Serious advice needed for friend considering steroid use to rehab reconstructed knee

[mick86]

Have a friend stats are:

Nationality Asian
Age 24
Height 163 cm
Weight 61kg
Nationality Asian
Training history: Working out 2-3 years on and off 4-5 days a week

My friend had a very unfortunate run of luck with his knee. What started as a sporting injury turned into a chain reaction of problems, culminating in months in hospital and the risk of loosing his leg. It took him 12 months to regain full ROM.

Fast track 2-3 years and he is concerned wit the risk of needing his knee joint replaced if he cant maintain strength and function himself. He has asked me if I can suggest any anabolic compounds that may improve the muscle function in the area and my first thought was simply testosterone, though he is a little uncomfortable at the thought of using needles as he is not a bodybuilder and hasn't cycled before.

I was hoping to hear from well informed or similarly experienced members here who can offer sum specific advice relating to steroids, rehabilitation and what options may best suit my friend. Please find below some additional information:

I asked my friend to describe the exact issue he was trying to remedy and provide some further background information.

My friend said:

Based off what the knee surgeon and physio say: i need to constantly develop an above healthy amount of permanent muscle to help support the knee (right knee) from taking too much load just merely on the joints, cartilage and ligaments. Basically, my legs feel weak

Medical history on the right leg: ACL knee reconstruction, then stretched ligament.

Then meniscus disc frayed and split in half

Then staph infection (golden staph early stages)

Result: heavy visibly noticeable muscle degeneration post operation

He says when he works out and he's consistent the pain isn't as obvious, but when he stops for a period of time or is idle He sometimes also sometimes experiences shooting pain in the joints. Also the muscles just feel weak and not supportive enough of the knee like the joint is going to collapse any minute and he can feel pressure on the joints. He worries his knee may go out sideways or dislocate like it used to.

[lovbyts]

Physical therapy and rehab. If he was to take testosterone he may get a false sense of strength/security and do more damage. Testosterone will do nothing for the ligaments or any meniscus.

Knees are slow to repair and rehab. IF anything the only thing I would consider would be HGH but since he has a needle phobia there is not much he can do. He should discuss it with his doctor/surgeon or check into a longevity clinic in regards to HGH

[Far from massive]

I am a newbie but I read a lot and agree 100% with the HGH avenue as well as the testosterone deal.

While I feel that the testosterone would definatlely benifit the muscle recovery and the quads are very important in knee joint rehab, I would also be concerned about the potential for an imbalance to occur between the muscle recovery and the knee structure itself.

There are several very promising clin trials underway studying the effectiveness of HGH injected directly into the joint capsule, as well as one where they are using HGH/Test combo in the capsule (this one I really can't understand since to my way of thinking the tissues within the capsule will not benefit a great deal yet the potential for the comparatively large quantity of test to do damage from sedimentation and interfering with the lube qualities of the synovial fluid within the capsule would seem a lot greater than those from the tiny quantities of HGH. However I am not a research scientist (although I play one on the internet).

Anyway I would suggest your friend discuss the possibility of the usage of HGH use ( whole body, the clin trials are unlikely to take a subject with multiple trauma knee problems) as well as the possible use of test with some top Ortho/Sports med guys and see if this is an avenue that your friend would want to pursue. I certainly would not want to pursue it without doing so in a controlled medical invironment.

[mick86]

Physical therapy and rehab. If he was to take testosterone he may get a false sense of strength/security and do more damage. Testosterone will do nothing for the ligaments or any meniscus.

Knees are slow to repair and rehab. IF anything the only thing I would consider would be HGH but since he has a needle phobia there is not much he can do. He should discuss it with his doctor/surgeon or check into a longevity clinic in regards to HGH

HGH was actually the first thing I suggested to him, I forgot to mention that in my above post. I think the fact that here in Australia the cost is usually around $2000 AUD or more for 5 weeks + the fact it is inected and a "hard core"option were of putting to him. Perhaps if enough people echo my recommendation he will change his opinion. That said the cost is an issue here, it would be a hell of a lot cheaper to run it in Thailand.

