scientific evidence (logic) on why NO2 is a scam

[IronReload04]

If it really did what it was supposed to do

dilation of blood vessels(and increased bloodflow)=lowered blood pressure=mad increase in heart rate

DOnt you think their would be alot of peole freaking out about their heart rate if NO2 really increassed blood flow and dilation. more fluid and more space to pump would mean the heart would be working harder. which might mean, you could be sitting in your chair not doing a damn thing with your heart rate at 120-140 beats per minute. NObody ever complains about heart rate. this is evidence it is a scam

[IronReload04]

I would have to think that the side effect of NO2 on the heart would be the same as "medicinal marijuana", because medicinal marijuana is an extremely strong vasodilator, in other words, it does what NO2 claims to do. =increased heart rate, Providing it was a strong (worth $) vasodilater

[SnaX]

I take niacin. Turns me all red and stuff. At least thats what i thought of when ya were talking about blood vessels etc...

[C_Bino]

Its not a scam. There is an arginine base, arginine is an amino acid...nothing scam about that. And it does increase the blood floow. And if you were wondering why there are no people complaining about raised heartrate, well there are a couple things to consider. Most of these products give you a serving of 3grams arginine. That is fairly low to say the least. Also it is known to mess with your heart, and infact for that VERY reason is has been banned in Canada by the FDA.

Trust me when I tell you it is scientifically proven to dilate/relax blood vessels. Now you can go ahead and think NO products are a scam, but I assure you arginine is not (and this is the key ingredient in I would say 100% of NO products). Do some research into arginine.

[taiboxa]

supplements are stupid
infact ANYTHING LEGAL is LAME and worthless!

[IronReload04]

Its not a scam. There is an arginine base, arginine is an amino acid...nothing scam about that. And it does increase the blood floow. And if you were wondering why there are no people complaining about raised heartrate, well there are a couple things to consider. Most of these products give you a serving of 3grams arginine. That is fairly low to say the least. Also it is known to mess with your heart, and infact for that VERY reason is has been banned in Canada by the FDA.

Trust me when I tell you it is scientifically proven to dilate/relax blood vessels. Now you can go ahead and think NO products are a scam, but I assure you arginine is not (and this is the key ingredient in I would say 100% of NO products). Do some research into arginine.

I am almost certain, that for cardiac patients, arginine is injected into the patient. I dont think however that cardiac patients are recieving "patented NO2 pills"

If these pills truely delivered, the medical field would be looking into them, and as far as i know, the are not.

I could be wrong though

perhaps pills are useless



IN canada, maybe your authorities have some people that are saying, if this shit actually works, its not a good thing and lets take it off the shelf


perhaps the US is saying. **** it, it doesnt work, we're making money

[IronReload04]

supplements are stupid
infact ANYTHING LEGAL is LAME and worthless!

creatine without a doubt works



whey, casain and egg protein powder have their place imo

I use whey, and i think its a good thing to have some fast absorbing protein before and after a workout. its certainly not a crutch

[Mizfit]

supplements are not always regulated by the government..

L-arginine makes my muscles pop by the way . love it

[IronReload04]

supplements are not always regulated by the government..

L-arginine makes my muscles pop by the way . love it

If it does, awesome, but this would make your blood pressure lower and i would have to think that your heart rate would be significantly higher to a point that would alarm you. comparable to the side effects of medicinal marijiuna where you can be sitting down doing nothing with a heart rate of 110-140 beats per minute


Im just simply throwing some stuff out up in the air to think about because i have been thinking alot abouut it lately

[Mizfit]

If it does, awesome, but this would make your blood pressure lower and i would have to think that your heart rate would be significantly higher to a point that would alarm you. comparable to the side effects of medicinal marijiuna where you can be sitting down doing nothing with a heart rate of 110-140 beats per minute


Im just simply throwing some stuff out up in the air to think about because i have been thinking alot abouut it lately

I take 4000mg of l-arginine a night before bed..

