I know where people are getting the D-bol only cycles are Ok from!!

[ninesecz]

Just spent the last few hours reading the newest edition of LLewellyns Anabolics 9th Edition (2009 copy)

There are a few pages of these in there

Basucally they are written out as beginner cycles. there is this one, then there is a stage 2 D-bol only cycle.
He also has a couple Anadrol Only Cycles listed in there too

Starting to understand a little better why these people keep coming to the forum wanting to run D-bol only and then get frustrated when we tell them not to!
The $50 Anabolics Bible is turning around and telling them it is a suitable 1st mass cycle and there is no issues at all wioth a beginner running this type of cycle

So Please let us all stop flaming NOOBS for proposing cycles like this!! Some of them are obviously trying to do research and are getting frustated because they are getting 2 completely different answers from 2 different sources!

Sample Steroid Cycles:
The following cycles are presented as examples of common steroid administration protocols. These programs have not been evaluated in a clinical setting for safety and efficacy, and are provided for informational purposes only. These are not recommendations for anabolic/androgenic steroid use. As with any supplemental drug program, it is important to examine your own individual health status, health risks, and performance goals before deciding to engage in any anabolic/androgenic steroid use. For those who have made the decision, it is important to emphasize again that the recommended approach to AAS use is to limit drug intake to the lowest levels necessary to achieve the next rational goal. More aggressive cycles should not be attempted unless one is sure they cannot achieve the results needed on a more moderate program. Note that given the difficulty in predicting androgenic threshold and dosages for female users, the below cycles are examples of programs for men only.
Single Agent Cycles

Products:
100 tablets 5 mg Methandrostenolone

All Weeks:

Liver Support: Liver Stabil, Liv-52, or Essentiale Forte (label recommended dosage).

Cholesterol Support: Lipid Stabil (3 caps/day) and Fish Oil (4 g/day).

Estrogen Support: tamoxifen (10-20 mg/day).

Comments:
This is a very common first cycle for building muscle mass, and utilizes a single standard bottle of methandrostenolone. This cycle is likely to produce very noticeable muscle growth in a first-time steroid user, often in excess of 8-10lbs of weight gain.This is usually not accompanied by significant visible side effects such as gynecomastia and water retention. Although this is considered a beginner's cycle, methandrostenolone is a c-17 alpha alkylated oral steroid, and presents significant cardiovascular and liver toxicity. The repeated use of such drugs should be limited.

Methandrostenolone
Week 1 10 mg/day
Week 2 15 mg/day
Week 3 15 mg/day
Week 4 15 mg/day
Week 5 20 mg/day

[lovbyts]

Time to write the author and let him know he's an idiot.

What did he do, re print his book from the 80s?

[ninesecz]

Llewellyn is usually right in the money with his Anabolics books but I really can not believe in this day and age and what we now know about HPA suppression that he would say that is ok. He has an 8-10 week Anadrol Only cycle listed in there too!

[tembe]

yeh i have read this book as well and was very suprised to find such rubbish

[xo3et]

See this is what happened to me, i read an article from a reputable online book and it also said Dbol first cycle is suitable. This was last year and i got my arse chewed when i posted here.lol

So glad i did though as im still here learning

[SpanishStallion]

Cycles off the Anabolics book are really bad.

[ninesecz]

Cycles off the Anabolics book are really bad.

What exactly is your idea of a good cycle? you said in another post that a 160# guy with 5 cycles of 500-1000mg of test Ew under his belt has made acceptable gains! LOL

[The One]

a d-bol only cycle is good if you just want to show off your muscles for about a week because this is about the time you will have them

[LickAlotOfPuss]

my first cycle i ever took was only d-bol at that point in time i didnt even know what a pct was, when i started i weighed 160 after the cycle i gained 17 pounds and kept all of it, no bs. str8 fact d-bol increases protein synthesis witch creates mussel, so your not going to lose much mussel, but you will lose the water weight.

