will, also, cut down on water retention so you will look harder. Through some creatine in there wouldn't hurt for helping retain strength gains.

[sonar1234]

For me, I have retained my bodyweight and strength. I gained all 14lbs off my first cycle and retained all of the weight. It was not easy because it is challenging at times to keep your caloric intake up, when off-cycle. You have to force yourself to do this though. After your cycle, you could run arimidex, as a natural test booster, to help you retain your gains. 0.5mg for 4 weeks will nearly double your natural test levels. It will, also, cut down on water retention so you will look harder. Through some creatine in there wouldn't hurt for helping retain strength gains.

Since i retained so much water and useless bodyweight (FAT) on creatine monohydrate i bought myself some VAULT by san, many guys at my job took this and V12 and add some great muscles gains without the bloated look.

I dont plan on overeating while doing my pheraplex, i would like to get muscle definition more then put on weight.

I am down to 183 pounds now so if i can build up to 190 with good quality weight that will suit me fine.

I am still on the bench right now seeing an osteopath she told me to wait to get a membership at the gym, for now its rehab but i guess that in one month or so i will finally be ready to push serious iron once again.

[novastepp]

For me, I have retained my bodyweight and strength. I gained all 14lbs off my first cycle and retained all of the weight. It was not easy because it is challenging at times to keep your caloric intake up, when off-cycle. You have to force yourself to do this though. After your cycle, you could run arimidex, as a natural test booster, to help you retain your gains. 0.5mg for 4 weeks will nearly double your natural test levels. It will, also, cut down on water retention so you will look harder. Through some creatine in there wouldn't hurt for helping retain strength gains.

papi, good to hear from you man. i miss you, you complete me haha. hey have your views on PCT changed any since the last time i talked to you? i asthinking of ending my natural bulk with pheraplex and was wondering what you would advise. i suppose this is psudo-hijacking and i apologize. i am just intrigued by the arimidex comment you made.

[Papi93]

papi, good to hear from you man. i miss you, you complete me haha. hey have your views on PCT changed any since the last time i talked to you? i asthinking of ending my natural bulk with pheraplex and was wondering what you would advise. i suppose this is psudo-hijacking and i apologize. i am just intrigued by the arimidex comment you made.

I went with a clomid/nolva mix (100mg/20mg) for my PCT. I left out the PCT and Retain (I replaced Retain with Clenbuterol ). After the four weeks of PCT, I am running (currently) 0.5mg of arimidex (liquidex) for 4 weeks and 5g of Creatine Ethyl Ester. I like the arimidex/CEE combo because you don't hold any water from these two. The arimidex will actually reduce water retention.

My libido returned much faster with clomid/nolva mix than it did with nolva alone. Many will disagree but that is my personal experience.

Check your PMs.