second cycle...true hard gainer?

[skinnykenney]

6' tall
170 pounds
5 percent BF
working out since high school off and on but hard core for the last three or more years
i used to weigh only 145 pounds when i started.....i worked hard to get to the 170 lbs i ate,restedand lifted like crazy,as much as my body would allow.....when i hit 158 ponds or so i stoped gaining so i altered my lifting thinking this would shock my muscles and help me grow......it did'nt work.....so after tons of research Ilooked into and did a eight week cycle of sust EOD with a weekly intake of 750mg total and finally reached 170lbs......what would you sugest to do for my second cycle for a true hard gainer.....I eat right rest and work hard....here is what i have to work with:
sust
prop
eq
cyp
en
prim
tren ac
AI,nolva,clomid,HCG
anadrol
dbol

[Big]

list your diet in detail, including macros.

[Johnny_Rotten]

Hate to sound like 'that guy' bro, but i think you should get your diet in check. 170 at 6 ft is anorexic status.

Not flaming, i'd just like to see your diet.

[skinnykenney]

list your diet in detail, including macros.

forgive me for not knowing but what is macros?
wake up=protien shake with carbs added and within a half hour a complex carb and some high quality pritien that equals at least about 20grams of protien...mid morning=snack usually a turkey sandwich and more carbs....lunch=high quality protien at at least 20grams and more complex carbs....early afternoon=protien shake with complex carbs added.....diner high quality protien at least 20grams and complex carb....late afternoon=snack of some more turkey or ham on a sandwich and some carbs.....the ham is a rarety and I hardly ever eat red meat....no soda,pie,cake if so hardly ever......Drink tea all day about 3/4-1 gallon a day.....I have been down the suplement road from all the suplement stores but it never works at all....other than the protien and complex carbs,creatine or the nitric oxide drinks i think they are a scam of the worst sort!A LEGAL ONE!as you can tell i dont eat vegies or fruit cant stand either one....
if I forgot any thing let me know.....thanks....and hope you have a great day/night!....I'll be back tommorrow

[sassbs11]

Hate to sound like 'that guy' bro, but i think you should get your diet in check. 170 at 6 ft is anorexic status.

Not flaming, i'd just like to see your diet.

but 5%bf, not that anorexic, stats dont always tell the true story

[Big]

Let's start with the totals, how many grams of protein, fat, and carbs per day, and how many total calories per day?

[Big]

but 5%bf, not that anorexic, stats dont always tell the true story

Neither do the posters lol
I wonder if he had it measure at 5%

[sassbs11]

yeah big very true m8, but hey i'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

[Big]

yeah, it's definitely possible.

[skinnykenney]

Hate to sound like 'that guy' bro, but i think you should get your diet in check. 170 at 6 ft is anorexic status.

thanks for making me feel better LOL.....just joking.....but man it seems like I'm full all day.....all I do is eat fat people make fun of me because if itLOL!.....man I hope its the diet and you guys can help me.....just remember you cant make me eat my veggies or fruit....i just cant stand them but more so the fruit......just think how I felt in high school at 6' 145.....thanks....

Not flaming, i'd just like toyour diet.

see

man i just had to post like thi so i didnt have to type this agai because i put it in the middle of your post...hope it works

[skinnykenney]

didnt work ....oh well

[skinnykenney]

yeah, it's definitely possible.

it was three percent untill i hit th shakes and food hard.....and i did a junk food diet once just to see if I would gain fat easier but no cant gain fat easy either.....the body fat thing is due to soccer i played untill i stoped so much cardio to see if it will help.....i was at the doctor yesterday thats when i found out I was at 7percent......he also checked my liver HDL?LDL and T count..... my dad doesnt even exercise and his BF measurment was 12percent when i took him to the doc last(he cant drive) I think thats where I get the low BF from....he is 5'11 about135 and my brother 5'10 145 4percent BF.....and i had thyroid checked.... no problem there....

[Ostrich]

I dont know man, I wouldlike to see what 3%BF looks like. Not to sure its possible unless your decomposing!

[SaSqUaDgE]

I dont know man, I wouldlike to see what 3%BF looks like. Not to sure its possible unless your decomposing!

you never seen 3% bf before? ha its possible

[skinnykenney]

guys please help.....iam new here and dont want to be another one of those jerks so dont take this the wrong way but we have lost track of my main topic......i work hard eat a ton 3000-3500cal aday and rest....please help with my next cycle......my diet is great!.......believe it or not my BF is that low.....if i didnt have so many tattoos i would post a pic...be back later thanks and best regards!

[PT]

you never seen 3% bf before? ha its possible

i have seen people as low as 3% during a competition. obviously its not healthe to be below 6-7% for a long period of time

[PT]

guys please help.....iam new here and dont want to be another one of those jerks so dont take this the wrong way but we have lost track of my main topic......i work hard eat a ton 3000-3500cal aday and rest....please help with my next cycle......my diet is great!.......believe it or not my BF is that low.....if i didnt have so many tattoos i would post a pic...be back later thanks and best regards!

