Arginine Reduces Natural HGH Production

[Da_Mayor]

In this past months issue of Men's Health and Fitness in the On our Radar section: They had reported a study done by Syracuse University in where 200 males were given an arginine pill before there workouts and then there natural HGH levels were recorded the results were compared with when they worked out (same individuals) without the arginine pill. And the results showed that in all the males they're natural hgh production after they worked out had decreased 50% when they took the arginine compared to when they didn't. Comments/Questions. Because I loved takin super pump 250 before my workouts but I stopped after reading this article its been one week since i stopped using super pump so I dont know if this is true for me or not yet. but it said all the males experienced a 50% decrease in post workout hgh production.

[Pete789]

Well that does it .......I am throwing ot my Arginine...thanks mate!
Pete

[Da_Mayor]

yeah i mean i was just as surprised as you but the way this evidence was reported made me stop takin the arginine. Cause it would be one thing if it stated something along the lines of 35% of the males experienced a 50% decrease, and 15% experienced no decrease, and 35% experienced little decrease. But when a major reputable university such as Syracuse flat out states that every male test subject experienced a 50% post workout decrease then I tend to go with the information and say fuq the arginine

[305GUY]

fack thats not good.. is there a internet link of this study or just in the mag?

[number twelve]

i always thought that taking arginine with ornithine boosted GH production...i have been taking it for the past few weeks and i have had only positive results. i actually feel like im 15. (very high libido)

[rafael]

has anyone repeated this study and gotten compareable results?

[Da_Mayor]

all i know from the article is that this was the only study done. I saw in red barons guide to HGH that glutamine and arginine can increase your natural hgh production. Then i saw this article it wasn't a full page it was just a segment i think on page 72 of the december issue i'll double check to make sure the exact location of the article is correct. but it was only like a paragraph long and stated roughly what i had posted. If any of you research this say google it or something i'd like to hear what you found so post it. And as for the libido increase i'd agree with ya i like takin arginine supplements as well

[Da_Mayor]

Oh and 305, it was just in the mag but it might be on the net

[MuscleScience]

better not take NO-explode or any other NO booster anymore

[bossman_1986]

how can arginine lower hgh?? its an amino acid that helps u grow, its in your food. bcaa supplements have arginine in it and most bodybuilders use it so does that mean we've been training with low levels of hgh our whole lives??

[Ufa]

[edit

[UpstateTank]

so this is false?
http://www.primev.com/Arginine.htm

and this?
http://store.ourhealthcoop.com/Produ...ProductCode=hg

and this?
http://www.hghmagazine.com/archives/l-arginine.html

i think you get where im going with this...

[Schmidty]

I dont beleive that shit

[MuscleScience]

I found a similar study, with arginine and glutamate supplimentation. This is just the abstract and its from 1995 take what you will from it.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Abstract

[MuscleScience]

This one is a newer study, and in a pretty good journal too.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Citation

[bossman_1986]

the people probably made a mistake and mixed up the people who were taking the arginine pill and the people who werent so the people who werent taking the arginine pills are really the ones with the low hgh levels

[number twelve]

Best taken half hour before bedtime. It works. The mag is full of shit.

i take it then and half hour b4 i lift. i love it!

[Logan13]

What the hell? Man I love taking arginine!

[Da_Mayor]

In response to Upstate Tank

Two of those sources you listed are complete bullshit they are supplement stores that are selling arginine or supplements containing arginine. So obviously they are going to tell you "Yeah Arginines Great! You should buy some right now!" And if you were to read more than 3 paragraphs into your other source it states:
"The bottom line on arginine as a viable HGH release agent is not complete. For example, one study from UCLA shows that arginine produces no increase in HGH with exercise and actually may impair HGH release during weight training, (Oral arginine does not stimulate basal or augment exercise-induced GH secretion in either young or old adults, 1999, Marcell)."

So from gathering what everyone has posted and what I have collected is that Arginine increases HGH secretion or the release of HGH but that does not necessarily mean that it increases HGH production.

