Cycle thoughts, help

Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back.
Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet)
27 yr old
185 lbs
5'9
20% bf

Goal:
- build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs
- reach 6-8% bf
- increase str and endurance

For the cycle:
Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment)
Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en
Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED
Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg
Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol
Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED
Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing)

Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva)

I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
30% protein
55% Carbs
15% Fats

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back. Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet) 27 yr old 185 lbs 5'9 20% bf Goal: - build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs - reach 6-8% bf - increase str and endurance For the cycle: Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment) Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing) Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva) I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration 30% protein 55% Carbs 15% Fats

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I do not recommend cycling above 15% bodyfat.
I also do not recommend shutting down your system to get the results that you want. Proper diet and exercise will get you that.
Everyone is different however i would lose more by decreasing carbs and increasing protein.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by charger69

I do not recommend cycling above 15% bodyfat.
I also do not recommend shutting down your system to get the results that you want. Proper diet and exercise will get you that.
Everyone is different however i would lose more by decreasing carbs and increasing protein.

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I got the diet and training program down, thats why 1-4 wks will be without gear i'll get down lower than 15% down by the time i start 5th week, i run 5 miles a day every morning do my weight training at night, plus training for jiu jitsu, but i do get the concern

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
30% protein
55% Carbs
15% Fats

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

I got the diet and training program down...

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You're cycle is poorly planned, but more importantly if you plan on eating 2500 calories for the whole duration then you don't have the whole diet down.

You should create a new thread in the diet forum so members can help get you on the right track.

Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow

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I know my body, but i am not a diet expert. I think that 2500 is actually quite a bit to cut however i do not know your exercise regime. I do know that martial arts training can be pretty intense.
Running 5 miles, working out and jui jitsu can burn quite a few calories. The real experts are in the diet section as stated by number.

Lol.. hes 185 and wants to get down to 160 and wanrs to know what we think of his 12 week cycle.

Well for one my friend at 2 pounds of weight loss per week you could lose 24 pounds and be 161 pounds in 12 weeks natural. (Your goal was 160)

Dont need a cycle to do that. Now it probably will help to maintain muscle while cutting. Maybe youll lose some muscle while cutting natural though.

I'm not an expert, but I've also heard that it is not good to cycle above 15% body fat as charger said.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

Hi, this will be my 3rd cycle previous two were test only cycles, both were a success, I'd like to know if what I'm planning would be any good, this would be in preparation for an amateur bjj competion nothing big. However I've been vacant for quite a while with no training or whatsoever (been busy in medical school) total prep time would be 12 weeks 1st for would be without gear so as to just get a feel of getting back.
Here are my stats: (when i started already on wk3 no gear yet)
27 yr old
185 lbs
5'9
20% bf

Goal:
- build quality muscle while getting down to 160lbs
- reach 6-8% bf
- increase str and endurance

For the cycle:
Wk 1-4: as i've mentioned no gear (feeling it out period, acually on wk3, bf 18%, 180lbs as of the moment)
Wk 5-12: a mix of 250mg Test cyp/250mg test en
Wk 8-12: Stanozolol 50mg ED
Wk 5-6: ON clenbuterol work from 20mcg to 80mcg
Wk 7-8 OFF clenbuterol
Wk 9-10: ON clenbuterol 80mcg ED
Wk 9-12: cytomel 50mg (depends on how much weight I'll be losing)

Pct standard pct for 4 wks (clomid and nolva)

I'll be running 2500 kcal for the whole duration
30% protein
55% Carbs
15% Fats

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The posts about not using aas above 15% bf are completely bro science. The argument is you'll not "healthy" enough. Like high BP and such. But there's plenty of high bf people taking gear. Look at half the powerlifting community. And are fine. It's pretty hypocritical considering when I was heading into a show I'd be very unhealthy but no one talks about that.

