Kept all of my "Gains"

[Grappler13]

I have read here a million times that after you come off cycle, you lose your gains or something to that effect. I kept all my gains and continued to grow post cycle.

Granted: I did my cycle when I was relatively out of shape and nowhere near my genetic potential, but as for gains, I kept them all. I did eleven weeks of 500mg/wk of test-e and kicked it with 30mg dbol for the first 4 weeks. I went from 189 with 23% body fat to 210-215 at 16% Body fat at the peak of my cycle: about week 12. Bench went to 250, Real squat to 350 and Deadlift to 405. Today, I am about two months off of pct and am back to around 190lb HOWEVER, I still have my lifts and have moved up on deads and squats.

I guess that when people are talking about gains, they mean hypertrophy, not strength. Contrary to the CV on this board (for which I have a great respect), a novice cycle for a 30 something, kinda out of shape guy, will do wonders assuming that he is motivated to get to the gym. While I wasn't able to keep my swolled up look, I am lean and strong post cycle and do not think I could have kept the extreme motivation without the gear.

My hypothesis: If you are out of shape (within reason), a mild cycle may be just the ticket to turning back the clock a few years.

[SMAN12b]

Great work Grappler13, What did your diet look like while you were on, and has that changed much since you have been off?

Keep it up

[Posideon]

yes but you're back to 190?

[mwolffey]

good job...as said earlier,diet and proper pct are key...do those and good results will usually ensue

[Pro_built7]

good work

[pmorris]

1 pound gain...

[THE_DOME]

i could really care less how much weight i am lifting, its about making the muscle grow. if all you want is strength well congrats but i damn a whole cycle and you gained 1pound. bodybuilding=building the body
in my eyes you didnt keep any gains not saying that you shouldnt be happy with your progress.

[ROTTYPUP]

i read theres a direct ratio between muscle mass and muscle strength

[IBdmfkr]

You guys are too concerned with the scale rather than body composition. LBM gained and BF lost is considered gains in my book, although I do think he was not ready for a cycle and could've done it naturally.

[THE_DOME]

You guys are too concerned with the scale rather than body composition. LBM gained and BF lost is considered gains in my book, although I do think he was not ready for a cycle and could've done it naturally.

i definatly concur, i have bigorexia i cant get rid of it

[D-Money]

You guys are too concerned with the scale rather than body composition. LBM gained and BF lost is considered gains in my book, although I do think he was not ready for a cycle and could've done it naturally.

I totally agree. I may not be a whole lot bigger scale wise than a few years ago, but I know I've made gains because I've kept track of my lbm. It's all about the quality mass. If you feel that you are leaner, stronger, and feel better about your physique, I think thats what it's all about.

"The s**** chess, it ain't checkers".

-Training Day

[Liftnainez]

well he never stated that he continued up his diet and remained lean.. if he went up back to the 20% bf range and just gained one pound i wouldnt be bragging.. and im not trying to say this as a diss just more in the lines of natuarally you could of done the same.. if im wrong im sorry and great job..

[Grappler13]

well he never stated that he continued up his diet and remained lean.. if he went up back to the 20% bf range and just gained one pound i wouldnt be bragging.. and im not trying to say this as a diss just more in the lines of natuarally you could of done the same.. if im wrong im sorry and great job..

The reason I put "Gains" in quotes is for the expected comments. I'm not a hypertrophy guy. Functional strength is all important to me and I was able to keep all of the strength gains post cycle. I went back to 190 because I quit eating 5000 calories/day and got back into jits regularly. I'm closer to 12% bf now.

I know there are lots of guys on the board that are only interested in size. To me, I'd prefer to be stronger than I look versus the other way around.......but, I'm not a bodybuilder in the traditional sense.

[Grappler13]

1 pound gain...

One pound gain on the scale.......23% BF @ 190 to 12% BF @ 191 is 22 pounds of lean muscle gained. Scale addiction is sad.

[SMAN12b]

Hey bro, you dont' need to justify your training to us. As long as you are satisfied with the results of your cycle, and happy with your strength and size, that is all that matters.
Good Luck

[mwolffey]

Hey bro, you dont' need to justify your training to us. As long as you are satisfied with the results of your cycle, and happy with your strength and size, that is all that matters.
Good Luck

ditto

[Homeguard]

One pound gain on the scale.......23% BF @ 190 to 12% BF @ 191 is 22 pounds of lean muscle gained. Scale addiction is sad.

Damned good imho. Nice work bro'

[Warrior]

I would never suggest a new athlete use any compound that would lead to anything other than a stronger neural efficiency and joint strengthening effect in preparation for something like this.

If you are new and out of shape – you need to go through some solid conditioning and gorge yourself in fitness/nutrition education before using any performance enhancing drugs. This learning and building process can take a year or maybe 10 years - depends on how hard you work and research for it.

[Grappler13]

ditto

I am attempting to explain the difference pre and post cycle. Two people commented that I was at the same weight I started at. True, but my entire body composition has changed for the better and besides, I'm a wrestler: If I weighed 215 with the strength I have no, I'd be at a huge disadvantage. That's a big weight class difference.

The entire point of this thread was to illustrate that "gains" kept are not always visible by the scale or the tape.

[IBdmfkr]

Before/After measurements would've been better at showing your gains IMO.

[Evolution-06]

Thanks for the great thread!

[TheSentinal]

It is an art to know when a point is sold and conversely when a point is oversold.

[pumpd4lif]

what is more important big lifts or big arms...
grappler ur gains sound solid it seems to be what u were shooting for so u have acomplished ur goals u set out to do something and u did it and ur performance as a wrestler has probly brought u to a new level in strength
as for my ? at the begining of this post it all depends on the persons goals they set for themselves i commend u for reaching urs GJ

[Grappler13]

what is more important big lifts or big arms...
grappler ur gains sound solid it seems to be what u were shooting for so u have acomplished ur goals u set out to do something and u did it and ur performance as a wrestler has probly brought u to a new level in strength
as for my ? at the begining of this post it all depends on the persons goals they set for themselves i commend u for reaching urs GJ

I really just wantes to illustrate what I believe is one method of AAS use: to build muscle in a functional way rather than hypertrophy. Obviously, most AAS users want size (football/bodybuilding/etc.....) but the average man may just want a body composition change and AAS, used properly, can really make a great difference. HEll, I'm having problems maintaining 190 clean pounds. At 189 and fat, I could eat all I wanted, now I have to pig and workout to keep my 190. 15 to 20 lbs of muscle require alot of calories!

[Vegas1973]

This is a great thread. I'd be interested in hearing what your bodyfat is today. *July 10th**