The study might reflect a decrease in post workout HGH production during arginine consumption because more HGH is being released.

[Da_Mayor]

Exerpt taken from musclesciences link:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...&dopt=Citation

Influence of chronic supplementation of arginine aspartate in endurance athletes on performance and substrate metabolism - a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled study.

Abel T, Knechtle B, Perret C, Eser P, von Arx P, Knecht H.

Institute of Sports Medicine, Swiss Paraplegic Centre, Nottwil.

The intake of arginine aspartate has been shown to increase anabolic hormones like human growth hormone (hGH) and glucagon. The aim of our study was to investigate whether daily intake of two different dosages of arginine asparate during four weeks affects selected parameters of overtraining syndrome like performance, metabolic and endocrine parameters. Thirty male endurance-trained athletes were included in a randomized, double-blind, placebo-controlled study and divided into three groups. During four weeks, they ingested either arginine aspartate with a high concentration (H) of 5.7 g arginine and 8.7 g aspartate, with a low concentration (L) of 2.8 g arginine and 2.2 g aspartate or placebo (P).VO(2)peak and time to exhaustion were determined on a cycling ergometer in an incremental exercise test before and after supplementation. Before and after each incremental exercise test, concentrations of hGH, glucagon, testosterone, cortisol, ferritine, lactate, and urea were measured. Compared to placebo, no significant differences on endurance performance (VO(2)peak, time to exhaustion), endocrine (concentration of hGH, glucagon, cortisol, and testosterone) and metabolic parameters (concentration of lactate, ferritine, and urea) were found after chronic arginine aspartate supplementation. The chronic intake of arginine asparate during four weeks by male endurance athletes showed independent of dosage no influence on performance, selected metabolic or endocrine parameters. Consequently, there seems to be no apparent reason why the supplementation of arginine aspartate should be an effective ergogenic aid. The practice of using arginine aspartate as potential ergogenics should be critically reevaluated. Further investigations with higher dosage and extended supplementation periods should be performed.

[AnabolicBoy1981]

this is suprizing. after years of taking it to boost my hgh. i guess i must have been screwing myself. bummer.

but, maybe not. maybe there is a diff when you take b4 bed as apposed pre workout

[bossman_1986]

ive noticed that when i supplement with arginine i get harder and bigger hard-ons, thats one of the reasons i take it

as long as it doesnt reduce hgh i would keep taking it

so is it really true that it reduces hgh?? cuz i dont get how it would

[Ufa]

edit

[MuscleScience]

ive noticed that when i supplement with arginine i get harder and bigger hard-ons, thats one of the reasons i take it

as long as it doesnt reduce hgh i would keep taking it

so is it really true that it reduces hgh?? cuz i dont get how it would

It makes sense that it might, Arginine has a Nitrous Oxide group on it that is split off by an enzymatic process. This free NO group then moves the to the lining of the arterial blood vessels and causes the smooth muscles around the vessels to relax causing vaso dilation. Thats why you get a pumped up feeling and a increase in hard-ons. HgG is controlled by a feedback loop, if you have excesses any were in this loop it triggers the body to shut down the pathway. This is what some of the papers are concluding with the findings. For me though I still think it needs to be further investigated as most of the authors conclude. I will still take my NO because of the muscle pump, I dont think Hgh is that big a deal for a very short term drop that last an hour or so. If it perminately made it drop then yeah I would surely discontinue the products.

[korexite]

interesting discussion.

perhaps the difference in results lies in the times taken (workout v.s. before bed)

[AnabolicBoy1981]

I take ornithine & arginie one half hour before bedtime. I think it would
help to try these pro hormones that are available at most health food
stores. Just see for your self. There are dozens of articles that will
state a case for or against any think you can think of.

Be your own Doctor. I found out about these be reading "Ant Aging
Revolution by Dr. Ronald Klatz 'President of American Academy of Anti-
Aging & Dr. Robert Goldman, 'President of National Academe of Sports
Medicine.

The interesting thing is they promote this in their book. I bot some for
big bucks read the label and now buy from a Health Food Store.

