cycle for new thai boxer

[bigguy20]

ok heres my situation..... ive been working out for 3 years and used to be obsesed with bodybuilding and still am to a certain extent, to get my mind off it a lil so i dont hurt myself trying to get too huge too fast i figured id start thai boxing in january and keep working out like 3 days a week and only do maybe one cycle a year to keep on some size. well now that ive experienced thai boxing and mma im loving it, i wish i had discovered it at a younger age. anyways i just started sparing a few weeks ago and it seems to be a new addiction for me, one problem though... put me in the ring for 30 seconds and i can do awsome , i have lots of power and strength for the first bit but holy crap my stamina is absolutely brutal, i fail miserably when it comes to length in a fight. i know i obviously need to work on my stamina and itll take a while but im wondering if i do a cycle of lets say some test and winny or test and tren if ill get worse. as much as i have found a new love for the sport of fighting that i never thought i had i still like bodybuilding and would like to keep some quality size... any oppinions for a new guy to the fighting scene??

[QuieTSToRM33]

if ur worried about ur stamina/endurance ..... work on ur cardio

Depending on the person, AAS, especially tren, will negatively affect ur stamina/endurance

[Billy_Bathgate]

im in the same boat as you, i started around january, and also stamina is my weakest point overall IMO

a cycle is about the last thing i would want to do at this point

[Hunter]

Jump rope, ROAD WORK, shadow boxing, working the pads and heavy bag. There is no cure for poor cardio just keep working at it and your body will adjust to it. Also its very hard to keep a bodybuilder build and keep excellent stamina case and point Phil Baroni. Just keep training and your cardio will come

[bigguy20]

i definately know i need to work on my cardio and rope shadow boxing etc.. stamina will definately come with time.. im just curious if the aas will make my situation worse, i mean if i still practice at my stamina while using gear will i still have room for improvement or will i get nowhere? another problem is that ive had shin splints in the beginning and thought they were gone after a few weeks but nope they keep coming back which means i cant skip or hop around too much at the time which is also a big problem i have.

[Bigmax]

Hey biguy if you want cycle advise go to the AAS forum.that would be your best bet to find out what can work for you.

[bigguy20]

im not looking for aas info, i know what id like to do as far as compounds go but i guess it kinda looked like i was asking for that kinda advice. maybe i didnt ask it right, basically i wanna know from anyone thats an experienced fighter thats used gear if it has made thier cardio situation worse ,better or didnt make a difference at all. id like to keep my size and shred body fat without making my stamina any worse than it is. the way i see it is if i am at 213lbs now at 14% body fat approx. i figured if i keep up with my new diet and cardio regimen that i can loose bodyfat but maintain muscle size using a lil gear without hurting my stamina. we all know that when dieting and doing lots of cardio we tend to loose some muscle at some point so i figured a mild cycle along with all this will help me maintain muscle density as well while im burning fat. i just dont wanna diet and do crazy cardio and just watch my muscle dissapear slowly, i worked too hard to loose it like that.

[zimmy]

look... unfortunately the kind of cardio that is necessary for fighting is completely the opposite of what you need for bb'ing. Doing the 40 minute of running at a low heart rate does great for not letting you canobilze your muscle but it really doesn't push you endurance stamina much. You are going to have to decide if you want to keep the bulk muscle look or gain endurance / stamina and get the not quite so bulky / more defined look.

[bigguy20]

ok guys i still dont think your understanding what im saying so ill refrase it again for the third time...... first off im not ronnie coleman im not saying im this 350 lb guy that ready for the mr olympia, all im saying is that id like to keep some size and fight how hard can that be im not looking for size like ronnie coleman and doing thai boxing at the same time.. i also never mentioned that all im doing is low intensity cardio like bbr's. i simply asked one question and that is....... is there anyone on this forum that has been on cycle and still training to fight????? and if so what was it like, was it worse on stamina, better in some cases or no difference at all thats all im saying..


i dont understand why everybody thinks im like some huge bodybuilder thats looking for a career change, im 213lbs thats not that big especially if you take away a good amount of my body fat, id only be like 180 lbs ripped.. for example look at shamrock was he not a wicked size in his prime?? we cant sit here and say he wasnt using gear in his fighting prime.thats all im looking for. i dont wanna be lookin like absolute shit and know how to fight, i wanna look big and still know how to fight, why not have best of both worlds.

[zimmy]

some of the guys i train with run winnie by itself...they say it gives them added push.

[bigguy20]

thanks for the quick reply zimmy i was thinking of doing that with a lil test.

finally a decent reply.

[simm]

Test will be hard on your stamina as any gear that adds excess water weight will slow you down and make cardiac output much more difficult!! Clen and high protein diet worked well for me..Added 7lbs,lost fat and had better endurance..I do thai boxing/mma...

