10 week deca??

[pushinplates4eva]

whats up guys... I have a bottle of deca (swisher 300mg/10ml). Id like to construct a light cycle (10 weeks) with that. I have no problem adding the neccesary amt of test with the cycle, either e or c its its totaly neccessary. Can anyone help me out with an easy light cycle to go with 300mg per wk of deca. I have bad joints and am not looking to put on a rediculious amt of week. Also id like the proper pct. Something that will get me by nice and simple.. Been serching for so long and everything seems to be contradicting each others advice. Thanks alot in advance!!

p.s, i am 5 11, 193lb 23yo... been training for 7 years

[Phate]

whats up guys... I have a bottle of deca (swisher 300mg/10ml). Id like to construct a light cycle (10 weeks) with that. I have no problem adding the neccesary amt of test with the cycle, either e or c its its totaly neccessary. Can anyone help me out with an easy light cycle to go with 300mg per wk of deca. I have bad joints and am not looking to put on a rediculious amt of week. Also id like the proper pct. Something that will get me by nice and simple.. Been serching for so long and everything seems to be contradicting each others advice. Thanks alot in advance!!

p.s, i am 5 11, 193lb 23yo... been training for 7 years

can you post a pic or tell us your bf?

why not just run a test cycle? is this your first cycle?

[Mulciber]

how bout something like...

300mg deca 10 weeks
4-500mg test 12 weeks

pct.. opinions will vary greatly.. imo you gotta find out what works best for you.
i use 100mg clomid and 20mg nolvadex for 30 days. have for years,
maybe 100mg clomid for 2 weeks then drop to 50 for the last 2 with 20mg nolvadex.
you will see many different pct protocols

[one8nine]

we need to know bf%

[one8nine]

how bout something like...

300mg deca 10 weeks
4-500mg test 12 weeks

pct.. opinions will vary greatly.. imo you gotta find out what works best for you.
i use 100mg clomid and 20mg nolvadex for 30 days. have for years,
maybe 100mg clomid for 2 weeks then drop to 50 for the last 2 with 20mg nolvadex.
you will see many different pct protocols

thats a pretty solid pct for 6 weeks of anavar only

[Mulciber]

works fine for me.. blood work pre and post cycle shows this.
this aint my first rodeo brutha

[pushinplates4eva]

i am about 12 percent bodyfat as of right now... I am just looking for an easy cycle that i can do my deca with. Like i said b4 i have bad joints.
My friend is taking deca alone and is gettin good results but after all the reading im doing it dont sound like a good idea.
Im thinkin 400mg of test e (11 wk)
300mg of deca a week (10wk)
20mg of nolva a day
200mg of vitamin e a day
and clomid for pct... How much clomid??

for such a light cycle?

[Mulciber]

thats a pretty solid pct for 6 weeks of anavar only

as for the 100mg clomid and 20mg nolvadex 30 day pct.. here are a few clips from Swales pct protocol..

I cannot design cycles, nor do I prescribe steroids (just ancillary medications). That would be a violation of my Oath as a physician, and DEA law to boot. Also, obviously I cannot afford to give away free Consultations. So, I'll post my PCT Protocols here, for anyone who may choose to use them.

Also, I'm just running to catch a plane for Las Vegas, attending the American Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine International Conference. I guess they are supposed to publish an article I wrote on how to administer TRT for men. Wish me luck!

Here it is:

I advise my AAS patients to use small amounts of HCG (250IU to 500IU) two days each week, right from the beginning of the cycle. This serves to maintain testicular form and function. It makes more sense to me to keep the horse in the barn, so to speak, then to have to chase it across three counties later on. I am also a big fan of maintaining estrogen within physiological ranges. Both therapies have been shown to hasten recovery.

If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn�t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn�t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. Those that have tell me they thus avoid that edgy, burned-out feeling they usually get. They also say they simply feel better each day. Subjective reports, to be sure, but they are hard not to appreciate. Especially when HCG is so inexpensive.

The testes are then ready, willing and able to again produce testosterone at the end of the cycle. LH levels rise fairly rapidly, but endogenous testosterone production is limited by lack of use. I also want to make sure a SERM, such as Clomid or nolvadex, is at effective serum dosage (around 100mg QD for Clomid, 20-40mg QD for nolvadex) when serum androgen levels drop to a concentration roughly equal to 200mg of testosterone per week. That is when androgenic inhibition at the HP no longer dominates over estrogenic antagonism with respect to inducing LH production

but again.. a topic that has be argued for years on the boards.. like i said before .. need to try things and see what works best for the individual.

[pushinplates4eva]

soo.. what should i do...
8 weeks of deca at 300mg
10 weeks of test e at 400mg

4 weeks of nolva for pct or clomid, or letro??
Im confused...

but i like the 8 weeks deca, 10 weeks test... lets stick with that... pllz someone hook me up with the answers to this pct stuff!! im diein here, lol

[Mulciber]

here is one of the many pct protocols out there.. thought pheednos would be appropriate since i dont see it here anymore.. lol

PHEEDNOS PCT

My post cycle therapy consists of a three compound administration which is designed so that there is a primary and secondary LH stimulator which both are maximizing potential early in the duration; with the primary being phased out in extended protocol. With the addition of an Aromatase Inhibitor, which makes the above possible, the individual will also endure less of an increase in Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, which allows free testosterone levels to reach base line at a much quicker pace. The individual will also see less of a problem in most cases with sexual libido as the bounding SHBG is controlled(to an extent). Below you will find my suggested bare minimum, as well as a sample of an extended protocol. Extended PCT protcol is cycle length dependant so the below is not the standard for all cycles


