Stopping before 1 week. Help.... PCT?

[Reno7]

I respect the opinions of those on here, so I’m reaching out for help. My cycle was to be:

Week 1. Sustanon 500 mg/Tbol 25 mg
Week 2-7 Sustnanon 500 mg/Tbol 50mg
Week 7-12 Sustanon 500 mg
Week 12-16 pct

I’m day 5 right now. 25 mg of Tbol and just pinned second shot of sutanon for the week.

I am coming off. I don’t feel right, had a crazy panic attack and just don’t feel this cycle is right for me. I should have got my nutrients and diet proper before I considered this 5th cycle.

So after 5x25 mgs of Tbol and 500 mgs of sustanon over a 5 day period am I in need of a full pct?

I’ve learned from this cycle that steroids are for far more experienced lifters than I, and am throwing in the towel on this cycle.


Help is appreciated please. Do I need to pct? and what I should use? Sad to waste all the gear, but it is what it is.

[fiddlesticks]

Man you had pretty strong placebo effects lol. AFAIK tbol doesn't have insane mental effects so yeah.. You are over thinking this hard.

And... 5th cycle?!?! You are right saying your diet needs to be right, you need to increase cals very significantly from the looks of it.

Honestly if I was you in this spot I would just do the test by itself and dramatically increase calories.

[Reno7]

Overthinking most likely, but something f-kd me up today. You’re 100% that I need to increase the calories. I have been, but perhaps should have focused on that before AAS again.

So drop the Tbol in your opinion and run the sust still with a high caloric intake?

What if I kept with my initial plan to come off and increase cals alone. Would you suggest any sort of pct? I know it’s only been 5 days, so that’s why I ask.

[GearHeaded]

no pct needed. from the sounds of it the last thing you need is more drugs in your system , heck some guys have more problems with pct drugs then the actual AAS

[Reno7]

no pct needed. from the sounds of it the last thing you need is more drugs in your system , heck some guys have more problems with pct drugs then the actual AAS

Thank you. I appreciate your input

[EDCG19]

Can you describe the panic attack?
What happened exactly and was it gear related??

[fiddlesticks]

well in my own experience very high calories (for you I would say that would be 6000-8000) always results in very very fast results and calorie intake is the absolute most important thing in muscle growth rate.

[BOPJohnDoe]

What I am about to say is out of tough love and I only have good intentions toward you.

1. If the avatar pic is you currently, you are not eating enough calories and nutrients to grow properly or you are not lifting properly to solicit growth.

2. If you’ve done 5 cycles, you should already know the answer to your own questions you are asking. So either you did 5 dbol only “cycles” or something or you are not telling the truth (btw you should never run an oral without a base of test). Or you did 5 cycle with bunk gear...something just isn’t adding up.


And to answer your question - no you don’t need to run any PCT. Your body will most likely not even shut down it’s own production because you haven’t been feeding it an exogenous source of testosterone long enough. And even if it did it would be short lived and you’d bounce right back. The last thing you need is more drugs floating around in your blood from the sound of it. Just let your body balance itself out.


Otherwise, the only thing I’d suggest is running a test only cycle of enanthate or cypionate. 500mg per week. Split it up into two pins. Something like SUN/WED 250mg per pin.

What cycles have you run in the past?

[Reno7]

Can you describe the panic attack?
What happened exactly and was it gear related??

It was an off day, with some Liss and stretching. Took my 25mg of Tbol and started on some light cardio. After stretching and some light ab work I felt light headed and dizzy. Couldn’t catch my breath and went outside into -20 temps to cool off. Felt like my body was emitting all sorts of heat in the cold temps. Came inside to lie down and ate what I could. Realized later that night that my caloric intake was super low, so it may have been that. Unsure...

[GearHeaded]

It was an off day, with some Liss and stretching. Took my 25mg of Tbol and started on some light cardio. After stretching and some light ab work I felt light headed and dizzy. Couldn’t catch my breath and went outside into -20 temps to cool off. Felt like my body was emitting all sorts of heat in the cold temps. Came inside to lie down and ate what I could. Realized later that night that my caloric intake was super low, so it may have been that. Unsure...

this is likely from the Tbol dropping your blood sugar. its a great nutrient partitioner and helps shuttle glucose into depleted muscle cells.. if you been on low cals on top of it the effects are going to be felt even more.
this has happened to me several times with Tbol.

you need to load up with pre workout or even intra workout carbs . or don't use Tbol if your sensitive to blood glucose changes . going hypo can feel just like a panic or anxiety attack , and I'm betting thats what happened

[Reno7]

What I am about to say is out of tough love and I only have good intentions toward you.

1. If the avatar pic is you currently, you are not eating enough calories and nutrients to grow properly or you are not lifting properly to solicit growth.

