Am I burning muscle?

**luxur** · 05-27-2008, 12:19 PM

I do one muscle group per day with 45 sec rest between sets, then i hop right away on the eliptic machine for 30 mins. My heart rate is about 130-140 during weight training, and when i start cardio for fat burn, i cant get it to go lower than 135 unless i slow to a stop almost. Im 35 so target heart rate for fat burn is about 120. Am I burning muscle? since im closer to cardio heart rate than fat burn.

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 12:23 PM

you have a chance of doing that, try drinking a protein shake with 50g of protein right after you workout out before you do cardio, like workout-drink shake- do cardio, this will keep help keep your body from burning muscle and you won't burn the calories in the shake if it's close to pure protein as your body much perfers burning fat than protein since it's harder to break down

another trick is adding 8 -12oz of coffee to your protein shake, one study i read stated that 6-8 oz of coffee before cardio will help keep your body from burning off muscle

hope that helps

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 12:27 PM

man i get my heartrate up to 190 sometime doing cardio! im 24 though... so i guess its ok. hope im not burning muscle

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 12:56 PM

at 190 your in an anaerobic state, meaning your gasping for air and your body is using glycogen as it's main fuel source, are you doing HIIT training or just going high intensity

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 01:06 PM

Hiit

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 01:20 PM

you shouldn't be, i wouldn't do that on an empty stomach unless i had some protein in me, but that's just me

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 01:37 PM

protien shake before cardio? I would get mad cramps running i bet

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 01:53 PM

i don't, just drink one and wait 10 minutes before you go run

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 01:56 PM

ill give it a try phate... how about a low carb protien bar?

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 01:58 PM

would be okay i guess, i like the drink because i try to get 40-50g of protein in before i do cardio and i can do that with about 8 carbs with a drink but with a bar it would take alot more

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 02:00 PM

sounds good. give it a shot today

**Johny-too-small** · 05-27-2008, 02:16 PM

Coffee is anti-catabolic? No, thats not true.

On topic:
Poster, hard cardio like what youre doing is not the best option. What do you think the body is using for fuel? Its not fat, thats for sure. When you do cardio, you should not go too hard. You should still be able to breath through your nose.

As far a drinking whey b4 cardio, it does not matter at all. You dont have to, but if you do then Id sip it, not down it.

Cardio is for your heart, not for strickly getting leaner. Diet is the main factor in dictating your bf%. If your diet is spot on, you dont need to do more than 10 minutes of cardio for your heart (as I described) PWO.

Good luck.

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 02:19 PM

diet is tits on... if i run at like 6mph on the treadmill for 45 min my heartrate is around 150 and i breath through my nose the whole time. the one time I did do HIIT my heart rate was like 180. prob cause i was sprinting at 12 then walking then sprinting

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by Johny-too-small

Coffee is anti-catabolic? No, thats not true.

On topic:
Poster, hard cardio like what youre doing is not the best option. What do you think the body is using for fuel? Its not fat, thats for sure. When you do cardio, you should not go too hard. You should still be able to breath through your nose.

As far a drinking whey b4 cardio, it does not matter at all. You dont have to, but if you do then Id sip it, not down it.

Cardio is for your heart, not for strickly getting leaner. Diet is the main factor in dictating your bf%. If your diet is spot on, you dont need to do more than 10 minutes of cardio for your heart (as I described) PWO.

Good luck.

i was kinda skeptical as well but it was in a study so i figured i'd trust it

**Johny-too-small** · 05-27-2008, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by chopper9451

diet is tits on... if i run at like 6mph on the treadmill for 45 min my heartrate is around 150 and i breath through my nose the whole time. the one time I did do HIIT my heart rate was like 180. prob cause i was sprinting at 12 then walking then sprinting

Really? And you think its okay to eat protein bars? Sorry, youre diet is not what you think it is.

Anyway, this thread is getting hijacked..

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 02:33 PM

NEVER eat protien bars actually. was gonna check out what they had at the counter in the gym. thought maybe i could sub it for a shake cause i get cramps easy even if I drink too much water before cardio

**GT2** · 05-27-2008, 06:56 PM

Take 2 grams of BCAA tablets before your cardio, as well as 500mg of vitamin C (I read a study that showed vitamin C is a good muscle-sparing supplement before cardio).
That way, you can be pretty sure you won't be tapping into muscle for fuel, but rather fat.

