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I've noticed that my acne flares up 2 days after each HCG injection (even with use of Adex), especially after I have just mixed a new vial and the HCG is most potent. I'm thinking of quitting the HCG. When I first started TRT I didn't use it and had no problems with testicular shrinkage. Are there any reasons I'm not aware of for staying on HCG? Do you guys think it's ok to discontinue?
Thanks
Be careful using Adex if you don't know for sure you need it. My doc has me on HCG for shrinkage and it works at 800 units a week. What is your dosage?
I didn't notice any shrinkage in the first year either, now after 18 months, my nuts are like a couple grapes in a deflated balloon. I've got HCG on order and after what I've experienced, I'm pretty certain I'll be using it from now on. Not to mention, if you're ever interested in having kids, it's pretty much a necessity. I'd say that trumps the acne. Have you had your E2 levels tested recently? I've found that getting mine under control helped quite a bit with the acne.
Like Vegas mentioned, what is your dosage? Also, the frequency?
Testicular E2 levels in some men can be high with hCG usage and an AI has no affect. If you haven't you should have your E2 levels checked as standard procotol and see if the hCG is increasing testicle E2 levels. If you are on an AI and you still have E2 issues this could be the source.
In my opinion, the benefits of needing hCG far out way the negs for so many reasons.
What benefits?Quote:
Originally Posted by gdevine
My current dosage is 250 iu, 2xweek
My E2 levels are low, 20, even without the AI. The AI has helped with acne and morning wood, but I still get breakouts 2 days after HCG use. Like "gdevine" posted, I have heard that HCG can spike E2 even with use of an AI. That's why I was interested in trying to discontinue the HCG.
* If your E2 levels are in the low 20's with no AI then you don't need it...for now. E2 levels in the testes can rise with exogenous T and an AI can't control it. But this is the exception rather then the norm for most men.Quote:
Originally Posted by arizona32
How's that? I was of the understanding that E2 increase was due to the aromatization of T into E which is exactly what AI's prevent, hens the name, Aromatise Inhibitor [AI]. Are there other ways the testes produce straight E without aromatization?Quote:
Originally Posted by gdevine
I also agree that you shouldn't use an AI if your E levels are low. I was afraid my E levels were high and took some liquidex...and it messed me up. All my joints hurt after a new days and it dried me out. I recently had blood work done and she told me "your E levels are really low, even with your high Test levels, don't EVER take a blocker." I didn't have the balls (no pun intended) to tell her I tried it and it kicked my *ss.
If you have dropped your estrogen down to nothing, you can have limited gains and similar sides to high estrogen. At least that is my understanding.
+1 ^^^
Low E sucks! No need for AI unless you E high, and I wouldn't let it go below 20.
+2 ^^^
I have to keep my E in a very narrow range because I get gyno easily. Low E is really a problem! I hate it, my wife hates it!
Yes! T can convert to E intra testicular and it has nothing to do with the Aromatase Enzyme.Quote:
Originally Posted by forrest_and_trees
Thanks gdevine. I was convinced my E2 went up when I started HCG, but I had no tests to prove or disprove my thoughts, and I couldn't find any info on limits of AI affectiveness in testicular cells.
exactly right! my last blood work showed my E below 20 and my back muscles are in pain. my clinic said to keep it at around 30...Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyVegas