Please see what you think of my second cycle & advise how I can reduce bloating

[mick86]

Week -1````D-bol 30mg pd
Week 1`````D-bol 30mg pd Test E 1000mg pw & Deca 800mg pw
Week 2-3```D-bol 30mg pd Test E 500mg pw & Deca 400mg pw
Week 4-8```Test E 500mg pw & Deca 400mg pw
Week 9-10``Test E 500mg pw
Week 11-15`Tamoxifen 20mg pd & Aromasin 25mg pd & Vitamin C 1.5g pd
Week 16````Tamoxifen 20mg pd & Vitamin C 1.5g pd

>>Note : The reason im starting the D-bol 1 week before the cycle (week -1) and running it by itself is that I got it from a new source & want to see if it is legit.<<

Also Ill be taking

Vitamin B6 at 200mg pd taken throughout cycle
Possibly use Mirtzapine from week 11-16 at a low dose 7.5-15 mg pd
Use Nizoral 2% throughout cycle every 2-4 days

Legend

pw=per week
pd=per day
mg=milligrams
g=grams

Explanation of some what obscure substances used in PCT

vitamin B6 for progesterone control
Vitamin C for cortisol control
Mirtzapine for cortisol control
Nizoral just in case, I don't know if I'm prone to losing my hair

Quick stats

Age - 21 (22 in just over a month)
Height - 173cm
Weight - 80kg BF around 13%
Cycle experience - 1 test/deca cycle 10 months ago

For a more detailed stats and history you can view my picture thread

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=335049

Questions

Hey, I realise this post is getting long so thanks for sticking with me. I have a few questions.

Is this cycle and PCT looking ok?

How can I limit/reduce bloating, especially with the Dianabol ?

I'm still waiting on the Aromasin, if it doesnt arrive can I substitute it for Armidex? If so what would I then do about the Tamoxifen because I believe that Aromasin and Tamoxifen dont work well together. Would I just take the Tamoxifen out or replace it with something else?

[mick86]

Any responses greatly appreciated....

[Yaroslav]

I used to get bloated all the time, but in my last Test/Deca /Dbol cycle i was taking Letro at .25 EOD. Worked wonders for me. BTW, Dbol was dosed at 50mg/day

[D-Unit 39]

Looks like a well thought out and well planned second cycle to me.

[Big]

For starters, I need to know what ester test. You show running the test through week 10 and pct starting at week 11, but if you are using a long ester or blend with long esters (test e, test c, sust, omnadren , etc.) then you are not allowing time for the test to clear your system prior to starting pct.
As for reducing bloating, you could run arimidex at .25 eod as needed.

[mick86]

For starters, I need to know what ester test. You show running the test through week 10 and pct starting at week 11, but if you are using a long ester or blend with long esters (test e, test c, sust, omnadren , etc.) then you are not allowing time for the test to clear your system prior to starting pct.
As for reducing bloating, you could run arimidex at .25 eod as needed.

Oops yeah I forgot to mention that its enanthate . I have read conflicting info about how much time to leave between the end of the cycle and commencing pct. How many weeks would you suggest big? Iv heard 3-4 in the past.

Arimidex sounds like a good idea, im aware that tamoxifen (or any serm ) would be a bad choice with the deca as its a 19-nor. Hopefully at the dose you suggested bloating would be reduced without affecting the gains to much. Actually I already have some aromasin on order from ar-r , could i substitute that, if that at what dose?

[mick86]

For starters, I need to know what ester test. You show running the test through week 10 and pct starting at week 11, but if you are using a long ester or blend with long esters (test e, test c, sust, omnadren , etc.) then you are not allowing time for the test to clear your system prior to starting pct.
As for reducing bloating, you could run arimidex at .25 eod as needed.

Big In regards to waiting a few weeks after the cycle to commence PCT I based my PCT on the information found in the following thread by Anthony Roberts. What are your thoughts on the below theory?

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=209758

Here is where Anthony Roberts explains why he doesn't believe that you should wait to commence PCT.

"With this PCT, there will be a rapid increase in LH, FSH, and testosterone, as well as almost a complete block on all the factors that could be causing your natural hormones to be delayed in returning to baseline. For this reason, I feel that the second your cycle is over is when you should start this PCT (a week after your last shot, or the day after your last pill is fine). Remember, waiting for some of the extra androgens you’ve been taking to leave your body is nonsensical, as we want to start recovery as soon as possible to retain maximum gains. There is no evidence to suggest waiting any length of time after your cycle is over will increase PCT effectiveness…it simply prolongs the time you aren’t doing anything positive to regain your natural hormones."

Does anyone have any input on the questions I asked about my PCT in the above post?

[duggadoo]

Test E take about 2 weeks to clear out so he sayin just let the test clear then start pct so you body will respond to the pct better, i believe...correct me if im wrong on that

[mick86]

Test E take about 2 weeks to clear out so he sayin just let the test clear then start pct so you body will respond to the pct better, i believe...correct me if im wrong on that

Yes I believe thats right but there is conflicting information about whether its of any benifet to wait for the test to completely clear your system. Anthony Robert's said "it simply prolongs the time you aren’t doing anything positive to regain your natural hormones."

Also my order of Aromasin arrived today so that solves the issue I had about what to do if it it didn't arrive. I would still like to know what people think about the issue though and get some advice on what dosage I could take the aromasin at to reduce bloating without affecting my gains to much.

[hauss man]

if your so worried about bloating, then why wouldn't you run different shit? actually you picked some of the worse shit to run if your worried about bloat.

[mick86]

Well I actually already had the test and deca put aside from last year so it seemed logical to use them. What I diddn't count on was a new woman coming into my life so I'm trying to avoid scaring her by looking like the moon while on cycle.

[orton4]

well this is obvious... but seriously watch your sodium and sugar intake... but running adex at .25 eod should def help like BIG had mentioned

[mick86]

Thanks, yeah im going to be very careful with sugar and salt. Im usually careful anyway but consume salt, maltodextrin and dextrose after training in my post workout shake. I also tend to have some maltodextrin and dextrose in my morning shake as well. I assume that I can continue to do this and just be ultra strict at all other times.

Although I can get armidex if its far more appropriate, I already have some aromasin (arrived from ar-r today) so was hoping I could just use that. Is the equivalent dose 20mg eod?

[200byjune]

your not running deca long enough

[mick86]

Hmm......Iv heard people say that it should be run for 12 weeks minimum but then other people also say that cycles should be short in duration and heavy hitting, that way you saturate your AR receptors while they are absorbent and finish before effects diminish. This is also meant to aid in a quick recovery to normal hormonal function.

Also I thought that as I was front loading it would eliminate the need to run the deca so long, after all isnt the main reason that people recommend running deca for 12 weeks because it usually takes a while for blood levels to rise and deca's results come slow and steady so you need to give it a fair few weeks at maximum blood concentration. By front loading I should get 8 weeks at 500mg pw blood concentration.

What are your further thoughts, is it still to short?