3000 calories is what i have for dinner when im bulking bro so you best up that to about 5500. hit up the diet section and you will have a better idea of how to gain weight

[Ostrich]

Im between 5000-6000 cals during buling cycle.

[Bolo1982]

20 grams of preotien per meal is way too low. I would up that to 40 - 50 grams per meal 6 meals a day. that makes it 300 grams at 1200 calories. I would take in 100 grams of complex carbs forthe first 4 meals. 400 grams at 1600 calories. And take in 100 grams of healthy fats throughout the day. that would add 900 calories. So you would consume about 3700 calories. That should help you grow. You can manage a seventh meal wouldn't hurt taking your calorie count to 4300. Lift compound movements and stay away from cardio if you 5% bodyfat.

[_007]

Shakes are only good for pre-post workout your getting full on shakes, its not helping your appitite.

[skinnykenney]

3000 calories is what i have for dinner when im bulking bro so you best up that to about 5500. hit up the diet section and you will have a better idea of how to gain weight

i will check out the diet section.......i talked to a nutritionist and they swrear that once you reach about 3500cal in a24hour period the rest of the calories are basically just passing thrugh your system.....they suggested i eat less meals and more at each sitting but that just makes people i know get fat!....i dont know how i could fit any more into my stomach i am full all day......I will look in the diet section get my diet in check and get back to everyone.....and to the other guy how the heck are you eating and more so what are you eating at one sitting that equals 3000 quality calories?seriously!
.....I do not want to be a huge muscle man and have fat covering it up making me look even fatter in clothing!.....i want to be bigger but also be looking good and hard after all of this not turn it into the battle of the buldge.
....and I am not saying you are fat please don't take it that way......but that much food would make even me fat!......but you may be it diferent than some people.....thaks guys ill check in on this thread and in the mean time check my diet......and ask more about the cycle soon after....
best wishes!!!!!!!!

[Epic1]

I used to think i was a hard gainer..and thought that i needed super high doses with aas to get any gains. But after all the frustration i spent alot of time figuring out my diet. I was about 2000 calories under what i needed daily. Seriosulsy everyone preaches it...and its gets annoying to read.. But diet is seriously ATLEAST 80% of the full equation of body building.

[skinnykenney]

20 grams of preotien per meal is way too low. I would up that to 40 - 50 grams per meal 6 meals a day. that makes it 300 grams at 1200 calories. I would take in 100 grams of complex carbs forthe first 4 meals. 400 grams at 1600 calories. And take in 100 grams of healthy fats throughout the day. that would add 900 calories. So you would consume about 3700 calories. That should help you grow. You can manage a seventh meal wouldn't hurt taking your calorie count to 4300. Lift compound movements and stay away from cardio if you 5% bodyfat.

very sorry but the protien intake in my diet was off.....at least 20grams per meal was what i used to eat........my ole' lady just informed me it's more like 40 grams at least per meal that i eat.....so my diet fits right along with the intake described above......the shakes dont make me full and not able to eat i have a very strange motabolism they actually make me very hungry and I usually have to eat within .5-1 hour after a shake everytime.....I have even tried setting an alarm and eating in the middle of the night but it did'nt work.....I quit cardio.....my diet comes out to enough to build muscle because I have buddies who dont eat as much protien or nearly as good as me and they blow me away!.....my mom could'nt keep enough food around even when I only weighed 145lbs.....now please help me it has been 9years and I have tried it all.....I can't fit anymore in my stomach and.....IMO more than3500-4000calories in a 24 hour time frame will just pass through and not be absorbed.....I hav been to a nutritionist and was told this.....so what could you recommend with what I have this time around? PLEASE answer this for me I HAVE TRIED IT ALL AND IT WONT WORK WITH ME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[xXDevilDogXx]

To answer your first post:

12 weeks of en (or cyp) at 500mgs + Eq (400 mgs maybe)
weeks 1-4 add dbol to the equation.


Now, to jump on the bandwagon. You gotta eat. Whole foods are the best. Shakes only before and after workouts and only whey shakes (add in some calories right after you train, something like 4 pieces of white bread with jelly on each). Then if you can add a high calorie weight gainer before you go to sleep. You will not get fat. You are only 7% bf, you will not get fat (yes, I said it twice.)

[bernimx]

Then if you can add a high calorie weight gainer before you go to sleep. You will not get fat. You are only 7% bf, you will not get fat (yes, I said it twice.)

I do not see the point of drinking a high calorie weight gainer before going to sleep other than gaining fat ? If he needs more calories, he only has to eat more in his meals during the day. To me, your theory sounds like: ''you are 7%, get that up to as least 15%''. Plus, he wants to stay lean, and who doesn't anyway. Wouldn't a clean ~500 calories over maintenance diet be fine?