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by Hamish&Andy

Take 2 grams of BCAA tablets before your cardio, as well as 500mg of vitamin C (I read a study that showed vitamin C is a good muscle-sparing supplement before cardio).
That way, you can be pretty sure you won't be tapping into muscle for fuel, but rather fat.

vit C huh? havent heard that? you read it online? only did 25min cardio today. gonna stick with that instead of 45 and see how things go

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 07:15 PM

if your really afraid of losing muscle, why not do 45-60 minutes of low intensity walking at an incline, it's aerobic so it burns more fat than glycogen and has very little chance of burning muscle

**DSM4Life** · 05-27-2008, 07:16 PM

When i do HIIT i allow my heart rate to get up to about 180. I also take in a good meal before (carbs/protein).

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 07:25 PM

today i was around 120 walking and 170 when i sprinted. did about 1-2 min of each alternating. had a shake and good carbs before i headed to the gym, but nothing between lifting and cardio

**luxur** · 05-27-2008, 07:53 PM

i do low intensity cardio, but my HR is already high when i get to the machine. I figured since it takes about 10-15 mins low intensity cardio to tap in fat reserves (since i keep HR to 120-130 while doing weights for 45 min) when i hit the machine i go straight to the fat stores. Thats how i figured it anyway dont know if it makes sense. Any of you hijackers have an opinion

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 09:15 PM

sorry bout the hijacking, though it wasn't all bad, there was good info in there, anyway, it takes 15-20 minutes of continuous low intensity to tap into fat stores

**luxur** · 05-27-2008, 10:04 PM

just joking about the hijack, yes it did

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 10:11 PM

what do you consider low intensity. like a steep walk at 3mph or a slow continuous job at 5mph?

**Phate** · 05-27-2008, 10:24 PM

my low intensity is a walk at 3.0-4.0mph on about the highest incline the treadmill can go, just make sure your not using your arms to hang on, keep your arms bent and lean into the walk, i do that for anywhere from 45-90minutes depending on whether i will be doing a workout and another cardio session later in the day

**luxur** · 05-27-2008, 11:11 PM

Shouldnt the intensity be determined by your HR through out the cardio session? The machine says i should keep my HR at 120 for fat burning maximisation. But even at 140 i breath through the nose still. My point being; me waling at 3-4 miles an hour and an athlete there would be a huge diffrence in our percived intensity. Making any sense?

**chopper9451** · 05-27-2008, 11:25 PM

Well i know that i have been laid off from our jobsite for almost a month and when i go back next week im gonna kick the cardio cause runnin my a$$ for 10hours a day doin concrete is plenty of cardio for me

**Phate** · 05-28-2008, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by luxur

Shouldnt the intensity be determined by your HR through out the cardio session? The machine says i should keep my HR at 120 for fat burning maximisation. But even at 140 i breath through the nose still. My point being; me waling at 3-4 miles an hour and an athlete there would be a huge diffrence in our percived intensity. Making any sense?

there are three main types of cardio IMO,

low intensity aerobic, which means you are using oxygen and therefore burning more fat, you should be able to hold a conversation without having to gasp for air in this type of cardio, i walk at an incline to accomplish this

high intensity anaerobic, this is like running at a fast pace for 20-30 minutes and uses mostly glycogen for an energy source, you burn more calories than in aerobic, but the majority are from glycogen and you will be gasping for air and unable to hold a conversation during this

HIIT(high intensity interval training), this is a mix of the last two, personally i do a 5 minute warmup on an elliptical then do 30 seconds at 80-90% of my maximum effort by increasing resistance as well as increasing how fast i stride, then do 1 minute at 50% by decreasing resistance and decreasing stride, i do this for a total of 15-20 minutes then a 4-5 minute cool down, this cardio increases metabolic rate for 24 hours and has been shown to put the body in a more anabolic state, though it should only be utilized 3-4x a week at most as it is very tiring if you do it right