2nd and FINAL cycle advice, please!

[MalumVeneficus]

Hey. I'm 23 years old, 5' 10", and 185 lbs.

My training history: I trained for about a year before my first cycle, getting up to about 170. My first cycle was a 10-week Tbol 50mg ED/Var 60mg ED, and I dropped the Tbol off at 6 weeks due to advice and supplies.

Okay, I know the Tbol/Var stack was a liver gamble, but I tested fine throughout. I'm not afraid of it, though I know the risk...but I want to do it again. It was my first cycle, gained like, 15 lb. of rock hard muscle, very pleased with the results. I know that it is probably just because beginners respond to damn near anything.

Well, I want to do one more cycle, to get a little bigger. I don't want to juice for my whole life, I just want to gain some quality weight, and lower the workload in the gym to just keep it for a long time. I think that one more cycle will get me where I want to be, but I have a few questions...

I want to use Test Prop, EQ, Winny (INJECTIBLE winny, please do NOT counsel me against orals, I'm not stupid.) in addition to the Var and Tbol. I'll use L-Dex thru the cycle, and Clomid/Nolva/L-dex for PCT.

So, I'm asking for advice on whether or not this looks like a good combo for my goals...

I'm 185 right now. I literally lost almost NO weight after my last cycle, and I didn't gain a whole hell of a lot for a beginner's first cycle, but it was all good. Now, I know I am NOT going to gain the same weight off the same cycle, and if I want anything like those gains again, I'm gonna have to go with test. I like test Prop, because of the lower chances of sides. And obviously, the EQ/Winny/Tbol/Var thing should make it clear that I'm NOT TRYING TO BULK for any reason, I just want to gain a little more solid, quality muscle.

Well, in addition to advice on whether or not this is a good combo of compounds, I'm also curious about dosing. With the Tbol and Var, I'll keep the same dose, and drop the Tbol after 6 weeks again. The Test Prop, I was thinking 500mg/week, split into ED or EOD shots (what do you think?), and the EQ at 600mg/week. I don't know about the Winny, I don't know how to dose injectible Winny.

Also, I was thinking another 10-12 wk cycle. When should I drop off on the Prop, EQ and Winny? Like I said, Tbol is done after 6wks, and Var run throughout until PCT.

Please, guys, you're the ones that know your sh1t. Can I get some help with timing and numbers, maybe a lil advice? Remember, this is my last cycle, and after this I'm going to a "maintenance" workout routine, I'm happy to workout for my health for the rest of my life, but I do not want to devote myself to constantly bodybuilding for life. That's why I only worked out for a year before my first cycle. I may be limiting myself by not maximizing my genetic potential, but I do not want to. I would LIKE to end up at 205, ripped, and keep it for a LONG time.

So hey, how should I dose this? And did I miss anything that makes me seem really stupid? (heh, I can just picture someone popping my bubble with "Test Prop and Eq for SOLID gains? You're a moron!" LOL well, I doubt it, but you get the idea.)

I'm new to these compounds (except Tbol and Var), and you guys arent. What do you think?

[odix]

prop and eq are fine...all steroids are different with keepable gains, but if you do proper PCT, and you can close the margin sufficiently.

[Erwin]

This is your second cycle and your first one was orals so you have never shot ED. Think you are up to it? Being a pin cushion gets old after awhile. Why 5 compounds? How will you know which ones are working for you. Try the test prop and the winny. Save or sell the other stuff. Sounds like you are trying to use up everything you have left in this "LAST" cycle. And remember that injected winny is every bit as liver toxic as oral winny. Just run a couple and you will see good gains off of that if your dieat and training are in check. Keep it simple and you will succeed. JMHO-Erwin

P.S. if you want to be 205 and keep it for a long time then Eat and get there before your next cycle.

[Drummerboy]

Best advice? Your over doing it. Test/EQ/Var stack is where i would go.
week 1-10 500 test prop
week 1-? ?? EQ (up to you)
week 5-10 var 50mg ED

PCT with nolva, aromasin, and maybe HCG if needed. Have the PCT stuff on hand before you start, just in case. That cycle will show you great results, you dont need 5 compounds. eat and train right, and you'll explode.

~DB~

[penfold]

hmm the famous last cycle hey lmao well I'd agree with the above cycle and I'd run the eq at 600 mg a week and the var at 60mg as its a weak drug.

also run the test prop for 3 weeks after the eq finishes and start your pct 3 days after your last prop jab.

pen

[MalumVeneficus]

Alright. So, looks like cutting a couple of them might be a good idea...I liked the idea of the three liver-toxic ones, I guess, because they don't give much gains but they're solid/lasting.

But if I had to stick with only one, and run a Prop/EQ cycle, would I see more lasting, quality results by running Var, T-bol, or Winny with it? I'm more interested in adding quality and density to what the Prop/EQ will slab on.

Thanks for the advice. Diet is one of my personal favorite aspects of all of this, actually, and I keep it pretty on point, so to speak. PCT is good, but I try to base my expectations on losing as if PCT was minimal, sort of a way of letting myself be surprised, I guess, and not disappointed. Also, I have a pretty strict and comprehensive supplement schedule, that I feel maximizes the body's ability to synthesize protein in an AAS cycle...maybe I'll post sometime, pretty interesting.

Oh, and I'm not afraid of needles, really. If I'm only at it for a few months, it's fine. Otherwise, I'd have shied away from the Prop, and ran something I could hit twice a week. Also, I heard it's the best test to run with Var, for quality gains. Yea? Nay? What do you think?

Heh, and what about running a long HGH cycle that ran from two months pre-cycle to four weeks post-PCT?

[MalumVeneficus]

Oh, and about the inj. winny, didn't know that. I thought it was the orals that had the liver-toxic liver-bypassing formulation, because only 17-alpha-alkylated compounds damaged the liver, and one would only 17-aa an oral compound, right? If wrong, I apologize, I was under a grave misconception about Winny.

[MalumVeneficus]

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