[testosterona]

bump

[bladerunner9]

20 grams of preotien per meal is way too low. I would up that to 40 - 50 grams per meal 6 meals a day. that makes it 300 grams at 1200 calories. I would take in 100 grams of complex carbs forthe first 4 meals. 400 grams at 1600 calories. And take in 100 grams of healthy fats throughout the day. that would add 900 calories. So you would consume about 3700 calories. That should help you grow. You can manage a seventh meal wouldn't hurt taking your calorie count to 4300. Lift compound movements and stay away from cardio if you 5% bodyfat.

Bolo, Man you are 100% right. I once had the same incident wat skinnykenny is going through. Well if you really want to go for shakes then
add 4 raw eggs + and protein + two large banana and have this shake instantly after workout. Its really really good and has worked wonder for my skinny friends.
And are you taking all this stuff or planning to take this ? :- sust
prop,eq,cyp,en,lomid,HCG,anadrol,dbol etc. ?
if you have not then go for a basic beginner schedule of Deca +Test E and Anadrol. I made my friend do this who was 6' 2" and 159lbs and in 5 weeks he gained 20 lbs. Now i think thats a good one. But as BOLO has said keep strict eye on your eating.

[skinnykenney]

Bolo, Man you are 100% right. I once had the same incident wat skinnykenny is going through. Well if you really want to go for shakes then
add 4 raw eggs + and protein + two large banana and have this shake instantly after workout. Its really really good and has worked wonder for my skinny friends.
And are you taking all this stuff or planning to take this ? :- sust
prop,eq,cyp,en,lomid,HCG,anadrol,dbol etc. ?
if you have not then go for a basic beginner schedule of Deca +Test E and Anadrol. I made my friend do this who was 6' 2" and 159lbs and in 5 weeks he gained 20 lbs. Now i think thats a good one. But as BOLO has said keep strict eye on your eating.

no i am not planning to take this stuff all at the same time......I was testing out a few places that guys at the gym told me about and I got lucky everything made it except one order and they took care of it very fast so that s why I have so much at once.......
look in my post erlier you wil notice I do not like fruit (a.k.a. bananas,)LOL cake, pie or veggies.....and there is no way on Gods green earth I will injest a raw egg no matter how good it tastes!.......



what about this guys,I wake up so hungry that I am ill feeling (hypo).......you think I should try to wake up in the middle of the night and drink a protien/carb shake.....because if I wake up feeling good I can start eating right away and not have to drink the shake first thing in the morning to settle my stomach enough to eat?
Thanks for everyones help!


P.S.when i get my diet under control what would you recomend for a second cycle......look in my earlir post and you will see what I have to work with......

[FireGuy]

You might just be a hardcore ectomorph and no drugs or diet in the world is going to change that. You can still make some quality gains but face it, not everyone has the genetic potential to look like a competitive bodybuilder.

[skinnykenney]

To answer your first post:

12 weeks of en (or cyp) at 500mgs + Eq (400 mgs maybe)
weeks 1-4 add dbol to the equation.


Now, to jump on the bandwagon. You gotta eat. Whole foods are the best. Shakes only before and after workouts and only whey shakes (add in some calories right after you train, something like 4 pieces of white bread with jelly on each). Then if you can add a high calorie weight gainer before you go to sleep. You will not get fat. You are only 7% bf, you will not get fat (yes, I said it twice.)

man aas and tons of colesterol? I dont know that sounds like a heart attack down the road!......some of the protien has so much colesterol that you are at 100percent of your dayly intake for the day......If i am not mistaken whey has a lot of colesterol in it.....I work out at least 6 days a week if not seven days so other than the early shake the shakes are getting drank either while lifting,after lifting or just before workout.....i have done the after workout bread thing it didnt do any thing but piss off the ole'lady because she had to go to the store so much because i wouldnt tell her i ate a fourth of a loaf after she fell asleep......man it seems like I tried it all but dont give up on me guys,please! eventualy someone will tell me about something i have not tried or I will try (joking about the raw eggs again)



THANKS A TON FOR EVERYONES HELP AND INPUT SO FAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[skinnykenney]

thanks everyone...been eating a lot more since the start of this thread and using some of the things sugested......I'm giong to keep eating good and make sure my diet is on track for at least 4 weeks before I cycle again!
looks like eating is going to be the hardest part of my training!

[legobricks]

thanks everyone...been eating a lot more since the start of this thread and using some of the things sugested......I'm giong to keep eating good and make sure my diet is on track for at least 4 weeks before I cycle again!
looks like eating is going to be the hardest part of my training!

Wow Ive never heard words spoken so truly by someone new to this!


Yes, not only is dieting hard by consuming, but also finding out what your body needs and constantly adjusting it almost like math.

[skinnykenney]

Wow Ive never heard words spoken so truly by someone new to this!


Yes, not only is dieting hard by consuming, but also finding out what your body needs and constantly adjusting it almost like math.

yea it is like it is the only thing on my mind"EAT","EAT",EAT!
Take care and thanks a mil for your help!