steroids and their different receptors?

[G-Force]

i was wandering if anyone had any info on which receptor each steroid gets attached to

i dont need info on this for every steroid just an idea of which compounds are good to mix together and which will compete for the same receptors

for instance i already know that deca and tren will compete for receptors so there is little point in taking them together

however tren and test is a different story
i have also heard of a synegistic effect that reasults from combining masteron and tren

are there any other examples
(hope this isnt too broad a question)

[Mesomorphyl]

Androgen Receptors... I may just be talking to talk, but isn't that it? I mean there are other causes of growth but these are the only receptors, right?

[vitor]

You have the androgen recepter(AR), and the non AR meditaded mechanism, which are the too basic recepters that steroids binds too. (Trenbolone have some muscle-building actions from other mechanisms as well). All muscle grow(protein syntheize) does not come from the AR, which explain why drugs like anadrol/D-bol are considdered greate bulking drugs, even though they have almost all their actions at the non-ar meditaded.

Testosterone is effective at both actually, which makes Test the most complete anabolic. Their are others drugs which have stronger binding affinty, though.

Its always best to make a stack that covers the AR+ the non AR meditaded, to create optimal "synergi" for Protein synthize, nitrogen retinsion so you get anabolic activity from all angels/recepters.

Tren, deca, primo, eq, anavar, masteron have most of their recepter binding at the AR.

Anadrol, D-bol, winstrol, Haloestin have their actions at the non AR meditaded. Some drugs can work diffrently at the same recepter as well like dbol and winstrol, which can be stacked together for added synergi.

But for example stacking Tren with something like eq, would be pretty pointless IMHO, as you will get no more mechanisms for creating muscle- hypothropy, as you would with trenbolone alone at a sufficent dose.

[G-Force]

You have the androgen recepter(AR), and the non AR meditaded mechanism, which are the too basic recepters that steroids binds too. (Trenbolone have some muscle-building actions from other mechanisms as well). All muscle grow(protein syntheize) does not come from the AR, which explain why drugs like anadrol/D-bol are considdered greate bulking drugs, even though they have almost all their actions at the non-ar meditaded.

Testosterone is effective at both actually, which makes Test the most complete anabolic. Their are others drugs which have stronger binding affinty, though.

Its always best to make a stack that covers the AR+ the non AR meditaded, to create optimal "synergi" for Protein synthize, nitrogen retinsion so you get anabolic activity from all angels/recepters.

Tren, deca, primo, eq, anavar, masteron have most of their recepter binding at the AR.

Anadrol, D-bol, winstrol, Haloestin have their actions at the non AR meditaded. Some drugs can work diffrently at the same recepter as well like dbol and winstrol, which can be stacked together for added synergi.

But for example stacking Tren with something like eq, would be pretty pointless IMHO, as you will get no more mechanisms for creating muscle- hypothropy, as you would with trenbolone alone at a sufficent dose.

excellent info
just what i was lookiing for

cheers

[arnold_of_malta]

a good cycle will be deca, testosterone and d ball its one of the best bulkers

[BG]

I found Test,tren and GH to work the best together.

[shortie]

You have the androgen recepter(AR), and the non AR meditaded mechanism, which are the too basic recepters that steroids binds too. (Trenbolone have some muscle-building actions from other mechanisms as well). All muscle grow(protein syntheize) does not come from the AR, which explain why drugs like anadrol/D-bol are considdered greate bulking drugs, even though they have almost all their actions at the non-ar meditaded.

Testosterone is effective at both actually, which makes Test the most complete anabolic. Their are others drugs which have stronger binding affinty, though.

Its always best to make a stack that covers the AR+ the non AR meditaded, to create optimal "synergi" for Protein synthize, nitrogen retinsion so you get anabolic activity from all angels/recepters.

Tren, deca, primo, eq, anavar, masteron have most of their recepter binding at the AR.

Anadrol, D-bol, winstrol, Haloestin have their actions at the non AR meditaded. Some drugs can work diffrently at the same recepter as well like dbol and winstrol, which can be stacked together for added synergi.

But for example stacking Tren with something like eq, would be pretty pointless IMHO, as you will get no more mechanisms for creating muscle- hypothropy, as you would with trenbolone alone at a sufficent dose.

Good stuff Vitor-

[G-Force]

I found Test,tren and GH to work the best together.

thats what i will be doin next time

[G-Force]

bump

how about tren and var (with test obviously)

these are both binding at the AR - would it be pretty pointless combining the two?