2. If you’ve done 5 cycles, you should already know the answer to your own questions you are asking. So either you did 5 dbol only “cycles” or something or you are not telling the truth (btw you should never run an oral without a base of test). Or you did 5 cycle with bunk gear...something just isn’t adding up.


And to answer your question - no you don’t need to run any PCT. Your body will most likely not even shut down it’s own production because you haven’t been feeding it an exogenous source of testosterone long enough. And even if it did it would be short lived and you’d bounce right back. The last thing you need is more drugs floating around in your blood from the sound of it. Just let your body balance itself out.


Otherwise, the only thing I’d suggest is running a test only cycle of enanthate or cypionate. 500mg per week. Split it up into two pins. Something like SUN/WED 250mg per pin.

What cycles have you run in the past?

The fact you took the time to write this much is appreciated. To answer those questions

1.
The avatar is me. The pic is 2 years ago. I’m currently 5,7 135lbs 6%bf and wanted to add 12-15 lbs.

2.
Cycle 1 test E 500mg12 weeks /winstrol 80 8wks
Cycle 2 test e 500mg12 weeks/dbol 50mg 8 wks
Cycle 3 test prop 10 wks/tren 10wks
Cycle 4 test prop 6wks/tren 6wks

Thanks for answering about the PCT. as for running test as a base with Tbol, I am running sust 250 pinned twice weekly 1ml/250mg per pin.

Again, I’m open to criticism here as that’s why I reached out. So no hard feelings taken.

[Reno7]

this is likely from the Tbol dropping your blood sugar. its a great nutrient partitioner and helps shuttle glucose into depleted muscle cells.. if you been on low cals on top of it the effects are going to be felt even more.
this has happened to me several times with Tbol.

you need to load up with pre workout or even intra workout carbs . or don't use Tbol if your sensitive to blood glucose changes . going hypo can feel just like a panic or anxiety attack , and I'm betting thats what happened

Thanks for the response. So inner conflict now is adjust and continue on, or come off.

[GearHeaded]

drop the Tbol for now . up your calories big time. see how you feel with just the test. go buy a 10$ blood sugar meter at Walmart and track your blood sugar too, it may ease your mind

[Reno7]

drop the Tbol for now . up your calories big time. see how you feel with just the test. go buy a 10$ blood sugar meter at Walmart and track your blood sugar too, it may ease your mind

Thanks for shedding light on this

[BOPJohnDoe]

drop the Tbol for now . up your calories big time. see how you feel with just the test. go buy a 10$ blood sugar meter at Walmart and track your blood sugar too, it may ease your mind

This is also a good idea. I bought one at Kroger (grocery store). Just make sure whatever blood sugar monitoring device you purchase they have the needles and strips in stock and purchase those as well. Also if they sell a cleaning solution (calibrating solution?) buy that...I didn’t use this but it’s something I’d recommend if they have it in stock.

Also, check out the wrist blood pressure monitors there while you are at it. For like $40 you can get a decent one and keep track of your blood pressure as well. Just make sure you are seated and forearm parallel to the ground (hold it to your chest) when using.

[Reno7]

Can you describe the panic attack?
What happened exactly and was it gear related??

Sorry I wrote the panic attack info on another’s reply

[Family_guy]

This is a great group of guys here that are always willing to help. I’m glad I’m a part of this forum!

[Family_guy]

OP I had a similar experience I think. I just started my firs cycle of test and when I ate a lot of carbs in a big meal I would get a little dizzy kinda. Dizzy isn’t the right word but kinda like that. Anyways it went away after a little bit. I think what gear said is spot on I’m sure. He knows his shit. I’m assuming my experience was something similar. I assumed it was blood sugar related.

[Family_guy]

I’m sure hormonal fluctuations in general make people react different to a lot of things.

[HoldMyBeer]

OP I had a similar experience I think. I just started my firs cycle of test and when I ate a lot of carbs in a big meal I would get a little dizzy kinda. Dizzy isn’t the right word but kinda like that. Anyways it went away after a little bit. I think what gear said is spot on I’m sure. He knows his shit. I’m assuming my experience was something similar. I assumed it was blood sugar related.

I called it food drunk. I would sometimes feel a little tipsy and even slurred my words a bit when I ate certain meals. It's weird.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

[Family_guy]

I called it food drunk. I would sometimes feel a little tipsy and even slurred my words a bit when I ate certain meals. It's weird.

Sent from my LG-LS993 using Tapatalk

Exactly! It never happened before unless I ate Wayyy too much but it’s been happening quite often lately since I started this cycle

[Reno7]

Exactly! It never happened before unless I ate Wayyy too much but it’s been happening quite often lately since I started this cycle

Very interesting. Mine was total opposite as I hadn’t eaten much that day. Super lethargic all day. I chalked it up to growing and not blood sugar. Thinking much differently now with regards to what happened and why.