[Subotai]

I really doubt most people who are reading that book are the same people taking d-bol only cycles. Yeah the books don't believe test is the base of everything, but by the time you read the book typically you'd understand differently.

Think about it, its 100+ dollars. Most people who don't actively persue knowledge (aka the people who think its okay to do d-bol only cycles) aren't going to buy that book!

[C-MaN]

man im hungry for some "mussels" now lol. Anyone down for some oysters?


:

[Papa Smurf]

Hey Nine! Does this dumbass even metion PCT for his Dbol cycle. I think my Dbol cycle when I was WAY to young, and no PCT is what brought me to the term TRT for LIFE!!!!!!!!

[Focusmen]

man im hungry for some "mussels" now lol. Anyone down for some oysters?


:

would that be a cheat meal? lol

[ancientgr]

man im hungry for some "mussels" now lol. Anyone down for some oysters?


:

Maybe, pursuant to his name, the puss that he licks a lot of, may remind him of mussels.

[stelq61th]

dont do clomid, things can get ugly on your health

[ninesecz]

Hey Nine! Does this dumbass even metion PCT for his Dbol cycle. I think my Dbol cycle when I was WAY to young, and no PCT is what brought me to the term TRT for LIFE!!!!!!!!

Everything it said is written in the OP and no I do not see anything about it. He says to run Tamox Citrate but not after the cycle is over

[WLlewellyn]

Good morning fellas,

I read what some of you are saying, and can appreciate your concerns. However, I do want to reiterate that I had when I wrote that, and still do, believe that there is nothing “wrong” with running a cycle without testosterone. Here are a few points to consider:

1) From the 1960 through the 1980’s, if you were an athlete, the first cycle you took was probably Dianabol (methandrostenolone) @ 2-5 tabs/day. Dianabol was the introduction most players had to steroids. This drug worked extremely well, and arguably changed the face of sports. Neither steroids nor human physiology has changed since.

2) Methandrostenolone is moderately androgenic/estrogenic. In a sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido, energy, and sense of wellness.

3) Many people, especially those new to AAS, refuse to inject themselves. For these people, a cycle of dbol or Anadrol may be the most effective options they have.

All strong steroids are also strong suppressors of the HPTA. Testosterone maintains libido so well because it is the primary male androgen/estrogen source. If you have libido issues, adding testosterone to a cycle will usually correct them. The balance of anabolic activity to side effects (health specific) w/testosterone is also better than just about anything. But this should not be mistaken for this hormone being a necessity. Many AAS work very well on their own. Your mileage may vary, of course.


And just to correct one other thing. I am a very strong supporter of PCT, and the sections before and after the sample cycles in ANABOLICS both detail the need for PCT. The PoWeR program using HCG+Clo+Nolv is highlighted in the book.

[WLlewellyn]

Good morning fellas,

I read what some of you are saying, and can appreciate your concerns. However, I do want to reiterate that I had when I wrote that, and still do, believe that there is nothing “wrong” with running a cycle without testosterone. Here are a few points to consider:

1) From the 1960 through the 1980’s, if you were an athlete, the first cycle you took was probably Dianabol (methandrostenolone) @ 2-5 tabs/day. Dianabol was the introduction most players had to steroids. This drug worked extremely well, and arguably changed the face of sports. Neither steroids nor human physiology has changed since.

2) Methandrostenolone is moderately androgenic/estrogenic. In a sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido, energy, and sense of wellness.

3) Many people, especially those new to AAS, refuse to inject themselves. For these people, a cycle of dbol or Anadrol may be the most effective options they have.

All strong steroids are also strong suppressors of the HPTA. Testosterone maintains libido so well because it is the primary male androgen/estrogen source. If you have libido issues, adding testosterone to a cycle will usually correct them. The balance of anabolic activity to side effects (health specific) w/testosterone is also better than just about anything. But this should not be mistaken for this hormone being a necessity. Many AAS work very well on their own. Your mileage may vary, of course.