[vitor]

Tren and var is pointless IMO, for those reasens explained above. If one was to use a very light dose of Tren, I guess the var could be of some benefit though.

[G-Force]

Tren and var is pointless IMO, for those reasens explained above. If one was to use a very light dose of Tren, I guess the var could be of some benefit though.

point noted

looks like dbol and var would be good together

although i've never heard of anyone combining them
at least not at the same time

[vitor]

point noted

looks like dbol and var would be good together

although i've never heard of anyone combining them
at least not at the same time

Yes, D-bol and Var should stack greate. Ive talked to people who has had sucess with that combo.

[Liftnainez]

Yes, D-bol and Var should stack greate. Ive talked to people who has had sucess with that combo.

Same here.. G-force I have heard great things about this combo..

[G-Force]

well i'm keen to give it a go - ive always had amazing results with Dbol - i can only imagine what it'd be like stacked with var

my next cycle is already set tho - Short High Intesity

150mg prop ED
100mg Tren

cost me **** for 4 weeks

[BajanBastard]

You have the androgen recepter(AR), and the non AR meditaded mechanism, which are the too basic recepters that steroids binds too. (Trenbolone have some muscle-building actions from other mechanisms as well). All muscle grow(protein syntheize) does not come from the AR, which explain why drugs like anadrol/D-bol are considdered greate bulking drugs, even though they have almost all their actions at the non-ar meditaded.

Testosterone is effective at both actually, which makes Test the most complete anabolic. Their are others drugs which have stronger binding affinty, though.

Its always best to make a stack that covers the AR+ the non AR meditaded, to create optimal "synergi" for Protein synthize, nitrogen retinsion so you get anabolic activity from all angels/recepters.

Tren, deca, primo, eq, anavar, masteron have most of their recepter binding at the AR.

Anadrol, D-bol, winstrol, Haloestin have their actions at the non AR meditaded. Some drugs can work diffrently at the same recepter as well like dbol and winstrol, which can be stacked together for added synergi.

But for example stacking Tren with something like eq, would be pretty pointless IMHO, as you will get no more mechanisms for creating muscle- hypothropy, as you would with trenbolone alone at a sufficent dose.

I guess i could elaborate a bit futher but i'm sleepy as hell rithe now. A little later.

[G-Force]

I guess i could elaborate a bit futher but i'm sleepy as hell rithe now. A little later.

do it

you know u wana

[G-Force]

bump for bajan bastard
formerly known as big Klg

any input?
we need input

[Ntpadude]

a good cycle will be deca, testosterone and d ball its one of the best bulkers

The explaination is very good but maybe too over simplified. For examine on paper it looks as though tren, deca and EQ all do exactly the same things, however they all have very different effects in the end...

For example, tren and deca are not exactly the same as well as EQ. EQ is known to actually aromatase into Testosterone (about 5 to 10% of EQ in blood stream), therefore EQ only cycles arent plagued with deca dick like problems.

Deca does not trigger very much body hair growth, deepening of voice, it definately does not activate sex drive receptors but does not block them. Trenbalone on the other hand will keep you shaving 3 times a day, it probably triggers more body hair growth then anything else, hair grows out of back and places it never grew before when on trenbalone... as far as sex drive, it is 50/50. Some guys on trenbalone ONLY cycles say they are totally deca dicked and not functional in bed, the other half say their wives/girlfriends can encourage a hard on and once there can function normally - myself that is how tren works with me... dont particularly want sex but if wife gets sexy on me... I am ready to rock and roll. We havent found anyone yet on a deca only cycle that didnt have total loss of sex drive.

There are other differences too... tren grows muscle and no fat and you tend to grow very "dry and shredded", whereas deca can bulk the fat right along with the muscle and you get bloated with tons of water weight. Also deca has very little effect on your emotionalism, trenbalone can make you either into a roid raged maniac or a crying bumbling fool, but in either case, trenbalone is going to have pronounced effects on your emotional wellbeing.

[BajanBastard]

Ok, androgens bind to the androgen receptor (AR), Glucocorticoids receptor (GR), estrogen receptor (ER) and progesterone receptor (PgR) all with different relative binding affinity (RBA). The RBA basically compares the steroid hormone binding to the receptor to the parent hormone.

Testosterone mainly binds to the AR and works as an anti-catabolic (actually testosterone's main action) by binding to the (GcR) inhibiting their catabolic actions. Testosterone has little to no PgR binding.