and my blood pressure has always been fine

[IronReload04]

I take 4000mg of l-arginine a night before bed..

and my blood pressure has always been fine

What i am trying to say is

IF your blood vessels dilate, your heart has to push the same amount of fluid through a larger space.

so its kind of like a garden hose without a nosel, plug it up with your thumb, and it squirts out because the pressure is high, remove your thumb completely, and the water oozes out pathetically becuase of the low pressure, taking arginine "should" be comparable to taking your thumb off the hose or partially, causing your heart to work a shit ton harder to push the water out with the same force to make it squirt with your thumb over it, just without your thumb.

does this make sense? i can try and explain it better. maybe you have been thourhh biology and already know this?

[mmaximus25]

I would have to think that the side effect of NO2 on the heart would be the same as "medicinal marijuana", because medicinal marijuana is an extremely strong vasodilator, in other words, it does what NO2 claims to do. =increased heart rate, Providing it was a strong (worth $) vasodilater

I smoke before every workout... not kidding... It puts me in a very focused state of mind... not for all I'm sure... I dont get sleepy infact I have to work on something whether it be mechanical or problem solving... working out I am always in a supreme focused state... (I only know of a few other bros that smoke weed before their training sessions though)

[IronReload04]

I smoke before every workout... not kidding... It puts me in a very focused state of mind... not for all I'm sure... I dont get sleepy infact I have to work on something whether it be mechanical or problem solving... working out I am always in a supreme focused state... (I only know of a few other bros that smoke weed before their training sessions though)

I see where your coming from, but i dont want this thread to get closed. Its not about working out and marijuana. i only used medicinal marijuana to help shed some light on what happens with lowered blood pressure

[mmaximus25]

What i am trying to say is

IF your blood vessels dilate, your heart has to push the same amount of fluid through a larger space.

so its kind of like a garden hose without a nosel, plug it up with your thumb, and it squirts out because the pressure is high, remove your thumb completely, and the water oozes out pathetically becuase of the low pressure, taking arginine "should" be comparable to taking your thumb off the hose, causing your heart to work a shit ton harder to push the water out with the same force to make it squirt with your thumb over it, just without your thumb.

does this make sense? i can try and explain it better. maybe you have been thourhh biology and already know this?

Well you’re forgetting about flow rate. pressure is directly affected by the id or measurement of its traveling corridor and the source apparatus of what it pushing the fluid or gas... if what your saying (I don’t know anything about No2) is true then you have lower pressure but greater flow capacity... depending on the heart and how healthy then one might have better flow due to a greater efficiency of pump from the heart so pressure will vary still

[Mizfit]

all i can say is here is scientifical evidence..

I have not blown up yet..

Proof enough.. GOOD!

[IronReload04]

Well you’re forgetting about flow rate. pressure is directly affected by the id or measurement of its traveling corridor and the source apparatus of what it pushing the fluid or gas... if what your saying (I don’t know anything about No2) is true then you have lower pressure but greater flow capacity... depending on the heart and how healthy then one might have better flow due to a greater efficiency of pump from the heart so pressure will vary still

i think what your saying is high pressure, better flow rate, low pressure slower flow rate

if NO2 relaxes smooth muscles around vessels, i dont see why this would impove the efficiency of each pump from the heart

again, hey im only in my second year, so by all means, if im wrong some body prove me wrong

[taiboxa]

creatine without a doubt works



whey, casain and egg protein powder have their place imo

I use whey, and i think its a good thing to have some fast absorbing protein before and after a workout. its certainly not a crutch

creatine IMO is over priced for gains it gives even if u get it in bulk pwdr
and yes whey protein is essential but i really only useit w/ dextrose PWO w/ slin

try to use real food at all other times

[IronReload04]

creatine IMO is over priced for gains it gives even if u get it in bulk pwdr
and yes whey protein is essential but i really only useit w/ dextrose PWO w/ slin

try to use real food at all other times

i payed 30 bucks for 6 months creatine


i think its an anabolic thing to hold more water, and its also a great cushin for the joints.


i am with ya on the solid food. but, 25 percent of my protein is whey, however, i eat 400 grams a day

[resonator]

Dilation of the blood vessels would provide a more efficient pathway for the blood to flow, thus lowering the stress on the heart and lowering the heart rate.

It's this simple:
Dilate your blood vessels and your blood pressure lowers. (ginko, arginine, vinpocetine)
Tighten your blood vessels and your blood pressure raises. (smoking, caffeine)

NO2 isn't a scam.

[mmaximus25]

i think what your saying is high pressure, better flow rate, low pressure slower flow rate

if NO2 relaxes smooth muscles around vessels, i dont see why this would impove the efficiency of each pump from the heart

again, hey im only in my second year, so by all means, if im wrong some body prove me wrong

exactly the opposite lower pressure higher flow

[Mizfit]

Dilation of the blood vessels would provide a more efficient pathway for te blood to flow, thus lowering the stress on the heart and lowering the heart rate.

It's this simple:
Dilate your blood vessels and your blood pressure lowers. (ginko, arginine, vinpocetine)
Tighten your blood vessels and your blood pressure raises. (smoking, caffeine)

NO2 isn't a scam.

maybe that is why i haven't exploded yet.. well accoding to this dude..

i take L-argnine and i drink alot of pop

[Mizfit]

thank-you all for convincing me to contiue drinking so much pop

[taiboxa]

thank-you all for convincing me to contiue drinking so much pop

i would love to see u w/ some cushin..
im SENDING u a crate of Cola!!! as we speak!!!!

[DDDNTZ]

Dilation of the blood vessels would provide a more efficient pathway for the blood to flow, thus lowering the stress on the heart and lowering the heart rate.

It's this simple:
Dilate your blood vessels and your blood pressure lowers. (ginko, arginine, vinpocetine)
Tighten your blood vessels and your blood pressure raises. (smoking, caffeine)

NO2 isn't a scam.

That's exactlt what I was thinking, if the vessell dialates, blood pressure should go down.

[IronReload04]

That's exactlt what I was thinking, if the vessell dialates, blood pressure should go down.

yes....blood pressure goes down. more volume = less pressure

but heart rate will probably go up


in response to resonator

from the cleveland clinic page, i highly respected medical center

When blood pressure remains very low, or when there is a sudden, rapid drop in blood pressure, an individual's performance and health may be significantly impaired. While patients with high blood pressure may have no symptoms, low blood pressure symptoms may prompt a patient to seek immediate medical attention. These symptoms may include:

Dizziness or lightheadedness
Blurry vision
Lack of concentration
Nausea or upset stomach
Muscle weakness
Fainting (syncope)
Rapid, weak pulse
Cold, clammy skin
Rapid shallow breathing
Fatigue
Headache

not saying NO2 will have effects severe with symtoms like this, but faster heart rate, not slower

Now since we are introducing a drug which is relaxing the muscles around the vessels, obviously these symtoms wont happen since our heart is healthy and fine. But my whole thing is its pumping harder to push the same fluid through a larger space

[IronReload04]

i didnt copy and past the thing

but one possible cause of low blood pressure

over dosing on medication to lower blood pressure or control high blood pressure

[resonator]

yes....blood pressure goes down. more volume = less pressure

but heart rate will probably go up


in response to resonator

from the cleveland clinic page, i highly respected medical center

When blood pressure remains very low, or when there is a sudden, rapid drop in blood pressure, an individual's performance and health may be significantly impaired. While patients with high blood pressure may have no symptoms, low blood pressure symptoms may prompt a patient to seek immediate medical attention. These symptoms may include:

Dizziness or lightheadedness
Blurry vision
Lack of concentration
Nausea or upset stomach
Muscle weakness
Fainting (syncope)
Rapid, weak pulse
Cold, clammy skin
Rapid shallow breathing
Fatigue
Headache

not saying NO2 will have effects severe with symtoms like this, but faster heart rate, not slower

Now since we are introducing a drug which is relaxing the muscles around the vessels, obviously these symtoms wont happen since our heart is healthy and fine. But my whole thing is its pumping harder to push the same fluid through a larger space

The higher the heart rate, the higher (potentially, assuming no change in stroke volume) the blood pressure. Therefore, the lower the heart rate, the lower the blood pressure.