And just to correct one other thing. I am a very strong supporter of PCT, and the sections before and after the sample cycles in ANABOLICS both detail the need for PCT. The PoWeR program using HCG+Clo+Nolv is highlighted in the book.

[BG]

I understand what your saying, but the amount of d-bol you would need to take to see good gains would be more then "the sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido". I speak first hand, when I was much younger, before these boards I ran d-bol only at 40mgs ed at it shut me SO hard, I actually feel that is the reason I needed to go on hrt before doing my first "true" cycle. It maybe a good idea to include HCG in your recommendation of d-bol only cycles?

[Ulysses]

Just to wade in here - 6 weeks ago I finished a 20mg a day Dianabol only cycle. It was my first experience with steroids and I hate needles so it was the only real option. I am 40 years old and have been training for about 15 years. For the 5 week cycle, i ate clean, high protein and worked out hard, strict and heavy, following my usual diet and routine because I wanted to see what the effect of the d-bol was. Before the cycle I had hit a plateau. Here's what i found:

1. I gained about 9lb over the 5 weeks, of which I kept 7lb.

2. I appear to have leaned out somewhat at the same time, and now am leaner and more muscled than before.

3. I never experienced ANY side effects whatsoever, other than awesome pumps and a recovery rate that made me feel like Superman.

4. I spent 2 weeks post cycle on Nolvadex.

5. My energy and libido were not effected post cycle, although I lost a small percentage of strength.

I'm not putting this here to argue in any way with those who have studied this for years and recommend to avoid D-bol only cycles, but simply to add my experience to the discussion. For me, the d-bol cycle proved to be a great kick start to my training. Granted, I didn't blow up like a balloon (only to lose it all again), but I did make some good, solid gains. My thoughts are that if you're looking for the magic bullet, then d-bol probably isn't the right option; but for me, it was a good choice.

Whadya think lads? :-)

[Papa Smurf]

I understand what your saying, but the amount of d-bol you would need to take to see good gains would be more then "the sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido". I speak first hand, when I was much younger, before these boards I ran d-bol only at 40mgs ed at it shut me SO hard, I actually feel that is the reason I needed to go on hrt before doing my first "true" cycle. It maybe a good idea to include HCG in your recommendation of d-bol only cycles?

BG: Your preaching from my book brother. I know the Dbol cycles I ran when I was young put me on TRT for life, no ? in my mind.

Poping pills is easy to these kids, and their mind set is, if you recommend 10 or 20 mg a day will work. then 40 or 50mg would be great!

PCT should be laid out along with the cycle. If you look at the cycles from this web site, thats is how they are presented. PCT is the cycle, not an after thought!

[BG]

BG: Your preaching from my book brother. I know the Dbol cycles I ran when I was young put me on TRT for life, no ? in my mind.

Poping pills is easy to these kids, and their mind set is, if you recommend 10 or 20 mg a day will work. then 40 or 50mg would be great!

PCT should be laid out along with the cycle. If you look at the cycles from this web site, thats is how they are presented. PCT is the cycle, not an after thought!

Ya I didn't know about pct back then, not sure if anyone did, but I would recommend some hcg during cycle and a good pct after if your going to try this. I still don't think you'll get good gains from it, at-least not the kind I want.

[BG]

BG: Your preaching from my book brother. I know the Dbol cycles I ran when I was young put me on TRT for life, no ? in my mind.

Poping pills is easy to these kids, and their mind set is, if you recommend 10 or 20 mg a day will work. then 40 or 50mg would be great!

PCT should be laid out along with the cycle. If you look at the cycles from this web site, thats is how they are presented. PCT is the cycle, not an after thought!

Nothing has ever shut me down like d-bol only did, my nuts shrunk to the size of a quarter and when I had sex next to nothing came out when I ejaculated. I too know this is what destroyed my natural test levels.

