Bulk Cycle

[m1o]

Hello, 24y, 172cm height, 78kg weight, made a mistake with first time using oral only cycle, but whatever it is we got it back, feels great, also was feeling super great while i was on dianabol solo and had no problems at all.

Now I'm looking to cycle something like this:
1-4 weeks - 30mg ED Dianabol 100tabs
1-10weeks - 2x250 Weekly Sustanon 250

Diet will be looking something like this:
(meal1) - 1whole egg and 4 egg whites, 80 or 100g oats with 1scoop of whey and 1 banana
After training gonna mix a 2scoops of whey with 5g creatine
(meal2) - 200 or 250mg chicken with around 100-150g white rice with salad or frozen mix veggies
(meal3) - 100g pasta with 1 or 2 cans tuna or minced beef
(meal4) - 200g chicken with some potatoes ( or sometimes gonna use salad instead of potato )
(meal5) - 1 or 2 cans tuna with salad.

Workout will be: Chest, Back , Shoulder, Cardio, Arms, Legs, Rest

I need advice on pct
so pct would look like this
Testo Booster 3-4caps
VitC 4g
ZMA - 3caps
Ashwagandha - 3caps
Omega3 - 3caps after every meal
and gonna eat more healthy fats.

not gonna use nolva or clomid untill needed or start feeling something bad
Need opinions on how it looks to run it like this?

[DinAZ]

Hello, 24y, 172cm height, 78kg weight, made a mistake with first time using oral only cycle, but whatever it is we got it back, feels great, also was feeling super great while i was on dianabol solo and had no problems at all.

Now I'm looking to cycle something like this:
1-4 weeks - 30mg ED Dianabol 100tabs
1-10weeks - 2x250 Weekly Sustanon 250

Diet will be looking something like this:
(meal1) - 1whole egg and 4 egg whites, 80 or 100g oats with 1scoop of whey and 1 banana
After training gonna mix a 2scoops of whey with 5g creatine
(meal2) - 200 or 250mg chicken with around 100-150g white rice with salad or frozen mix veggies
(meal3) - 100g pasta with 1 or 2 cans tuna or minced beef
(meal4) - 200g chicken with some potatoes ( or sometimes gonna use salad instead of potato )
(meal5) - 1 or 2 cans tuna with salad.

Workout will be: Chest, Back , Shoulder, Cardio, Arms, Legs, Rest

I need advice on pct
so pct would look like this
Testo Booster 3-4caps
VitC 4g
ZMA - 3caps
Ashwagandha - 3caps
Omega3 - 3caps after every meal
and gonna eat more healthy fats.

not gonna use nolva or clomid untill needed or start feeling something bad
Need opinions on how it looks to run it like this?

IDK if those herbs and supplements will be good enough for PCT you might need to get some SERMs.

If it was me I’d have PCT planned and sourced before I start the cycle. Hopefully someone more experienced can chime in; from what I have learned it is OK to take AI as needed but PCT should be done proactively not reactively.

[SampsonandDelilah]

The cycles fine. People seem to love or hate sus…I’m fine with it and had good luck the times I’ve run it.
If it’s me, I’d run 12 weeks or until I plateaued and would most definitely revisit my PCT.

If I’m dependent on jump starting my HPTA, that would not be be my recipe.

I’m a Nolva/Clomid fan…or at least I used to be.

I’d at least read up on PCT…that would be as important if not more so than plotting my diet

[m1o]

Eh, ikr.
I asked alot experienced users here and they said for a easy cycle u wont need nolva clomid or any antiestrogen untill it is needed!
so they suggest nolva and clomid for more heavy cycles.
Anything on diet to add or someething to correct?
Will be 30mg of dboll be enoogh? I can go 2 weeks 30mg and 2 weeks 40mg maybe?

[DinAZ]

I think you are confusing on cycle AI or SERMS with PCT they can use the same drugs but they are 2 different things. PCT is Post Cycle Therapy . This means you do it after your cycle is over. You do your last shot and then wait a couple week. I have to wait 2 weeks for Test-E but I think for Sust it says 18 days from last shot (https://forums.steroid.com/pct-post-...art-times.html).

You can take AI on cycle as needed but PCT is something you plan for it's not something to do as needed. I use very little AI but I am taller and heavier and older than you so with your stats you might be able to go without AI like you said. But that doesn't mean you shouldn't do PCT. Too much AI on cycle got my joints aching so I like your idea of minimizing AI. You might be able to get by without AI (I'd still have some on hand personally cause I don't want bloat, tits, or getting emotional at TV commercials).

PCT is not done during the cycle and it is not done as needed; you do it on a schedule. You aren't going to eat as needed you have a schedule. You aren't going to take sustanon as needed you have a schedule. PCT is the same way, you either do it or you don't but you cannot do it as needed because it has a schedule.

If you don't PCT you could lose more muscle from having low T, and you could have less energy to workout, and this will last longer than if you did do PCT. Not doing PCT can increase ED or sterility issues when you get older even if it doesn't cause a problem now. I'd listen to SampsonandDelilah but if you don't wanna just take his word at least do what he said and read about PCT before you decide not to do it.

[DinAZ]

look at this, especially the part under 'Summary & Recommendations': https://forums.steroid.com/pct-post-...l-control.html

[Honkey_Kong]

Eh, ikr.
I asked alot experienced users here and they said for a easy cycle u wont need nolva clomid or any antiestrogen untill it is needed!
so they suggest nolva and clomid for more heavy cycles.
Anything on diet to add or someething to correct?
Will be 30mg of dboll be enoogh? I can go 2 weeks 30mg and 2 weeks 40mg maybe?

Well like the other guys said, you need to figure out the difference between on-cycle SERM and AI use and using SERMs in a PCT.

You should also look at this sticky: https://forums.steroid.com/anabolic-...rst-cycle.html

As far as dbol dosages go, I'd go with whatever is the lowest dose that gives you the desired effect. The sides get worse as you go up in dosage, where as the extra gains diminish

[SampsonandDelilah]

Pretty sure you specifically ask for advice on PCT.

You received it and gave an “eh”

Let’s see…

24 years old - check

Testo Booster 3-4caps - check

VitC 4g - check

ZMA - 3caps - check

Ashwagandha - 3caps - check

Omega3 - 3caps after every meal
and gonna eat more healthy fats - check


Yup, you’ve got it all figured out.

Good luck and make sure to visit the TRT threads in a few years.

Godspeed

[m1o]

Jeeez, this went so wrong…
I asked in forum where proffesionals post so much, by my country, so they said dont use anti estrogens on cycle until needed, also i asked them for clomid and nolva and their answer was that i dont need to take that much pills cuz im young and on 24yrs i wont need to recover with clomid and nolva, they recommend to get faster test back with vitamins and good healthy fats after cycle also they recommend testosterone booster with zma as i mentioned above, there was so many guys with low test after cycle on that forum and they helped them alot with that way as i said t boosters vitamins zma and every one gave feedback that they recovered successfully… now i can not understand between this and that forum, you said i need to use nolva and clomid, they say i wont need….

[SampsonandDelilah]

Not knowing that forum, I can’t comment.

The totality of scientific based evidence supports the need to restart the HPTA after exogenous testosterone is administered, that is accomplished by the introduction of clomid and nolvadex .

Can you recover without it? Eventually. Will you keep the same gains without it as you would with it? The clinical and anecdotal evidence says no.

I do agree with your countrymen about abstaining from AI’s on cycle until needed.

You have to understand that many come on here soliciting advice and then either argue with what’s given or disagree. You unknowingly fell into that category. It’s my belief that you’ll run into a lot of guys giving the same advice I am. Maybe I’m wrong and if so I’ll be quiet…

[charger69]

Jeeez, this went so wrong…
I asked in forum where proffesionals post so much, by my country, so they said dont use anti estrogens on cycle until needed, also i asked them for clomid and nolva and their answer was that i dont need to take that much pills cuz im young and on 24yrs i wont need to recover with clomid and nolva, they recommend to get faster test back with vitamins and good healthy fats after cycle also they recommend testosterone booster with zma as i mentioned above, there was so many guys with low test after cycle on that forum and they helped them alot with that way as i said t boosters vitamins zma and every one gave feedback that they recovered successfully… now i can not understand between this and that forum, you said i need to use nolva and clomid, they say i wont need….