I am a newbie but I read a lot and agree 100% with the HGH avenue as well as the testosterone deal.

While I feel that the testosterone would definatlely benifit the muscle recovery and the quads are very important in knee joint rehab, I would also be concerned about the potential for an imbalance to occur between the muscle recovery and the knee structure itself.

There are several very promising clin trials underway studying the effectiveness of HGH injected directly into the joint capsule, as well as one where they are using HGH/Test combo in the capsule (this one I really can't understand since to my way of thinking the tissues within the capsule will not benefit a great deal yet the potential for the comparatively large quantity of test to do damage from sedimentation and interfering with the lube qualities of the synovial fluid within the capsule would seem a lot greater than those from the tiny quantities of HGH. However I am not a research scientist (although I play one on the internet).

Anyway I would suggest your friend discuss the possibility of the usage of HGH use ( whole body, the clin trials are unlikely to take a subject with multiple trauma knee problems) as well as the possible use of test with some top Ortho/Sports med guys and see if this is an avenue that your friend would want to pursue. I certainly would not want to pursue it without doing so in a controlled medical invironment.

A well researched and precisely explained response, much thanks. I agree with your views on all accounts. Steroids can cause such an imbalance even in healthy individuals, someone with complex circumstances such as my friend, may be even more susceptible. it would make since to combine both testosterone and HGH imo as this way both muscle and connective tissue stand to benefit.

This is the first I've heard of gh shots directly into joints, I don't understand the theory behind this, I must do some research.
I wonder if peptides such as ghrp-6 and CJC-1295 w/o DAC would be of any benifit to my friend... Compared with HGH they are a hell of a lot cheaper, although as they operate through a slightly less direct pathway and the GH release is only a short 30 minute spike the benefits may be less pronounced. Also a possible issue is that the injection frequency is through the roof. If my friend really doesnt fancy needles this could be a problem.

[mick86]

bump

[mick86]

A few additional notes:

My friend had the folowing to say in reply to the posted replies:

He's goal is to reach the point where he no longer needs to worry about strengthening his legs but can rather just maintain.
He says that the main objective set by his doctor: to build more muscle than he already has...period

He wants to know if there were any other side effects or consequences on his ligaments with or without steroids...he STILL needs to build muscle
it's just a matter of, will steroids help and if so, any downsides?

He additionally asks if by building too much muscle or taking steroids will it densify his bones and in turn increase muscle and possibly put too much load on his joints?

[Bonaparte]

Apart from GH and peptides (which are all injectables), Anavar could help and is oral.

If I were trying to rehab an injury using Var, I would likely run it in 8 week cycles at maybe 30-40mg a day. A simple 20mg of Nolva for 4 weeks after each run would be sufficient for PCT. I'd probably just go with time on=time off, and get bloodwork before starting another run (lipids would be my main concern, since Var isn't very hepatotoxic, nor is it overly suppressive to the HPTA). It has been shown to help heal all sorts of collagen/joint injuries, surgeries, and bad burns in a medical setting.

[Times Roman]

^^ if a var only cycle, you may consider running some primo to protect his libido. Just a thought.

[Bonaparte]

^^ if a var only cycle, you may consider running some primo to protect his libido. Just a thought.

????
The only thing that would help his libido is test and HCG.
Primo would only add to the suppression and would not fulfill testosterone's role in sexual functioning.

[mick86]

I"m not all that familiar with Primo's interaction with sex drive, as a DHT derivative it seems plausible that it could cause a libido increase but as far as actual evidence does I'm not at all sure.

[Bonaparte]

I"m not all that familiar with Primo's interaction with sex drive, as a DHT derivative it seems plausible that it could cause a libido increase but as far as actual evidence does I'm not at all sure.

It isn't androgenic enough for a libido boost. It would mostly just be waste of money (and require pinning).