BUT. I do agree with the others about your main problem is dieting. Aas aren't magic plus 185 lbs and 20% bf..... that's pretty bad no offense. That sounds like you have no Fondation of muscle. You are obviously looking for shortcuts when you clearly aren't even training right.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by MMA_Influenced

Lol.. hes 185 and wants to get down to 160 and wanrs to know what we think of his 12 week cycle.

Well for one my friend at 2 pounds of weight loss per week you could lose 24 pounds and be 161 pounds in 12 weeks natural. (Your goal was 160)

Dont need a cycle to do that. Now it probably will help to maintain muscle while cutting. Maybe youll lose some muscle while cutting natural though.

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Alright I'm pretty sure I can get down to 160 without any gear, the problem, is by the time i reach 160 on the 12 week period i would have lost a good amount of muscle, which translates to less power and performance hence I need a bit of an edge, the cycle i've proposed so far is pretty much for performance enhancement, 185-160 is two weight classes down from my weight, which doesnt translate much to power

Thank you for that 15% fact, no problem bro, as stated on the article i am on my 3rd week of training, 11st 4weeks will be without gear as to build a foundation, and already on 18% bf by the end of the 4th week i'll be on 15% maybe less, cycle starts at week 5, i wouldnt say it's a short cut more of a short competition prep time, 12 weeks in total and will be competing again a month after that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Tropomyosin

Any insights as to why it is poorly planned that way i could make some adjustments, will be posting in the diet forums tomorrow

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My bad for the late response, it's been a hectic week.

You should get your bf down to 15% or below before starting.

There's a lot more to cycling at low bf than bro science.

IMO you should just use test, winny and clen.

T3 seems to reduce my strength quite a bit.

Plus, if you're anxiety prone t3 will be counterproductive before a competition.

I think you should use winny for the last 6-8 weeks, it's dht based and should give you a nice boost in strength.

If you use clen then either take it two weeks on two weeks off or use it for the entire duration along with ketotifen to reset your beta two receptors.

You should take 1200mg of NAC while you're using and 1800-2400mg while on winny.

It would also be a good idea to incorporate 250IU of hcg from day one until 2-3 days before PCT.

What is your plan for PCT?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by numbere

My bad for the late response, it's been a hectic week.

You should get your bf down to 15% or below before starting.

There's a lot more to cycling at low bf than bro science.

IMO you should just use test, winny and clen.

T3 seems to reduce my strength quite a bit.

Plus, if you're anxiety prone t3 will be counterproductive before a competition.

I think you should use winny for the last 6-8 weeks, it's dht based and should give you a nice boost in strength.

If you use clen then either take it two weeks on two weeks off or use it for the entire duration along with ketotifen to reset your beta two receptors.

You should take 1200mg of NAC while you're using and 1800-2400mg while on winny.

It would also be a good idea to incorporate 250IU of hcg from day one until 2-3 days before PCT.

What is your plan for PCT?

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Thank you! By the 4th week i'll get it down to 15%, will throw t3 out of the equation, I've got hcg on hand as well, pct will be clomid 70/50/50/50 nolva 40/20/20/20 ( would this be all right?), lastly, ketotifen? How and when should i take it? thanks for the input, I appreciate it a lot!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Staynattybruh

The posts about not using aas above 15% bf are completely bro science. The argument is you'll not "healthy" enough. Like high BP and such. But there's plenty of high bf people taking gear. Look at half the powerlifting community. And are fine. It's pretty hypocritical considering when I was heading into a show I'd be very unhealthy but no one talks about that.

BUT. I do agree with the others about your main problem is dieting. Aas aren't magic plus 185 lbs and 20% bf..... that's pretty bad no offense. That sounds like you have no Fondation of muscle. You are obviously looking for shortcuts when you clearly aren't even training right.

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Its 100% true. All bro science bullshit. Bro science also says that you should be over 200 pounds to start a cycle. These are idiots. Its well known that most natural body builders at competition only weigh between 145-175 depending on height. These men are at their genetic max. Says 200 pounds says nothing about body fat percentage or height. Someone whos 5"6 versus someone whos 6 foot at 200 pounds will look completely different.