It won't melt fat like the IGF in GH does. However, skin, finger nails, hair
general health seem to be much better.

It is also used as a bridge when cycleing GH.

Who knows you might save big bucks by using stuff you can get for
$20 or $30 a bottle.

:O i just finished that book 3 days ago!lol

actually i was a lil disapointed in it. i thought it would have more about the actual hormone replacement,maybe some sample patients etc. it had alota stuff bout aminos which was fine, , but when they had all those herb profiles, eh, i lost interest.
i think those two(goldman and klatze) like to see if they can keep pumping out another book.
they wrote one book together called "steroidss:death in the locker room". i would like to see that book. especially since goldman set many strength records in his past. I cant see how he could be against steroids. but that is tangential to this thread. Back to the issue....uh, i think as i stated b4, arginines actions are most likely different from post workout than pre-bedtime. though arginine may have on of those effects where just as big a spike it initially produces, so follows an equal reduction in gh. Much like the studies done on testosterone secretion after intense workouts. findings show the test out put is high several hours after, but then so rises cortisol just as great. its the bodies/natures balancing act. we can hardly ever win........but everyday, is a step closer

[onlyatest]

wow. i take arginine and gaba a 30 hour before and it feels incredible. very very relaxing and very cheap.

[chest6]

Hm..conflicting ideas in this thread.

I take arginine pretty heavily at times...its awesome stuff

dont wanna stop

[wanescotting]

HA! Well lets see here, I take 15 - 20 grams of arginine(with ornithine)a day, and use N.O. Shotgun pre workout. I love the stuff!

BTW, what kind of "workouts" were these individuals doing? Cardio only, free weights? Both?

[bossman_1986]

[UpstateTank]

In the most recent Fitness Rx Magazine...Pg. 38
"Arginine Not as Good Before Weight Training"

Growth Hormone is a proven fat figther and muscle builder and is popular with many weightlifters and aging adults. Unfortunately, daily injections of growth hormone are expensive and inconvenient. Many oral supplements sold on the Internet claim to increase growth hormone levels, but few scientific studies support their use. Researchers from Syracuse University found that combining arginine supplements with weight training increased blood hormone levels. Oral arginine, by itself, also increases growth hormone, but not as much as when it was combined with weight training. This study did not show that oral arginine supplements increased muscle size or strength, but it supported the effectiveness of oral growth hormone boosters. It's doubtful that boosting growth hormone with oral supplements is as effective as injected growth hormone. (Journal Applied Physiology, 101:848-852, 2006)

[UpstateTank]

[Kaioken]

Ornithine With Carnitine increases GH
Ornithine basically functions vis similar pathways of Arginine

so I think this Arginine Scare is bullshit
the only issue Argine ever had was possibly being pro oxidive in high doses, and if you have a sexually transmitted disease it may flare it up..

[bossman_1986]

In the most recent Fitness Rx Magazine...Pg. 38
"Arginine Not as Good Before Weight Training"

Growth Hormone is a proven fat figther and muscle builder and is popular with many weightlifters and aging adults. Unfortunately, daily injections of growth hormone are expensive and inconvenient. Many oral supplements sold on the Internet claim to increase growth hormone levels, but few scientific studies support their use. Researchers from Syracuse University found that combining arginine supplements with weight training increased blood hormone levels. Oral arginine, by itself, also increases growth hormone, but not as much as when it was combined with weight training. This study did not show that oral arginine supplements increased muscle size or strength, but it supported the effectiveness of oral growth hormone boosters. It's doubtful that boosting growth hormone with oral supplements is as effective as injected growth hormone. (Journal Applied Physiology, 101:848-852, 2006)

so now it doesnt lower gh?? what the fuk is going on with these studies

[UpstateTank]

so now it doesnt lower gh?? what the fuk is going on with these studies

I think it was bs to begin with...never had I heard that arginine reduces gh, and that proved it!

It is kind of strange how the initial study posted was from SU, and so was the one in mine...

I live in syracuse so maybe I'll go take a ride up to the university and find out what the f is goin on