Anyone else only about to failure once?

[jdog55]

Many many workout guides say train to failure on this set and that set and that set. Is anyone else like me and find this impossible?

For example,

If I do 1 set of 10 reps to failure on the bench press, then my bench press is done. I can even lower the weight but i would only be able to do like 2 reps on any of the other sets.

Also going to failure on my bench press makes my dips and other chest exercises much much harder to do.

Just seeing if anyone is like me...

[eatrainrest]

i do all my workouts at 100 percent intensity unless its a cool off week where i do about 80%. NEVER GO OVER 100 PERCENT (past failure)

[nbaylot33]

i do all my workouts at 100 percent intensity unless its a cool off week where i do about 80%. NEVER GO OVER 100 PERCENT (past failure)

I dunno about that comment. If you do only 100% every time your body is just going to be good at that exercise at that weight. Trying for extra is always the key to growing and getting stronger. Just don't rush it and don't try to much weight or you could hurt yourself.

[jdog55]

Ok, found a way to explain it better. Here is the slingshot program.

BLAST PYRAMIDING SAMPLES FOR ONCE A WEEK MUSCLE TRAINING

Sample using 2 exercises for 12 sets during 8-12 week anabolic blast when training each muscle once a week

1st exercise is a key exercise-15 degree barbell decline press
PREP SET- 4-8 reps (2 reps short of failure)-wait an extra minute than usual before going to 1st work set
1st set 4-6 reps (heavy set) to failure
2nd set 8-10 reps to failure
3rd set 8-10 reps to failure
4th set 8-10 reps to failure
5th set 8-10 reps to failure
6th set 12-15 reps to failure




See all this set to failure? If you go to failure one set one and have to have a buddy take the bar off your chest during your bench....

The the next set of 8-12 reps to failure will be more like 2 reps then your muscle gives.

Know what I mean?

[eatrainrest]

I dunno about that comment. If you do only 100% every time your body is just going to be good at that exercise at that weight. Trying for extra is always the key to growing and getting stronger. Just don't rush it and don't try to much weight or you could hurt yourself.

i disagree, anything over 100 percent is risking injury which you dont want to have. the fact is by working in the proper rep range at 100% with proper form, you will see results and there is no need to go over that risking injury and putting alot of tensiona nd pressure on the joints.

what do you mean your body is just going to be good at that exercise at that weight? you will increase in strength with that exercise given the proper rep ranges, not sure where your coming form with that comment.

your 2nd comment i highlighted does not make sense otherwise overtraining would be non existant.

[eatrainrest]

Ok, found a way to explain it better. Here is the slingshot program.

BLAST PYRAMIDING SAMPLES FOR ONCE A WEEK MUSCLE TRAINING

Sample using 2 exercises for 12 sets during 8-12 week anabolic blast when training each muscle once a week

1st exercise is a key exercise-15 degree barbell decline press
PREP SET- 4-8 reps (2 reps short of failure)-wait an extra minute than usual before going to 1st work set
1st set 4-6 reps (heavy set) to failure
2nd set 8-10 reps to failure
3rd set 8-10 reps to failure
4th set 8-10 reps to failure
5th set 8-10 reps to failure
6th set 12-15 reps to failure

btw failure means 100% not having a spotter give you 2 extra reps




See all this set to failure? If you go to failure one set one and have to have a buddy take the bar off your chest during your bench....

The the next set of 8-12 reps to failure will be more like 2 reps then your muscle gives.

Know what I mean?

comments in bold

[nbaylot33]

i disagree, anything over 100 percent is risking injury which you dont want to have. the fact is by working in the proper rep range at 100% with proper form, you will see results and there is no need to go over that risking injury and putting alot of tensiona nd pressure on the joints.

what do you mean your body is just going to be good at that exercise at that weight? you will increase in strength with that exercise given the proper rep ranges, not sure where your coming form with that comment.

your 2nd comment i highlighted does not make sense otherwise overtraining would be non existant.

ok..... 100% changes when your body rebuilds from tearing down. I think we are thinking the same way just saying it different. Say if you did 100 lbs on bench at 10 reps and your body tears down and repairs and the next time you got stronger and can do 105 lbs for 10 reps you did more than 100% of that rep range and now your 100% is 105lbs..... Plus I don't think going to failure on some exercises is bad, like the smaller muscles but I agree something like squats and deads should not go to failure. As long as you have a spotter that is watching pretty close you shouldn't get hurt. When I ment that you will get better at that exercise... If you do pull ups and can only do one it will take a whole lot longer to get two if you don't have a partner that could help you with another, you will just get better at doing one pull up, is that a better answer? Thats why muscles break down and repair because the body has done something that it is not use to and adjust to the new weight but if you keep doing the same weight your body will just stay the same but get better at it.