I will say that depending on the forum, sometimes you have clicks that “run” the forum. These clicks all have the same beliefs. You learn what they know and that’s it. I am more of a- let me try this and see what happens - type of person. I obviously have a theory that I am either trying to prove or dis- prove from various opinions.
Everyone is different and may react different. I did a study on myself with test boosters- no improved test from bloods.
I also do not use an AI and grow quickly- however this can be dangerous with endema.
I would say that I would be interested with medical studies that are the basis for their claims of PCT.
i recommend that you start reading medical studies and educate yourself as well as getting different opinions and you determine what is right for you.
I will say that PCT - whether your countryman’s version or the article on here- is no guarantee that you will get your natural production back. I know you g people that could not restart their test after the first cycle. Not probable, but possible.
We roll the dice with every cycle and as long as we accept that risk everything is fine.
The men back in the day did not use PCT. PCT’s function is just a jump start for natural production. No magic involved.


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[m1o]

Eh gr8 reply i like this one tbh.
I used dianabol solo 2 years ago, felt so fucking good while using it then stopped and after that i used clomid, guess what after clomid i felt shitty shit shittiest ever in my life, low t sucks af, had so much pain in leg felt verry down tbh.
Its bad runing solo only i regret it but that gainz egh…

[Spumps]

Not gonna comment about that mix up under your pct protocol.

Consider extending your cycle to 12 weeks. At 10 weeks you'd be gaining nicely. I think you'd really benefit from the extra 2 weeks. However, if I was you I would not run that bro split. A PPL split or an Upper/Lower split would be superior IMO. You're not getting the most out of this cycle if you only train a body part once a week. Especially when the growth cycle for the smaller muscle groups is not very long. If you do chest today, they will recover fully in 3-4 days. It just sits there for another 3-4 days until the next chest day. That's wasted potential. I know AAS accelerates MPS but I'd hit every muscle 2x a week to be on the safe side.

[DinAZ]

Not gonna comment about that mix up under your pct protocol.

Consider extending your cycle to 12 weeks. At 10 weeks you'd be gaining nicely. I think you'd really benefit from the extra 2 weeks. However, if I was you I would not run that bro split. A PPL split or an Upper/Lower split would be superior IMO. You're not getting the most out of this cycle if you only train a body part once a week. Especially when the growth cycle for the smaller muscle groups is not very long. If you do chest today, they will recover fully in 3-4 days. It just sits there for another 3-4 days until the next chest day. That's wasted potential. I know AAS accelerates MPS but I'd hit every muscle 2x a week to be on the safe side.

A bit off topics from OPs post but since you are bringing it up I have a question for you:

As far as that split, how do you like to change it when you are not on cycle? I’m trying to figure out if I want to go down from PPLx2 during cycle to PPLx1 off cycle, or perhaps continue trying to do exercises 2x a week but focus more on major compound movements. Right now I do a mixture of compound, isolation, and minor amount of plyometrics.

[Spumps]

A bit off topics from OPs post but since you are bringing it up I have a question for you:

As far as that split, how do you like to change it when you are not on cycle? I’m trying to figure out if I want to go down from PPLx2 during cycle to PPLx1 off cycle, or perhaps continue trying to do exercises 2x a week but focus more on major compound movements. Right now I do a mixture of compound, isolation, and minor amount of plyometrics.

I would still do PPLRPPL off cycle. Any routine that works every muscle at least 2 times a week without compromising volume is IMO a good routine. You would notice that most routines are compromising volume for frequency and vice-versa. However, there are some good routines out there that strike a reasonable balance between the two.

If you think a six-day PPL is too much for you, consider easing the intensity of your workouts a bit or switch to an upper/lower split.

If you really like 3x a week routines. I'd do a routine like this.

Day 1: Back, Chest
Day 2: Shoulders, Arms (CGBP and Close Grip Pullups)
Day 3: Legs (Deadlifts + Heavy Rack pulls), Abs

Exercise selection is key. Your back, chest, shoulders, and arms are getting worked out 2x week.

Alternatively, you can always do a full-body routine.

[whos.mike]

If he went the route he originally posted, I hope he doesn't own any guns because he will find the barrel in his mouth come 3 weeks after his last shot.