19-nor's like trenbolone bind to the AR, GcR and also the PgR. 19-nor's typically bind better to the AR than test and also inhibit the action of glucocorticoids well. Being progestins they also can bind to the PgR, depending on the 19-nor, the RBA can range from 20% (nandrolone) too 200+% (17-methyl-nandrolone).

Other AAS can also directly act upon the ER, oxymetholone and methandriol are such steroids.

Edit: Oh and like Vitor said. Some steroids don't bind to the AR, well at all. Oxymetholone is 'too low to be measured'. Most 'orals' (17aa) steroids have a very low RBA for a AR. They grow muscle via other mechanisms which are not fully understood. Dbol, winny, A-bombs are examples.

[vitor]

Nptadude- I didnt say that Tren, deca and eq does the same thing, yust that is doesnt make alot of sense to use them together in the same stack. What you said in your post doesnt really have anything to do with recepter binding. The reasen why deca has less androgenic sides than trenbolone is b/c it is a much milder androgen, who also gets converted to DHN thrue the 5ar, which makes it milder in the hair, skin, and for aggression and hair-growth than other androgens.

Part of the reasen why deca can be a disaster for libido is b/c it have little affects on nerve-cells, especially those nerve-cells that is responseable for sexual-function.

[1buffsob]

Ok, androgens bind to the androgen receptor (AR), Glucocorticoids receptor (GR), estrogen receptor (ER) and progesterone receptor (PgR) all with different relative binding affinity (RBA). The RBA basically compares the steroid hormone binding to the receptor to the parent hormone.

Testosterone mainly binds to the AR and works as an anti-catabolic (actually testosterone's main action) by binding to the (GcR) inhibiting their catabolic actions. Testosterone has little to no PgR binding.

19-nor's like trenbolone bind to the AR, GcR and also the PgR. 19-nor's typically bind better to the AR than test and also inhibit the action of glucocorticoids well. Being progestins they also can bind to the PgR, depending on the 19-nor, the RBA can range from 20% (nandrolone) too 200+% (17-methyl-nandrolone).

Other AAS can also directly act upon the ER, oxymetholone and methandriol are such steroids.

Sweet ass post.

1buffsob

[G-Force]

great info thanks

big klg - do u agree with vitor that it is pointless to use var and tren in the same cycle?

[BajanBastard]

I agree and disagree. I was going to use EQ with my tren & test cycle. When you look at boldenone undecylenate; a weak drug attached to a long ester it really doesn't make it worth it to stack with tren.

Here is where is disagree with Vitor. Although two AAS bind well to the AR it doesn't mean that they cannot be stacked. Each steroid affects the DNA differently when it attaches to the AR. This is where synergistic stacking comes into play.

IMO the best cycle(s) consist of;

Testosterone
19-nor steroid
DHT derived steroid which binds to the AR strongly
Steroid that binds to the AR poorly.

Eg Test prop, tren A, Masteron, Winny (injected) or Test E, Deca, 1-test cyp, T-bol/D-bol. (injected)

[G-Force]

would it be too much to ask for a list of all the

19-nor steroid
DHT derived steroid which binds to the AR strongly
Steroid that binds to the AR poorly.

or should i just do my own research?

[BajanBastard]

That's a lot man.

19-NORs

Nandrolone
Trenbolone
Trestolone
M4OHN
Meribolone
Metribolone
Norethandrolone

DHT derivatives with good/high AR-RBA.

DHT
Drostanolone
1-testosterone
Methenolone
Mesterolone
Oxandrolone
Mestanolone
Stenbolone

Non/poor AR-RBA

Oxymetholone
Stanozolol
Furazabol*
Methyl-1-testosterone
Methandrostenolone



*Unsure.

[Tren Bull]

i was under the impression that there are two types of steroid receptors. test receptors and nandrolone (nor test receptors)

[guest589745]

typically to cover all yer bases, you want a dht/19nor and.....I forget the other.....damnit..

[Tren Bull]

a good cycle will be deca, testosterone and d ball its one of the best bulkers

oh yea, thats a great stack. imo it would be even better with some winni added in there

typically to cover all yer bases, you want a dht/19nor and.....I forget the other.....damnit..

wouldnt the third one be a regular test base?

[guest589745]

Most 'orals' (17aa) steroids have a very low RBA for a AR. They grow muscle via other mechanisms which are not fully understood. Dbol, winny, A-bombs are examples.

Just to throw out something that I thought was interesting...