[tadpoleboyy]

my first cycle was dbol only. I twasnt bad, i made ok gains, got a lot of complements. I did run pct. I wanted to test the waters before i got into full blown injectables.

[CHAP]

Good morning fellas,

I read what some of you are saying, and can appreciate your concerns. However, I do want to reiterate that I had when I wrote that, and still do, believe that there is nothing “wrong” with running a cycle without testosterone. Here are a few points to consider:

1) From the 1960 through the 1980’s, if you were an athlete, the first cycle you took was probably Dianabol (methandrostenolone) @ 2-5 tabs/day. Dianabol was the introduction most players had to steroids. This drug worked extremely well, and arguably changed the face of sports. Neither steroids nor human physiology has changed since.

2) Methandrostenolone is moderately androgenic/estrogenic. In a sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido, energy, and sense of wellness.

3) Many people, especially those new to AAS, refuse to inject themselves. For these people, a cycle of dbol or Anadrol may be the most effective options they have.

All strong steroids are also strong suppressors of the HPTA. Testosterone maintains libido so well because it is the primary male androgen/estrogen source. If you have libido issues, adding testosterone to a cycle will usually correct them. The balance of anabolic activity to side effects (health specific) w/testosterone is also better than just about anything. But this should not be mistaken for this hormone being a necessity. Many AAS work very well on their own. Your mileage may vary, of course.


And just to correct one other thing. I am a very strong supporter of PCT, and the sections before and after the sample cycles in ANABOLICS both detail the need for PCT. The PoWeR program using HCG+Clo+Nolv is highlighted in the book.

I,m a believer in your books and appreciate what you do for us all But I have some things I would love to talk to you about only in PM if you have the time. I know that you are a busy man.

[BIGJOL]

I read the book and thats where i got the idea from..and he is right i think that in the way that as a first time user i dont want to be injecting anything into my body..id rather go orals see how it goes and then further myself if i like what i see from the results.. but i think with the right pct should be good

[spooledup]

Llewellyn is usually right in the money with his Anabolics books but I really can not believe in this day and age and what we now know about HPA suppression that he would say that is ok. He has an 8-10 week Anadrol Only cycle listed in there too!

What are you talking about? Do you think testosterone doesn't supress your HPTA? Is any cycle fine as long as you inject yourself with 5 times the test that your body normally produces??

You people keep pushing test in cycles when it doesn't have jack shit to do with safety. The safety is in the PCT, and knowing how to restore your HPTA based on what you used.

Stop parroting test!! Two of the most respected mods of this board Big and tmos preached taking test above all else, one is on TRT and the other is...

Test is not a must!

[Navy-boi-kai]

i do believe that test is the best compund out there. but there is so much to be discovered still.

[ninesecz]

What are you talking about? Do you think testosterone doesn't supress your HPTA? Is any cycle fine as long as you inject yourself with 5 times the test that your body normally produces??

You people keep pushing test in cycles when it doesn't have jack shit to do with safety. The safety is in the PCT, and knowing how to restore your HPTA based on what you used.

Stop parroting test!! Two of the most respected mods of this board Big and tmos preached taking test above all else, one is on TRT and the other is...

Test is not a must!

You go ahead an run cycles without test then brotha... What are you doing to get yourself a hard on for the 6-12 weeks you are running cycles without test? how about the other things that test does for the body that it will not be able to do because you will not have any! Test is ran with any good cycle because it is common sense that you would replace something that will be missing.. if you are low on fuel in your car, you add fuel right? Why feel like poo for the entire time you are on because you are shut down and not producing test. and yes PCT is very important but running a cycle to get gains with no tst and then using PCT to kick start what you have been without the entire time seems in my eyes, A little stupid

[renato]

hey want to know what happens if you don't use HCG post d-bol cycle? just trying to soak up some more info on all this

[Undercover]

Good morning fellas,

I read what some of you are saying, and can appreciate your concerns. However, I do want to reiterate that I had when I wrote that, and still do, believe that there is nothing “wrong” with running a cycle without testosterone. Here are a few points to consider:

1) From the 1960 through the 1980’s, if you were an athlete, the first cycle you took was probably Dianabol (methandrostenolone) @ 2-5 tabs/day. Dianabol was the introduction most players had to steroids. This drug worked extremely well, and arguably changed the face of sports. Neither steroids nor human physiology has changed since. We should learn from our mistakes. It's 2009 man.