[eatrainrest]

ok..... 100% changes when your body rebuilds from tearing down. I think we are thinking the same way just saying it different. Say if you did 100 lbs on bench at 10 reps and your body tears down and repairs and the next time you got stronger and can do 105 lbs for 10 reps you did more than 100% of that rep range and now your 100% is 105lbs..... Plus I don't think going to failure on some exercises is bad, like the smaller muscles but I agree something like squats and deads should not go to failure. As long as you have a spotter that is watching pretty close you shouldn't get hurt. When I ment that you will get better at that exercise... If you do pull ups and can only do one it will take a whole lot longer to get two if you don't have a partner that could help you with another, you will just get better at doing one pull up, is that a better answer? Thats why muscles break down and repair because the body has done something that it is not use to and adjust to the new weight but if you keep doing the same weight your body will just stay the same but get better at it.

THIS ABOUT SUMS IT UP...
"the effect of intensity on the muscle tissue can be likened to breaking and repairing a pencil lead; by constantly training beyong failure, you are taking a hammer and shmashing the actin and myosin (pencil lead) amking it very difficult, if not impossible to repair.

do not train beyond failure or performing forced reps, as this may disallow the performance of the same number of reps set to set"

ok so what have we learned?? do not train beyond failure.. instead use the overload training principle. for example, if you are training for strength and size 4-6 rep range will maximize white twitch muscle fibers. by choosing a weight you can do 100% INTENSITY 4 good controlled reps, once you hit 6 reps of that weight advance the weight. never go beyond failure, regardless of what anyone says. the body was not meant to train beyond failure

[Alphatier]

I always go to failure, and my strength is always improving, even when cutting(exercise dependant).

I don't like finishing a set, knowing there was more in me to give(1-2 more reps)

[Alphatier]

Thou I don't do negative reps, forced reps, etc......maybe drop sets or super-sets

[nbaylot33]

THIS ABOUT SUMS IT UP...
"the effect of intensity on the muscle tissue can be likened to breaking and repairing a pencil lead; by constantly training beyong failure, you are taking a hammer and shmashing the actin and myosin (pencil lead) amking it very difficult, if not impossible to repair.

do not train beyond failure or performing forced reps, as this may disallow the performance of the same number of reps set to set"

ok so what have we learned?? do not train beyond failure.. instead use the overload training principle. for example, if you are training for strength and size 4-6 rep range will maximize white twitch muscle fibers. by choosing a weight you can do 100% INTENSITY 4 good controlled reps, once you hit 6 reps of that weight advance the weight. never go beyond failure, regardless of what anyone says. the body was not meant to train beyond failure

Never said do it every time but it is useful. And If your talking about fast twitch muscles, explosive training is the best for it (hince sprinters having larger muscles than endurance runners). The body was made for adapting. You can lift beyond your limit of your current abilities that is why you GET stronger not because you keep doing the same weight every time. And training for size is not necessarily 4-6 reps again HST training does not use that and it has been proven to work.

[nbaylot33]

Ok, found a way to explain it better. Here is the slingshot program.

BLAST PYRAMIDING SAMPLES FOR ONCE A WEEK MUSCLE TRAINING

Sample using 2 exercises for 12 sets during 8-12 week anabolic blast when training each muscle once a week

1st exercise is a key exercise-15 degree barbell decline press
PREP SET- 4-8 reps (2 reps short of failure)-wait an extra minute than usual before going to 1st work set
1st set 4-6 reps (heavy set) to failure
2nd set 8-10 reps to failure
3rd set 8-10 reps to failure
4th set 8-10 reps to failure
5th set 8-10 reps to failure
6th set 12-15 reps to failure




See all this set to failure? If you go to failure one set one and have to have a buddy take the bar off your chest during your bench....