[zimmy]

clen killed me endurance wise? I was fricking running on empty it felt like and i kept getting cramps after more than 2 hours of sparring

[simm]

I was only taking 2 clen per day with 300gramms protein per day, plus 1 gallon of water! No cramps at all..Probably an individual thing

[Billy_Bathgate]

imo...but not with fighting, in the past steroids have never helped my endurance, only negative..either from bloating, gaining weight faster than i can adjust, or cramping.

[bigguy20]

clen killed me endurance wise? I was fricking running on empty it felt like and i kept getting cramps after more than 2 hours of sparring

holy crap... looks like i have some serious work to do if you spar for 2 hours, i spar for an hour and take like 3-5 mins between rounds and i still feel like im gunna drop. i only started in january though, but my cardio is shit i need lots of work. i totally give all those fighters out there tons more respect now that i know how hard it is to condition yourself to fight.

in the end im thinking of taking a low dose of test (so i dont crash) with 50mg of winny eod to start and ill see how it goes from there. if i get worse ill just stop the cycle and do my pct.

[zimmy]

well i train bjj / mma only ... thai is alot more energy probably.

[gabriel595]

gear will affect negatively your stamina and endurance and i've heard that tren is the harshest steroid for that matter. i have the same problem as you bigguy, i do wrestling mainly but i also do some boxing, muay thai and bjj. for stamina i hit the bag EOD for 30+ minutes and some shadows too. i'm also gonna cycle very soon so i'll start hitting the bag probably ED so i don't lose much stamina, i hope i won't 'cause it's a little low right now though it's imporving.

[bigguy20]

well i spoke to my trainer(muay thai/csw) and he said it will definately be harder on stamina the bigger you are and the more steroids you use, but over time the body can still be conditioned very well. he also used the example with frank shamrock when he said you can have size and conditioning it just takes lots of heart and time to go through the process.
ill do my cycle and stick it out, ill let you guys know how it goes in the future, ill be starting towards the end of may.

[gabriel595]

well i spoke to my trainer(muay thai/csw) and he said it will definately be harder on stamina the bigger you are and the more steroids you use, but over time the body can still be conditioned very well. he also used the example with frank shamrock when he said you can have size and conditioning it just takes lots of heart and time to go through the process.
ill do my cycle and stick it out, ill let you guys know how it goes in the future, ill be starting towards the end of may.

good words from your trainer, good luck.

[filledout]

i know this is a late reply but could not let this go i think ur all very wrong i am a pro boxer and roids do not neg affect ur stamna. t-bol if u take the time to go read the profile helps u jump higher,run faster, punch faster, and gives u great gains in ur stamia go read the profile t-bol was made for the fighter.

[filledout]

oh yea and i have had 24 fights and i have lost 2 oh and guess what the 2 i lost i was not on any gear go figure that out lol

[tvd220]

yea tbol is what i was thinking

[j3374]

I agree with Filled out. There different steroids for different purposes. Not all of them make you big. I think most pro fighters use them.

[tony1leg]

Try Halo or if you can get it try Cheque Drops. Beware though.

[stuuyh]

ive been on AAS for just over 2 years,before i did that i trained in freestyle martial arts and kickboxing,i weighed 10st,i competed about 7times kickboxing,i fought for a brirish title,after that i decided i was sick of being small and skinny so i decided to use AAS,i put on 6.5stone..currently wei***ng in now at 16st dead.
I stopped kickboxing altogether after i started taking AAS,after about a year of not training in KB just weights i thought id try it again see if i was better now i was bigger and stronger......i was so wrong,i was slow,tired easily and had crazy pains shooting up my shins,yes i was very strong but it didnt matter because the lads i was sparring were hitting me 2/3 times before i even knew were they were!
I stopped kickboxing again,about 9month ago i started doing BJJ/MMA at first i found it hard with stamina,my strength was my biggest bonus,but once id been mounted i was gone,i was to tired to do anything, I came off my bulking course and started doing a cutting course using tren,test prop and EQ,now all i can say is im a lot better ,faster cardio has improved so much,can spar a 5min round and still get up and walk away after it,before i used to crawl.
also when on bulking course i couldnt box for more than a few mins because of the aching in my delts caused by AAS..i strted to think i cant do both here,its one or the other.....im exactly like you,i love being the size i am now,and dont want to sacrafice my strength,but i also want to be a better fighter,its very hard to do,but stick with it,you will get through it after a good few month solid training.just lay of deca and test(test prop ok though)

[zimmy]

now all i can say is im a lot better ,faster cardio has improved so much,can spar a 5min round and still get up and walk away after it,before i used to crawl

lol after a round? :P

seriously though bigguy...like there is a guy in my bjj who is pretty big and veryyy strong...but after one round of shooot drills he was laying down saying he's done. My fat ass had plenty of reserves. You can cycle...just don't worry so much about trying to keep size. Functional strength / conditioning should be your goal.

