A few questions

[Pac8541]

I've been reading non-stop here for the last 36 hrs and found most of the answers to my questions. Please consider the following and let me know what you think. I'm finishing my 1st cycle (described below) next week and beginning PCT then.

5'08"/172lbs/39 yrs old
Lifting seriously for approx. 10 yrs, all of it work related strength training as opposed to actual body building, but interrupted for about a year due to serious injury 4 yrs ago.
Diet: I'm getting approx. 300-350g protein per day. Actual caloric/fat/protein intake is impossible to accurately calculate right now due to location and worksite.
Other supplements: besides protein powder, NO2 and CE2.
Workouts: 4 on/1 off, basic heavy compound movements using free weights (primarily dumbbells) and Hammer Strength machines. Cardio 2X/week, 20-30 mins.

1st cycle: Sus/Deca/Dbol
Week 1-4: 500mg sus/200mg deca, tues. and fri., 20mg Dbol ED
Week 5-8: 750mg sus/300mg deca, mon/wed/fri
Week 9: 1000mg sus/400mg deca, sun/tues/thurs/sat, letro .25mg ED
Week 10: 750mg sus/200mg deca, mon/wed/fri, letro .25mg ED
Week 11: 500mg sus, tues/fri, letro .5mg ED
Week 12: 500mg sus, tues/fri, HCG 500iu ED, letro .25mg ED
Week 13: HCG 500iu EOD
Week 14: HCG 250iu EOD
Week 15: HCG 250iu EOD, nolva 20mg ED
Week 16: nolva 20mg ED

Being my first cycle, I started rather slowly and mild trying to guage how it felt and how my body was reacting. Things progressed satisfactorily up to week 8 when I began to notice a stall in progress/weight gain. I upped the dosages during week 9 and didn't care for some minor sides so I dropped it back down and began my protocol to come off. My strength went through the roof initially which I attribute at least partially to water gain. My max weight came during weeks 5-8 where I was 17lbs over my starting weight. Right now, I've lost about 10lbs in water due to the letro and I'm cutting up. Not as strong now as I was a month ago but significantly stronger than I was when I started.

I am currently in week 11. I will be starting my next cycle in roughly 8 weeks and would like something a little faster to start up and with a leaner gain overall. Based on what I've read here I'd like to go with the following over the course of 12 weeks:

Week 1-12: Test prop 600mg/week @ 100mg ED (with one day off per week)
Week 1-10: Deca 400mg/week, split tues/fri
Week 5-12: Winstrol (aq) 50mg ED
Week 1-10: HCG 250iu 2X/week
Week 11-12: HCG 500iu ED
Week 13-14: HCG 500iu 3X/week
Week 14-16: nolva 20mg ED

Diet and cardio will be used to maintain more of a cutting cycle than a pure mass cycle. What I'm concerned about is the short ester test combined with the long ester deca. Is this going to create a problem? I have considered running tren alongside the prop at 75mg EOD but that is much harder for me to acquire then deca. Besides that, I really really like the effect deca has on my joints, including the previously mentioned injury that sidelined me for a year. If I'm understanding what I've read correctly, tren will tend to dry out my joints and I'm already including winstrol in the mix, which I'm assuming will do the same thing.

Opinions and constructive criticism welcomed.

Thanks,
Pac

[InsaneInTheMembrane]

If I am reading correctly, you are doing your second cycle 2-3 after the last week of your first cycle PCT??? Thats cutting it way too close bro, you're not allowing your body to play catch up...JMO..

Wait 2 months after week 16 of your current cycle AT LEAST..then start the second cycle.. I can understand your impatience, at 39, you probably are not too worried about messing up your HPTA system but still, you should be patient regardless; at least let your receptors upgrade and refresh themselves before the next wave of gear.

your first cycle is almost over, so no point commenting. Your second cycle I assume is also a bulker? if so, just use prop for the first 4 weeks to kickstart and use a longer test ester (cyp or E) as a base. Also, if you wish, you can add test prop for the last 2 weeks (wks 12 amd 13, one week pass your last winny shot) of your cycle while the longer ester clears your system so you can begin PCT pronto without much lag time.

On your HCG, IMHO, if your ancillaries (letro, nolva,aromasin,proviron etc...) are in check, you dont need HCG mid cycle (that would be reccomended for cycles longer than 16 weeks IMHO)... you just need HCG for the final 2-3 weeks of your cycle right before you start your PCT regiment

just my .02

cheers

[svarturer]

alot of shit for a first one ....

[Erwin]

Do you have any plans to get your bloodwork done before your next cycle? You should at least see where everything is at before you cycle again. And if you are worried about the long ester with the short ester maybe do a little research on NPP.

[Froggy]

get your bloodwork done before your next cycle? You should at least see where everything is at before you cycle again.

That's a good idea...IMO...

[Pac8541]

I am concerned about my HPTA and don't want shutdown but realize that suppression is just part of the business. Enth is an option and one that I have considered but wanted a short ester test for more control and less chance of sides. If my research has been accurate, prop will give me that but at the cost of daily injections. I would prefer a lower water retention rate than what I just experienced. This is what concerned me about a cycle including prop and deca. I wasn't sure if these 2 compounds would oppose each other in that regard.

Bloodwork: no I hadn't planned on having any bloodwork done prior to my next cycle but I know its a good idea. Honestly, with the amount of time I will be near a facility that can provide that, I may not have the opportunity to do so.

Concerning amounts/number of compounds/dosages, yes it was a lot for my first. I was following the advice of users with me, some of whom may have not had the experience of those here. If I were to do it over again, I'd have gone with sus alone, eod. What is available where I'm at is essentially what I did... Anyway, it appears to be turning out alright however I'd be lying if I said I got my money's worth. While I'm happy with the results, I did spend more than I think I should have.

Will check out NPP. Please don't be shy, if a change needs to be made, I'm all ears...

[Erwin]

Bloodwork: no I hadn't planned on having any bloodwork done prior to my next cycle but I know its a good idea. Honestly, with the amount of time I will be near a facility that can provide that, I may not have the opportunity to do so.

If you aren't going to do the bloodwork then you shouldn't be running another cycle. Make the opportunity or don't start again. This isn't like taking creatine this is serious stuff you are injecting into your body. What sides have you experienced with your cycle besides the bloat. Also do some research on time off in between cycles. Just with what I have read at this site makes me want to wait longer to start another cycle. Either way you will do what you want just like the rest of us so good luck bro!-Erwin

[Pac8541]

If I can get the bloodwork done before I head back to work, I will do so. This is something I had planned on getting done but wasn't going to schedule it until after the next cycle, when I had more down time. It is something that concerns me, I realize that I'm playing with chemicals, hormones, and balances within my body that can have irreversible effects. If I can't get it done I'll put the next cycle off until I can.

Besides bloat, mild insomnia, increased worrying or maybe even slight paranoia about shit that didn't really seem to bother me before, intolerance and impatience, mild acne. Now, I try to keep this all in perspective. Where I work and what I do has its own "sides" and a lot of this could be explained that way but the coincidence is too great. I tend to feel that all but one of these issues would have already been present because I've experienced all of them minus the gear over the past 3 yrs. I believe the addition of drugs amplified them and/or I paid closer attention to them. Anyway, not trying to make any excuses, just saying I monitor what my body is telling me pretty closely.

I'll read up on time off between and bloodwork, thanks.