The the next set of 8-12 reps to failure will be more like 2 reps then your muscle gives.

Know what I mean?

Sorry pimp didn't mean to hijack your thread with an argument. I don't quite understand the 8-10 reps to failure if you got 10 reps thats not failure. But I would strongly suggest not to go to failure each time. But I like to try for more weight each week if I fail or not on the last set.

[eatrainrest]

Never said do it every time but it is useful. And If your talking about fast twitch muscles, explosive training is the best for it (hince sprinters having larger muscles than endurance runners). The body was made for adapting. You can lift beyond your limit of your current abilities that is why you GET stronger not because you keep doing the same weight every time. And training for size is not necessarily 4-6 reps again HST training does not use that and it has been proven to work.

these methods as well have been "proven". lets get this straight, in exercise science there is no proven method. with that being said its all preference and how relatively you see results.

white twitch mucsle fibers (type 2b), yes sprintres use alot of white twitch muscle fibers hence, short bursts. white twitch muscle fibers have very few capillaries and because of the absense of this nutrient rich blood supply, they cannot function for very long periods of times as opposed to red fast and red slow fibers.

white twitch are greatly connected with strength gains and are used in lower rep ranges. this has the greatest effect on the myofibril. the controlled damage and repair of the actin and myosin ist he key to optimizing myofibril growth.

who ever stated saying with the same weight? i dont think you understand the overload training principle too well, or what i stated for that matter, "lifting beyond current abilities" is gradually moving up in the weights with proper form. progress will ersult on diet/traning/stress/sleep/etc. the fact is the risk of injury is so much higher and stresses too much. by training past failure you will eventually burn out and an injury is much more likely to occur. so why risk it when its not necessary??

[nbaylot33]

Like I was saying before 100% changes. We are saying the same thing I guess. I also agree that there is no certain way to get the best results. We should just tell him "Do what works" lol. Our definition of failure might be different as well. My failure means If you can get 10 reps at 100 lbs and try for 105 and get 8 but your partner helps you on 2 to get 10 you have gone past failure to inhibit more growth.

[nbaylot33]

A strength training principle which states that the intensity of exercise must be high enough above normal for physiological adaptation to occur. In other words, if you want to see results when lifting weights, you have to lift more than your muscles can handle. That overload will cause the muscle fibers to grow stronger and, sometimes, bigger in order to handle the extra load.

That is the def. of overload principle and that is exactly what I have been saying.

[eatrainrest]

its all good, just as general advice, i would never say go beyong failure as many people reading these threads will and in turn an injury may occur

[nbaylot33]

Lol we hijacked this thread the dude isn't even responding anymore

[eatrainrest]

its alright, its now our thread lol, hey at least we had good educated debates to inform people, and it wasnt flaming back and forth..love that stuff.. OP where are youu???

[nbaylot33]

I love talking to intelligent people. I just don't get to talk like that to people in the gym. its sad

[eatrainrest]

I love talking to intelligent people. I just don't get to talk like that to people in the gym. its sad

haha i dont talk to anybody in the gym im in the zone...

[nbaylot33]

Yea just my partner. It's usually back to my mudvayne/pantera if somebody comes up to me.

[eatrainrest]

bro i neeed a workout partner desparetely if your ever in jersey lol

[nbaylot33]

Lol it will be awhile before I head back north.

[collar]

is there people in the gym?
shit next time i go in i should really look whats around me.

[nbaylot33]

Ha I wish!!!! It's wayyyyy to packed in the gym here. I'm at Miss State and I use the university gym plus summer is here.

[eatrainrest]

i am convinced im at the best gym.. blue collar shitload of free weight/barbells/machines all black and white old school guys not armani sunglasses with jeans and boots (very common in north jersey, and it pisses me off lek go home what are you doing working out), anyway see what you have me talking about now??

[nbaylot33]

Yeah we have alot of "New hair cut guys" lol

[M302_Imola]

Big, ban this dude!!!!!!!!!