In the case of severe low blood pressure, the heart would beat faster to compensate for the extremely low blood pressure.
Your blood pressure increases when you squat big, your heart starts racing. Now think of when youre blood pressure would be low, like when drifting off into sleep, your heart rate is slow while your blood pressure (ideally) is low.

[IronReload04]

The higher the heart rate, the higher (potentially, assuming no change in stroke volume) the blood pressure. Therefore, the lower the heart rate, the lower the blood pressure.

In the case of severe low blood pressure, the heart would beat faster to compensate for the extremely low blood pressure.
Your blood pressure increases when you squat big, your heart starts racing. Now think of when youre blood pressure would be low, like when drifting off into sleep, your heart rate is slow while your blood pressure (ideally) is low.

i think what your is saying makes perfect sense. But, if your blood pressure lowers, wont your heart initially try to work harder to get back to some kind of equilibrium if low blood pressure is caused by a substance that dialates the blood vessels. i dunno, my head is kind of spinning on the topic

[resonator]

No. Your heart beats with pressure according to a few factors, one of the most important factors being resistence in the vessel wall. If the resistence is low (clean arteries, dilated vessels) the heart doesn't have to beat as fast. If the resistence in the vessels is high (clogged arteries, constricted vessels) the heart rate increases. Think of it this way, constricting you arteries is like having clogged arteries. The heart has to pump harder, faster to force the blood through the vessels. I don't think your heart rate would increase to reach equilibrium. Your heart would appreciate the lowe blood pressure cause it doesn't have to work as hard to achieve the same blood flow. Good questions though.

[bda2424]

There are studies right now that are starting to suggest that NO helps DJD show up earlier and progress faster in people. Not cool with weightlifting.

[mmaximus25]

There are studies right now that are starting to suggest that NO helps DJD show up earlier and progress faster in people. Not cool with weightlifting.

whats DJD?

And what studies? I love when people say studies...

I'll stop some of you right now... if u mean articles that reference studies... becareful cuz some or most of those aren't studies... half of the articles people read are take from only parts of whole study that help the givens argument...

a true study in my opinion offers non-bais info and is basic pros and cons. I prefer studies that span over the coarse of more than a decade...
IMO shorter studies are investigative... and can be taken as the beginning of a concern or new finding... which will help further study and produce caution.

[SwoleCat]

NO2, Gakic, and a full line of MuscleTech supps is the sure fire way to win it all.


~SC~

[SwoleCat]

~SC~

[Mizfit]

~SC~

The God has spoken..

[IronReload04]

No. Your heart beats with pressure according to a few factors, one of the most important factors being resistence in the vessel wall. If the resistence is low (clean arteries, dilated vessels) the heart doesn't have to beat as fast. If the resistence in the vessels is high (clogged arteries, constricted vessels) the heart rate increases. Think of it this way, constricting you arteries is like having clogged arteries. The heart has to pump harder, faster to force the blood through the vessels. I don't think your heart rate would increase to reach equilibrium. Your heart would appreciate the lowe blood pressure cause it doesn't have to work as hard to achieve the same blood flow. Good questions though.

Everything makes sense. especially for an athlete vs a 65 year old with 30 percent bodyfat. ya, an athlete in tip top shape as a low blood pressure and lower than normal resting heart rate i guess. But still its different from introducing a chemical into the body i guess.

I had the whole garden hose analogy messed up. the analagy explains capillary beds sorry people for that misinformation.