2) Methandrostenolone is moderately androgenic/estrogenic. In a sufficient dose it is usually more than enough to maintain libido, energy, and sense of wellness.

3) Many people, especially those new to AAS, refuse to inject themselves. For these people, a cycle of dbol or Anadrol may be the most effective options they have. So they shouldn't be taking AAS anyway.

All strong steroids are also strong suppressors of the HPTA. Testosterone maintains libido so well because it is the primary male androgen/estrogen source. If you have libido issues, adding testosterone to a cycle will usually correct them. The balance of anabolic activity to side effects (health specific) w/testosterone is also better than just about anything. But this should not be mistaken for this hormone being a necessity. Many AAS work very well on their own. Your mileage may vary, of course. Why not? It sounds like a pretty good reason to me.


And just to correct one other thing. I am a very strong supporter of PCT, and the sections before and after the sample cycles in ANABOLICS both detail the need for PCT. The PoWeR program using HCG+Clo+Nolv is highlighted in the book.

just my 2 cents

[aldemoro]

Test has got many sides because its one of the strongets compounds its high androgenic. I did cycle without test and with test. I would prefer the cycle without because i did feel better and still got good gains but whith the test cycle i still had gains but with sideffects. I think that who ever wants to have less sides then should go with a low androgenic drug

[Meshy]

my first cycle was dbol only. I twasnt bad, i made ok gains, got a lot of complements. I did run pct. I wanted to test the waters before i got into full blown injectables.

Think this is the way most first time users are thinking including myself. I just wanna test the water with oral only cycle first. Not expecting massive results but from reading up on dbol seems like i can make some gains before moving on to injectables.

The oral only cycle I was considering was recommended for first time users on a web site, not in a book. Think most people these days aren't gonna buy books, when there's a wealth of information out there on the internet. Just my 2 cents.

[beachboygemini]

Make fun of me all you want. I am considering 4 weeks, 60mg of turinabol=tbol and 20mg of anavar=oxyandolone each day. Then on weeks 5-8 switching to 60mg of anavar=oxyandolone and 20mg of turinabol=tbol each day. I would use plenty of liver support, along with some type of trib.combination during pct. That is a 4680mg total steroid stack for the entire 8 weeks. Would anyone of you, feel fairly safe with this? Like I said, you can dis. me all you would like. Just give me some whys and why not's as well.

[ninesecz]

to much oral for the liver! IMO..... Here is my $0.02 if you do not want to start out with injectables you should not be worrying about steroids at all!

[TITANIUM]

Just spent the last few hours reading the newest edition of LLewellyns Anabolics 9th Edition (2009 copy)

There are a few pages of these in there

Basucally they are written out as beginner cycles. there is this one, then there is a stage 2 D-bol only cycle.
He also has a couple Anadrol Only Cycles listed in there too

Starting to understand a little better why these people keep coming to the forum wanting to run D-bol only and then get frustrated when we tell them not to!
The $50 Anabolics Bible is turning around and telling them it is a suitable 1st mass cycle and there is no issues at all wioth a beginner running this type of cycle

So Please let us all stop flaming NOOBS for proposing cycles like this!! Some of them are obviously trying to do research and are getting frustated because they are getting 2 completely different answers from 2 different sources!