[stuuyh]

lol after a round? :P

no,i ment in general..what i`m saying is before i could not do 5mins without almost dying on the mat,i`m far far from being as good conditioned as i want,but i`m saying you can achieve it if you stick to it,ive improved and plan to keep improving,he can do the same too.

[Mark Yager]

ive been on AAS for just over 2 years,before i did that i trained in freestyle martial arts and kickboxing,i weighed 10st,i competed about 7times kickboxing,i fought for a brirish title,after that i decided i was sick of being small and skinny so i decided to use AAS,i put on 6.5stone..currently wei***ng in now at 16st dead.
I stopped kickboxing altogether after i started taking AAS,after about a year of not training in KB just weights i thought id try it again see if i was better now i was bigger and stronger......i was so wrong,i was slow,tired easily and had crazy pains shooting up my shins,yes i was very strong but it didnt matter because the lads i was sparring were hitting me 2/3 times before i even knew were they were!
I stopped kickboxing again,about 9month ago i started doing BJJ/MMA at first i found it hard with stamina,my strength was my biggest bonus,but once id been mounted i was gone,i was to tired to do anything, I came off my bulking course and started doing a cutting course using tren,test prop and EQ,now all i can say is im a lot better ,faster cardio has improved so much,can spar a 5min round and still get up and walk away after it,before i used to crawl.
also when on bulking course i couldnt box for more than a few mins because of the aching in my delts caused by AAS..i strted to think i cant do both here,its one or the other.....im exactly like you,i love being the size i am now,and dont want to sacrafice my strength,but i also want to be a better fighter,its very hard to do,but stick with it,you will get through it after a good few month solid training.just lay of deca and test(test prop ok though)

After a year of not training in kick boxing your going to lose your speed and stamina regardless of weather your juicing or not. I think the whole idea people have about juice making you gas out faster is just a myth. Look at these WWE guys, they got stamina for days.

[stuuyh]

you cant really compare WWE to MMA can you?

[sportmuaythai]

It's been about a year. Bigguy pls come back and tell us how you're doing. This past year must have given you stamina. Are you still keeping size? I trust that you've found out that better technique will let you punch or kick much harder than a bigger guy who cannot execute weapon properly. But in the end, there need to be a balance of brawn as well.

[sonar1234]

I did some steroids back in 1999 deca winny and test for the first cycle and masteron and parabolan for the second one.

One was for size that other for cutting.

Each time i was on steroids i had a lot of trouble when doing cardio, seems like i got exausted most of the time i did something that required a cardio effort.

Things havent really changed cause most of the guys at my gym that use steroids always seem out of breath too.

There is nothing to beat good old ephedrine.

I just dont beleive in steroids anymore.

[Mark Yager]

you cant really compare WWE to MMA can you?

I wasn't comparing wwe and mma, I was comparing people who juice and do vigorous workouts. I'll also throw in nfl players since most of them juice. Ever see how hard a linebacker plays without gassing.



Watch that guy play and tell me juice kills stamina.

[stuuyh]

isnt NFL a professional sport?wont they get tested?

Yu obviously didnt read what i said,i said if you run AAS along with the cardio its fine,which he probably has,but if you do AAS then 2yrs later start cardio its a lot harder due to all AAS sapping all the stamina in your body,prime example BOB SAPP,he is huge and knackered in about 30secs,and look at cabbage who dosnet juice but looks fat and out of shape his stamina is amazing really.

[Mark Yager]

isnt NFL a professional sport?wont they get tested?

ARE YOU JOKING?

Yu obviously didnt read what i said,i said if you run AAS along with the cardio its fine,which he probably has,but if you do AAS then 2yrs later start cardio its a lot harder due to all AAS sapping all the stamina in your body,prime example BOB SAPP,he is huge and knackered in about 30secs,and look at cabbage who dosnet juice but looks fat and out of shape his stamina is amazing really.

I read what you said but I disagree with what a lot of people think including yourself that they sapp your stamina. If there's any proof of it I'd like to see it. I think someone who doesn't know much about them wrote a column saying they made people gass and everyone who read the column believed it and spread it on the forums. They are called performance enhacing drugs for a reason. There have been a lot of mma guys who are obviusly juicing and have tons of stamina. There are also a lot of fat out of shape guys who can't get their fat asses off their couch. If anyone wants to believe they make you slower or not able to fight five rounds its fine with me, but I'm not buying it.

[stuuyh]

ok,i hear what you are saying too,but i still disagree with some things you are saying.....we`l just disagree to agree!!

[Mark Yager]

ok,i hear what you are saying too,but i still disagree with some things you are saying.....we`l just disagree to agree!!

[sonar1234]

They should start testing pro wrestling LOL

[Mark Yager]

They should start testing pro wrestling LOL

Naah, they should quite testing everyone since most professional athletes are smart enough to beat the tests anyway.