..."as a result, the heart slows, and the arterioles in peripheral tussues dilate. If pressure in the larger arteries falls, the activity of the stretch receptrors decreases, stimulating sympathetic output to the arteries and arterioles while reducing parasympathetic output to the hearts pace maker. as a result, the heart beats faster, and the arterioles in peripheral tissues constrict. blah blah. so ya, the body will try to stay in equilibrium. this would explain increased heart rate in medicinal marijuana. the blood pressure falls so much, that the body begins to compensate a little to try to get back closer to normal. (my text book)



But i guess, if the atrioli receptors can block vasopressin (hormone which contrsicts the vessels to stabilize blood pressure, i guess heart rate wont increase.

i think low blood pressure will lead to increased heart rate to stabilize. but if blood pressure can be stable at a low blood pressure, i would guess heart rate would be slow, but still the heart will be dealing with more blood,.

but i guess the overall thing, is that maybe, no2 if it were to work, wouldnt decrease blood pressure enough to have to stabilize and or arginine can override contrictor hormones

[crash187ct]

supplements are stupid
infact ANYTHING LEGAL is LAME and worthless!

lol, i'm actually starting to believe that lol

[C_Bino]

I am almost certain, that for cardiac patients, arginine is injected into the patient. I dont think however that cardiac patients are recieving "patented NO2 pills"

If these pills truely delivered, the medical field would be looking into them, and as far as i know, the are not.

I could be wrong though

perhaps pills are useless



IN canada, maybe your authorities have some people that are saying, if this shit actually works, its not a good thing and lets take it off the shelf


perhaps the US is saying. **** it, it doesnt work, we're making money

Ok you cant be serious here. Of course doctors arent going to give patients fvckin NO xplode or some shit. Thats just retarded, your reasoning is just beyond me. Lets use your reasoning in another example, someone needs creatine to treat a neuro-muscular disorder, do you think the doctors are going to go out buy some cell-tech and give it to the patient? What a joke, how does that prove that NO2 doesnt work? Because its not administered by doctors. LMFAO.
Arginine WORKS no doubt about that. That is the key ingredient, what more do you want?

[IronReload04]

Ok you cant be serious here. Of course doctors arent going to give patients fvckin NO xplode or some shit. Thats just retarded, your reasoning is just beyond me. Lets use your reasoning in another example, someone needs creatine to treat a neuro-muscular disorder, do you think the doctors are going to go out buy some cell-tech and give it to the patient? What a joke, how does that prove that NO2 doesnt work? Because its not administered by doctors. LMFAO.
Arginine WORKS no doubt about that. That is the key ingredient, what more do you want?

doctors inject glutamine in burn patients and inject arginine in extremely large amounts in cardiac patients. so, what in gods name do you think a much much much smaller dose of a powder or pill is going to do?


What i meant is that the "pattented release forumula" could be of some use. on how this couldnt be of some interest?

and I would like to know just how exactly your so sure that it works?

[IronReload04]

C BIno maybe you can contribute to the cardiac effects of arginine

[C_Bino]

um, your reasoning aint much better

doctors inject glutamine in burn patients and inject arginine in extremely large amounts in cardiac patients. so, what in gods name do you think a much much much smaller dose of a powder or pill is going to do?

What i meant is that the "pattented release forumula" could be of some use. LMFAO on how this couldnt be of some interest

and I would like to know just how exactly your so sure that it works?

When did I ever mention MUCH SMALLER DOSES, and what do you even define as much smaller? Yould should actually read what I write before you respond.

How am I so sure that it works, well how are you so sure creatine works, as you stated earlier in this thread? Because that is the action that argining has...what else do you want me to say? I have used arginine with good results and know many people who do.

You yourself are saying arginine is used on cardiac patients, but now ask how I know it works. You are contradicting yourself. It appears that you agree arginine works but not NO2 products...makes no sense since arginine is the base ingredient in these products.