Sample Steroid Cycles:
The following cycles are presented as examples of common steroid administration protocols. These programs have not been evaluated in a clinical setting for safety and efficacy, and are provided for informational purposes only. These are not recommendations for anabolic/androgenic steroid use. As with any supplemental drug program, it is important to examine your own individual health status, health risks, and performance goals before deciding to engage in any anabolic/androgenic steroid use. For those who have made the decision, it is important to emphasize again that the recommended approach to AAS use is to limit drug intake to the lowest levels necessary to achieve the next rational goal. More aggressive cycles should not be attempted unless one is sure they cannot achieve the results needed on a more moderate program. Note that given the difficulty in predicting androgenic threshold and dosages for female users, the below cycles are examples of programs for men only.
Single Agent Cycles

Products:
100 tablets 5 mg Methandrostenolone

All Weeks:

Liver Support: Liver Stabil, Liv-52, or Essentiale Forte (label recommended dosage).

Cholesterol Support: Lipid Stabil (3 caps/day) and Fish Oil (4 g/day).

Estrogen Support: tamoxifen (10-20 mg/day).

Comments:
This is a very common first cycle for building muscle mass, and utilizes a single standard bottle of methandrostenolone. This cycle is likely to produce very noticeable muscle growth in a first-time steroid user, often in excess of 8-10lbs of weight gain.This is usually not accompanied by significant visible side effects such as gynecomastia and water retention. Although this is considered a beginner's cycle, methandrostenolone is a c-17 alpha alkylated oral steroid, and presents significant cardiovascular and liver toxicity. The repeated use of such drugs should be limited.

Methandrostenolone
Week 1 10 mg/day
Week 2 15 mg/day
Week 3 15 mg/day
Week 4 15 mg/day
Week 5 20 mg/day

Nine, just for the record, I have a copy of it in the bathroom.

I read it, and your right.

I think that the author is assuming that people know about running test with there cycles.

That's why I disregarded that cycle.

His PCT seems a little screwy also.

Not knocking the author, just saying that newbies need everything explained to them.

In detail.

I read everything I can find.

Knowledge is key.

[Meshy]

to much oral for the liver! IMO..... Here is my $0.02 if you do not want to start out with injectables you should not be worrying about steroids at all!

True say... i am leaning towards injectables now after reading up on this site now. Considering starting on the beginner cycle recommended by Phate http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=355742

Still the thought of injecting something before i've found a reliable source, that i've tested is a big leap to take

[Teras]

Test has got many sides because its one of the strongets compounds its high androgenic. I did cycle without test and with test. I would prefer the cycle without because i did feel better and still got good gains but whith the test cycle i still had gains but with sideffects. I think that who ever wants to have less sides then should go with a low androgenic drug

I agree with you. I suffer too many sides from test. Even at low dose. Get shut down so hard and I can't recover for weeks. And I don't even make gains that are worth the post pct "depression".

[Teras]

Make fun of me all you want. I am considering 4 weeks, 60mg of turinabol=tbol and 20mg of anavar=oxyandolone each day. Then on weeks 5-8 switching to 60mg of anavar=oxyandolone and 20mg of turinabol=tbol each day. I would use plenty of liver support, along with some type of trib.combination during pct. That is a 4680mg total steroid stack for the entire 8 weeks. Would anyone of you, feel fairly safe with this? Like I said, you can dis. me all you would like. Just give me some whys and why not's as well.

I've run something similar. 5 weeks of tbol, followed by a week of rest and then 5 weeks of var. During cutting it was more than enough to achieve a spectacular transformation.

[beachboygemini]

boldenone and anavar, is that better for your liver? Ha, just because it has been injected doesnt mean that it is not negatively affecting your liver. Tbol and anavar are very mild and are not quite as harsh on your liver and my stack was only 80 mgs a day combined. So would it be alot better if I did tbol for 4 wks followed by anavar for 4 wks? Now instead of just saying that this is hard on your liver, tell me why this would be a bad idea. Ah ha hah, I am a dumb newbie! I must be straight tarded! Okay, I dissed myself in order to make it easier for you guys. Orals are not the end.