Nevermind, you must have because his post just disappeared! lol

[Hunter-S-Thompson]

i am convinced im at the best gym.. blue collar shitload of free weight/barbells/machines all black and white old school guys not armani sunglasses with jeans and boots (very common in north jersey, and it pisses me off lek go home what are you doing working out), anyway see what you have me talking about now??

hey where do u train at in north jersey? im lookin 4a better gym mine was OK before it got rediculously crowded

[Iron_Pig]

Same at gym here they walk in with there blackberry's and such and park there ass on the machine you need next texting.

[Voland]

I don't train to failure anymore.

[MACKATTACK]

Yeah we have alot of "New hair cut guys" lol

Honestly I HATE that shit. I am sicilian Italian and those kids have to be the biggest fags (no offense to anyone). But they are Ecto's and take Dbols to blow up, yes they have low BF% but NO MASS and its so obvious and that shit pisses me off for some reason.

[selvanus]

I dont know about anyone else, but to me going to failure means doing the absolute most that i can do safely and in good form. If you read the Slingshot training method, it says the same thing. If you have to have help with a rep or have to sacrifice your form to finish it, the you haven't gone to failure, you've gone past failure and that's when you get hurt.

[eatrainrest]

hey where do u train at in north jersey? im lookin 4a better gym mine was OK before it got rediculously crowded

strong and shapely.. best gym on the east coast lol

[eatrainrest]

hunter where are you a member?

[eatrainrest]

I dont know about anyone else, but to me going to failure means doing the absolute most that i can do safely and in good form. If you read the Slingshot training method, it says the same thing. If you have to have help with a rep or have to sacrifice your form to finish it, the you haven't gone to failure, you've gone past failure and that's when you get hurt.

yes thats been covered already lol

[Hunter-S-Thompson]

hunter where are you a member?

right now im at retro fitness but im lookin for another gym since i moved, i got a 2 week pass to LA fitness, it doesnt seem like too bad of a place... if you want PM me where your gym is, ive never heard of it before, but sounds interesting, a gym with no "my new haircut" guys lol

[VASCULAR VINCE]

Ok, found a way to explain it better. Here is the slingshot program.

BLAST PYRAMIDING SAMPLES FOR ONCE A WEEK MUSCLE TRAINING

Sample using 2 exercises for 12 sets during 8-12 week anabolic blast when training each muscle once a week

1st exercise is a key exercise-15 degree barbell decline press
PREP SET- 4-8 reps (2 reps short of failure)-wait an extra minute than usual before going to 1st work set
1st set 4-6 reps (heavy set) to failure
2nd set 8-10 reps to failure
3rd set 8-10 reps to failure
4th set 8-10 reps to failure
5th set 8-10 reps to failure
6th set 12-15 reps to failure




See all this set to failure? If you go to failure one set one and have to have a buddy take the bar off your chest during your bench....

The the next set of 8-12 reps to failure will be more like 2 reps then your muscle gives.

Know what I mean?

ronnie explained that slingshot pyramiding... is comparable to the pyramiding scheme arnold the man used to get massive muscles....lots of intense sets but don't strain yourself silly.....looks like bodybuilding should be approached not like power-lifting..the slingshot training system is the best bodybuilding plan out there imo.....

[Ronnie Rowland]

ronnie explained that slingshot pyramiding... is comparable to the pyramiding scheme arnold the man used to get massive muscles....lots of intense sets but don't strain yourself silly.....looks like bodybuilding should be approached not like power-lifting..the slingshot training system is the best bodybuilding plan out there imo.....

You are correct vince!

[Swifto]

THIS ABOUT SUMS IT UP...
"the effect of intensity on the muscle tissue can be likened to breaking and repairing a pencil lead; by constantly training beyong failure, you are taking a hammer and shmashing the actin and myosin (pencil lead) amking it very difficult, if not impossible to repair.

do not train beyond failure or performing forced reps, as this may disallow the performance of the same number of reps set to set"

ok so what have we learned?? do not train beyond failure.. instead use the overload training principle. for example, if you are training for strength and size 4-6 rep range will maximize white twitch muscle fibers. by choosing a weight you can do 100% INTENSITY 4 good controlled reps, once you hit 6 reps of that weight advance the weight. never go beyond failure, regardless of what anyone says. the body was not meant to train beyond failure

This goes against anyone that has had results from training HIT and going beyond failure. It works as I'm doing it and bodybuilders do it with amazing results.

"the body was not meant to train beyond failure", therfore it adapts, strengthens and grows.