I’m still thinking to pull the pin on the cycle and feed like mad. But then the devil inside me says keep on cycle and feed like mad and watch myself grow!

I don’t like feeling that odd and go into panic mode when I do. Figured I’d ran tren before and wouldn’t have any issues going to a more beginner cycle.

[DeeCee112]

Very interesting. Mine was total opposite as I hadn’t eaten much that day. Super lethargic all day. I chalked it up to growing and not blood sugar. Thinking much differently now with regards to what happened and why.

I’m still thinking to pull the pin on the cycle and feed like mad. But then the devil inside me says keep on cycle and feed like mad and watch myself grow!

I don’t like feeling that odd and go into panic mode when I do. Figured I’d ran tren before and wouldn’t have any issues going to a more beginner cycle.

I'm certainly no expert here and the guys commenting know alot more but if you are only 135lbs after 4 cycles I am gonna assume continuing this cycle would be a waste of your money and health. Your training and diet alone should have carried you further without 4 cycles under your belt. I'm 5'7 myself and starting my first run at 170lbs, a little more BF than you but if you wanna pack on size you just can't have the 8 or 10 percent BF mentality, especially if your a hard gainer.

Even if you do gain from this cycle I'd predict you'd lose the gains I'm assuming like the last cycles? Tuck the gear away, Get a diet and training coach, there likely a few on this board, or at your gym. Pack on a few pounds first then rethink the gear after you are already getting results so you know you'll be able to on a cycle too (even more cals and training req)

Scrap the cardio, lift big weights on big compound exercises with solid form, scrap the isolated single arm reverse Bicep curls and eat everything in sight.

[Family_guy]

I'm certainly no expert here and the guys commenting know alot more but if you are only 135lbs after 4 cycles I am gonna assume continuing this cycle would be a waste of your money and health. Your training and diet alone should have carried you further without 4 cycles under your belt. I'm 5'7 myself and starting my first run at 170lbs, a little more BF than you but if you wanna pack on size you just can't have the 8 or 10 percent BF mentality, especially if your a hard gainer.

Even if you do gain from this cycle I'd predict you'd lose the gains I'm assuming like the last cycles? Tuck the gear away, Get a diet and training coach, there likely a few on this board, or at your gym. Pack on a few pounds first then rethink the gear after you are already getting results so you know you'll be able to on a cycle too (even more cals and training req)

Scrap the cardio, lift big weights on big compound exercises with solid form, scrap the isolated single arm reverse Bicep curls and eat everything in sight.

Great advice

[Reno7]

I'm certainly no expert here and the guys commenting know alot more but if you are only 135lbs after 4 cycles I am gonna assume continuing this cycle would be a waste of your money and health. Your training and diet alone should have carried you further without 4 cycles under your belt. I'm 5'7 myself and starting my first run at 170lbs, a little more BF than you but if you wanna pack on size you just can't have the 8 or 10 percent BF mentality, especially if your a hard gainer.

Even if you do gain from this cycle I'd predict you'd lose the gains I'm assuming like the last cycles? Tuck the gear away, Get a diet and training coach, there likely a few on this board, or at your gym. Pack on a few pounds first then rethink the gear after you are already getting results so you know you'll be able to on a cycle too (even more cals and training req)

Scrap the cardio, lift big weights on big compound exercises with solid form, scrap the isolated single arm reverse Bicep curls and eat everything in sight.

Read this twice over and appreciate the time put into this post. Going to do exactly as you pointed out and scrap the gear and focus on gaining properly.

So freaking lethargic yesterday and today. Really hoping to feel back to normal soon. It was only 5 days of Tbol and 2 pins. Shocked it’s taken this much of a toll. Eating lots to keep up the energy and of course for my natural plan now.

[Family_guy]

Read this twice over and appreciate the time put into this post. Going to do exactly as you pointed out and scrap the gear and focus on gaining properly.

So freaking lethargic yesterday and today. Really hoping to feel back to normal soon. It was only 5 days of Tbol and 2 pins. Shocked it’s taken this much of a toll. Eating lots to keep up the energy and of course for my natural plan now.

That’s good man. You gotta get yourself feeling good. No point doing gear if it makes you feel terrible

[DeeCee112]

I've noticed quickly from my first cycle so far that mental game is big. Gotta find a way to remotivate yourself, stay focused and don't overthink every feeling or negative thought. Look up and plan out a new routine, look up recipes, hit the grocery store and pre-cook for the week. Oatmeal and eggs in the am, Greek yogurt, fruit and veggies. Lots of pasta with a meat added. If your like me you just gotta eat all day everyday. Grab a mass gainer shake for post workouts. Goto the boom store and grab Arnold's bodybuilding encyclopedia, after like 10 yrs or something I still crack that baby once and awhile.