dumb question but when can i start using gear?

[99JT]

i have been working out for a little over 3 years now and am having a real hard time putting on muscle. in this time i went from 147-180, and now back down to 170 at6'. i was eating 4000 calories and gaining 3lbs a month. then i started to cut at 3000 calories last month and have lost 10lbs. the issue is that i am still realy small i have had 14.5" arms for the last year and my bench has been around 190 1rm. i have tried various workout rountines and have had no progress.

[PT1982]

i have been working out for a little over 3 years now and am having a real hard time putting on muscle. in this time i went from 147-180, and now back down to 170 at6'. i was eating 4000 calories and gaining 3lbs a month. then i started to cut at 3000 calories last month and have lost 10lbs. the issue is that i am still realy small i have had 14.5" arms for the last year and my bench has been around 190 1rm. i have tried various workout rountines and have had no progress.

If you were gaining well eating higher calories, do that. Even with using anabolics, you have to eat at a surplus in calories. And at 6'1 and 180lbs, guilt had no reason to "cut". I see this all the time with 16-20ish test olds in the gym. All they taking about it cutting. Get those calories in buddy and grow! Don't worry about cutting until you add the mass that warrants cutting. Cutting with low lean body mass will just make you look skinny. Mainly because you are. Even if you put on some fat, it's not going to be much, and would be easy to drop. Adding some fat during a bulk is normal.

[Quester]

I agree with PT. Work on your diet and set priorities. Don't cut just because you gained 5 lbs of fat with your 5 lbs of muscle. AAS can't fix your diet.

[songdog]

I agree with PT you messed up cutting you need to put on size without aas.

[99JT]

I started cutting because my bf was ~20%. I was getting 250g protein 120 fat and the rest carbs.

[PT1982]

I started cutting because my bf was ~20%. I was getting 250g protein 120 fat and the rest carbs.

Then you really really need to adjust your diet. At your height and weight, to be 20+% body fat, while being in the gym for over 3 years is not good. It could bee something a simple as switching your macros, or it could be that you're only estimating calories. However, if you're in the gym regularly, I just don't see how you can be over 20% on the calories you're claiming. What does your training split look like for the week? Please be honest because it's the only way you're going to be able to get help that will work.

[99JT]

i currently do legs, chest/shoulders, back, arms. here are some pics 2 at 180 the others are a couple weeks ago cut down to 172 at 3000 calories. do you stillr ecommend bulking?

[Quester]

-YES
Your skinny-fat, absolutely no offense meant. The term describes the condition of being so skinny (devoid of muscle) that the fat you do have is the only thing you notice.
-For instance:
If one guy has a low LBM and 20% body fat that fat is going to be more emphasized than another guy who has a lot of LBM (muscle and other non-fat tissue) and 20% fat.
-As you gain muscle, (Ceteris Paribus) your BF% will decrease.
-BF% is a more accurate indicator than amount of fat. BF% is based upon a ratio not an absolute. Your picture indicates that any BF% problem you have is not from to much fat but from to little muscle.
-If I was you, my diet would be "eat normally," and my workouts would be "avoid cardio and lift everything I see."

[kelkel]

Pull a male hormone panel and include LH & FSH. Make sure there's no issue holding you back.

[fit_deskjocky]

i currently do legs, chest/shoulders, back, arms. here are some pics 2 at 180 the others are a couple weeks ago cut down to 172 at 3000 calories. do you stillr ecommend bulking?

Nothing wrong with your workout split as long as each one you are doing on separate days so each body part that you hit can take full advantage of the calories you take in for that day. What are you doing on those days? Should always be doing the big lifts if at all possible, squats, deads, bench and rows. Everything else is supplemental to those. I think you might want to look at Jim Stoppani's Shortcut to Size routine. It'll changes up the exercises enough for you to keep the muscles guessing.

[jabawocky]

i currently do legs, chest/shoulders, back, arms. here are some pics 2 at 180 the others are a couple weeks ago cut down to 172 at 3000 calories. do you stillr ecommend bulking?

By this forums' standard I'm a small guy. I was stuck at 165-170lbs at 5'7" after 2 years of lifting and decided to go on my first cycle at 24 years old (500mg test/week), I broke the 170lbs limit, which some may say a mere plateau and I admit they were right.

So I did not cycle again for 3 years, till I last year when I was 27 I did my 2nd cycle, link below:
http://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-s...r-3-years.html

I lost my gains from the 1st cycle and trained naturally for 3 years before the second.
My profile pic was taken before I started my second cycle, I was about 175lbs. Maybe some may disagree with me, but I can say, I had a good base to start. You at 172lbs (roughly my weight before I cycled) doesn't look like you have a good base. I'm not that big so maybe I got no right to advice you, I'm so sorry to say this too; I suggest you try again for another year.

[vodkalol]

after 25 years of age

before and you most likely do permanent damage to your hormonal ballance

[99JT]

if i do a test cycle now will i kill any future natty gains?

[Obs]

if i do a test cycle now will i kill any future natty gains?

Depends on the individual and how you recover and how/what you use.