PCT for cycles 8-16wks:
Day 1-30- .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva

Extended protocol sample for a 12+ month cycle:
Day 1-15_ .25mg L-dex + 100mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 16-45_.25mg L-dex + 75mg Clomid + 20mg Nolva
Day 46-65_.25mg L-dex + 20mg Nolva
Day 66-80_.25mg L-dex

Now IMO, selective estrogen receptor modulators(SERMs) such as Clomiphine and Tamoxifen are selective to which tissues they bind too. Clomid being selective to the suprapituitary, while Tamox is selective to breast, bone, and liver ERs. I've come to this conclusion based on the comparison of studies on both SERMs. In every study showing benefit to HPTA from tamoxifin, the duration of the administration is 3-12months(This includes studies cited by William Llewellyn in his Nolva vs Clomid article). In studies showing levels of LH, FSH, and Testosterone checked after short durations of tamox, they were either insignificant, or their was an actual drop. I believe this is because tamox selectively works at the mammery(as well as bone and liver), thus taking longer for LH stimulation to occur.
With clomid, benefit to gonadotrophin concentrations, LH, FSH, and serum testosterone can be seen in short periods of 2-6wks. Because of the apparent selective nature of the two, and given our usual PCT duration, clomid is by far superior at LH stimulation than Nolva. Now both is the wise choice for a couple of reasons:

1. Nolva acts as the preventive measure to the estrogen flux
occured PC while clomid is the primary LH stimulator(Even more so in the case an AI is not used).
2. If your running a longer PCT, clomid needs to be discontinued after a while as it has been shown to desensitize GnRH, this due, IMO, to it's selective nature to the suprapituitary. In the longer forms of PCT, the clomid will be phased out, leaving Nolva and L-dex

Arimidex (or L-dex)
Estrogen is the main inhibitence of restoring HPTA, and AI administration has been shown to increase gonadotrophin concentrations and serum Testosterone by up to 50%. In addition, by adding L-dex, the inhibitence of excess estrogen allows Tamox to work greater at LH stimulation in the begining stages of PCT, since the need to prevent binding in the mammery is lessened by the reduction in estrogen biosynthesis

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

just do a little research and you will see.. some use 300mg clomid day one.. 200mg for 10 days then 100 for 10 days.. or 300/100/50, or nolvadex only bla bla bla..
some will use ldex during pct some swear against it.. can show studys both ways on that topic..
again. 100mg clomid and 20mg nolvadex ed for 30 days works for me

[JiGGaMaN]

whats up guys... I have a bottle of deca (swisher 300mg/10ml).

I enjoy swisher's sweet small cigars. cherry flavor forever!

[one8nine]

here is one of the many pct protocols out there.. thought pheednos would be appropriate since i dont see it here anymore.. lol

PHEEDNOS PCT



just do a little research and you will see.. some use 300mg clomid day one.. 200mg for 10 days then 100 for 10 days.. or 300/100/50, or nolvadex only bla bla bla..
some will use ldex during pct some swear against it.. can show studys both ways on that topic..
again. 100mg clomid and 20mg nolvadex ed for 30 days works for me

Here's a study stating how effective "25mg/ED" is...

Clomiphene citrate effects on testosterone/estrogen ratio in male hypogonadism.

Shabsigh A, Kang Y, Shabsign R, Gonzalez M, Liberson G, Fisch H, Goluboff E.
Department of Urology, NY Presbyterian Medical Center, New York, NY, USA.


AIM: Symptomatic late-onset hypogonadism is associated not only with a decline in serum testosterone , but also with a rise in serum estradiol. These endocrine changes negatively affect libido, sexual function, mood, behavior, lean body mass, and bone density. Currently, the most common treatment is exogenous testosterone therapy . This treatment can be associated with skin irritation, gynecomastia , nipple tenderness, testicular atrophy, and decline in sperm counts. In this study we investigated the efficacy of clomiphene citrate in the treatment of hypogonadism with the objectives of raising endogenous serum testosterone (T) and improving the testosterone/estrogen (T/E) ratio. METHODS: Our cohort consisted of 36 Caucasian men with hypogonadism defined as serum testosterone level less than 300 ng/dL. Each patient was treated with a daily dose of 25 mg clomiphene citrate and followed prospectively. Analysis of baseline and follow-up serum levels of testosterone and estradiol levels were performed. RESULTS: The mean age was 39 years, and the mean pretreatment testosterone and estrogen levels were 247.6 +/- 39.8 ng/dL and 32.3 +/- 10.9, respectively. By the first follow-up visit (4-6 weeks), the mean testosterone level rose to 610.0 +/- 178.6 ng/dL (P < 0.00001). Moreover, the T/E ratio improved from 8.7 to 14.2 (P < 0.001). There were no side effects reported by the patients. CONCLUSIONS: Low dose clomiphene citrate is effective in elevating serum testosterone levels and improving the testosterone/estradiol ratio in men with hypogonadism. This therapy represents an alternative to testosterone therapy by stimulating the endogenous androgen production pathway.

PMID: 16422830 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



Anthony Roberts was so agaisnt Clomid as he got sides from its use. It doesnt mean everyone will.

300mg is waayy over the top

[one8nine]

and the things you posted all include hcg and AIs- not clomid/nolva ONLY
that was my point

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?p=4111013