There have been studies of Dbol done on rats with their pituitary gland removed and supposedly when the gland was removed, the Dbol exhibited no anabolic properties, strongly suggesting that most of the growth attributed to Dbol use, is a result largely due to GH secretion.

I thought that was interesting at least.

wouldnt the third one be a regular test base?

bajan already listed it, I didnt read the whole post before posting.

i was under the impression that there are two types of steroid receptors. test receptors and nandrolone (nor test receptors)

Nah, read the whole thread. Big K put some good info in.

[vitor]

There are only a single gene in DNA of each cell that codes for the AR, the DNA code is copied to mRNA. The rate of this process can either increase or decrease depending on what others proteins are bound to the DNA at the time.

And since there are only a single gene that codes for the AR, 2 steroids with the same binding-affinity will compete for the same recepter, thats why stacking more and more drugs isnt more effective. You only have so many open androgen-recepters in the muscle.

Therefor, I belive that Trenbolone is the only aas needed at the AR(with the exeption of test maybe.) For stronger anabolism, yust increase the Tren dosage.

Other people have other opinions, but thats the only thing that makes sense in my head, from the way I understand it.

[oswaldosalcedo]

The explaination is very good but maybe too over simplified. For examine on paper it looks as though tren, deca and EQ all do exactly the same things, however they all have very different effects in the end...

For example, tren and deca are not exactly the same as well as EQ. EQ is known to actually aromatase into Testosterone (about 5 to 10% of EQ in blood stream), therefore EQ only cycles arent plagued with deca dick like problems.

Deca does not trigger very much body hair growth, deepening of voice, it definately does not activate sex drive receptors but does not block them. Trenbalone on the other hand will keep you shaving 3 times a day, it probably triggers more body hair growth then anything else, hair grows out of back and places it never grew before when on trenbalone... as far as sex drive, it is 50/50. Some guys on trenbalone ONLY cycles say they are totally deca dicked and not functional in bed, the other half say their wives/girlfriends can encourage a hard on and once there can function normally - myself that is how tren works with me... dont particularly want sex but if wife gets sexy on me... I am ready to rock and roll. We havent found anyone yet on a deca only cycle that didnt have total loss of sex drive.

There are other differences too... tren grows muscle and no fat and you tend to grow very "dry and shredded", whereas deca can bulk the fat right along with the muscle and you get bloated with tons of water weight. Also deca has very little effect on your emotionalism, trenbalone can make you either into a roid raged maniac or a crying bumbling fool, but in either case, trenbalone is going to have pronounced effects on your emotional wellbeing.

then, i dont wish tren!

[G-Force]

thanks again BB - you certainly know your sh~!t

[statuZ]

Quick question

Is Oral Turinabol a Non/poor AR-RBA? Like instead of using winny or a-bombs, is OT just as good?

[Xtralarg]

Good thread!

[BajanBastard]

Quick question

Is Oral Turinabol a Non/poor AR-RBA? Like instead of using winny or a-bombs, is OT just as good?

Yeah i believe it is.

[*Narkissos*]

For example, tren and deca are not exactly the same as well as EQ. EQ is known to actually aromatase into Testosterone (about 5 to 10% of EQ in blood stream), therefore EQ only cycles arent plagued with deca dick like problems.

What?!!?! EQ 'aromatise' into testosterone?
And that's why EQ-only cycles aren't plagued with libido problems?

Hell Nah!

EQ is a test-derivative.

A substance can't 'aromatise' into testosterone.

The aromatization process is that where Testosterone, via the aromatase enzyme, is converted to ESTROGEN!

[*Narkissos*]

IMO the best cycle(s) consist of;

Testosterone
19-nor steroid
DHT derived steroid which binds to the AR strongly
Steroid that binds to the AR poorly.

Eg Test prop, tren A, Masteron, Winny (injected) or Test E, Deca, 1-test cyp, T-bol/D-bol. (injected)

*wipes tears from eyes*

[G-Force]

Eg Test prop, tren A, Masteron, Winny (injected) or Test E, Deca, 1-test cyp, T-bol/D-bol. (injected)

what is 1-test cyp

if it is just regular cyp - why stack it with enan?

[shortie]

[*Narkissos*]

what is 1-test cyp

if it is just regular cyp - why stack it with enan?

nope... 1-testosterone cypionate is a DHT-derivative.

(17beta-hydroxy-5alpha-androst-1-en-3-one... dht-derived, but with supposedly fewer DHT-related side effects.)