first cycle- prop only. what do you think?

[football12345]

-weeks 1-2- Test Prop @ 50mg EOD
-Weeks 3-10- Test Prop @100mg EOD
-Weeks 11-12- Test Prop @50mg EOD
-3 days after last injection, begin to administer my PCT...
-Week 13- Clomid 300mg ED, 60mg Nolvadex
-Week 14- Clomid 100mg ED, 40mg Nolvadex
-Week 15- Clomid 50mg ED, 20mg Nolvadex

first cycle of aas, so i want to use just test...what do you think?

[FireGuy]

No need to taper the prop and 300mg clomid ED is overkill IMHO.

[LATS60]

^^^^x2

[Lemonada8]

just do 75mg ED of prop with a nolva pct... no need to taper the prop, and no need for clomid for a simple prop only cycle... if u get gyno probs get letro on cycle, and drop it for pct... use hcg if u want for the last 2 weeks of cycle at 500iu EOD and through out pct... but those are accessories to the basic cycle... ur choice...

[LATS60]

just do 75mg ED of prop with a nolva pct... no need to taper the prop, and no need for clomid for a simple prop only cycle... if u get gyno probs get letro on cycle, and drop it for pct... use hcg if u want for the last 2 weeks of cycle at 500iu EOD and through out pct... but those are accessories to the basic cycle... ur choice...

Are you saying that a nolva only PCT is adequate after a 12wk test cycle?
With respect, thats just bad advice.

[football12345]

so you think just 300mg prop beginning to end is best? and how should i run the pct then? any other advice? please...

[football12345]

bump

[LATS60]

A good PCT would be nolva and clomid, standard for a test cycle.
Clomid 100/50/25/25
Nolva 40/20/20/20.

[Amorphic]

no need to taper the test doseage, pick a dose and run with it. 300mgs of clomid will turn you into a wreck, not to mention how hard it is on your eyes. nolva/aromasin would be a good pct

[football12345]

also, is it best to inject ED or EOD? and how many mgs for whatever is best?

[Amorphic]

also, is it best to inject ED or EOD? and how many mgs for whatever is best?

75mgs/ed would be a good dose for a first cycle. be ready for prop pain. especially in virgin muscle injections

[LATS60]

also, is it best to inject ED or EOD? and how many mgs for whatever is best?

Personal preference, iv'e found it makes no diff either way. Up to you on dosages mate.
Nolva and clomid will be the most effective.

[Amorphic]

also, forgot to ask stats here.

age, bf%, height, weight?

[football12345]

21 years old. 5'10, 210 lbs, 10% body fat. diet isn't perfect but good enough to keep me at 10-12% year round. while on cycle, will have very strict diet to ensure gains. been serious training for 6 years now. haven't grown an inch in 5 years ha, i matured very early. want to start this cycle with test prop only and then pct with clomid/nolva.

should i be taking anything with test prop to ensure proper health, no gyno, etc?

[Amorphic]

21 years old. 5'10, 210 lbs, 10% body fat. diet isn't perfect but good enough to keep me at 10-12% year round. while on cycle, will have very strict diet to ensure gains. been serious training for 6 years now. haven't grown an inch in 5 years ha, i matured very early. want to start this cycle with test prop only and then pct with clomid/nolva.

should i be taking anything with test prop to ensure proper health, no gyno, etc?

you can keep nolva on hand or use an AI such as arimidex to avoid any estrogen issues. sides should be minimal on a simple test cycle unless you are gyno prone however

[Sherman01]

no need to taper the test doseage, pick a dose and run with it. 300mgs of clomid will turn you into a wreck, not to mention how hard it is on your eyes. nolva/aromasin would be a good pct

So Aromasin is a good alternate to Clomid? Is it a good alternative to replace Clomid after any cycle or just certain ones?

[Amorphic]

So Aromasin is a good alternate to Clomid? Is it a good alternative to replace Clomid after any cycle or just certain ones?

i like it for any pct. nolva at 20-40mgs/ed with aromasin 15-25mgs ed

[hankdiesel]

First cycle you're not going to want to inject ed. 100mg eod for the duration of the cycle would work fine.

[football12345]

if it's going to be more beneficial then i'll suck it up.

[LATS60]

So Aromasin is a good alternate to Clomid? Is it a good alternative to replace Clomid after any cycle or just certain ones?

Let me just point out that aromasin being a type I steroidal AI makes a good addition to a clomid/nolva PCT in that it keeps libido up and helps prevent much of the estrogen rebound post PCT, but it's also worth posting this again for those who don't think clomid is neccessary.

Because clomid does something that nolva cannot, in 7days at 100mg it increases LH and FSH by as much as 50%,and when used together they work better than their sum. Although these drugs are similar compounds they are not the same. Nolva isn't used to test HPTA function clomid is, Nolva isn't used to treat secondary hypgonadism, clomid is.
Clomid unlike nolva, exerts a direct estrogenic rather than an antiestrogenic effect on the pituitary by enhancing the GnRH-stimulated release of gonadotropin.
This tells us that for our purposes, fooling the HPTA to talk to the pituitary to produces these gonadtropins, clomid will always make your PCT more successful

[Sherman01]

So for a heavy cycle someone would be advised to take all three? Or for ANY cycle it would be a good idea?

I know Clomid at high doses can be bad for your eyes and also can make people be overly emotional. Would using Aromasin along with Nolva/Clomid combo allow for a lower dose of Clomid perhaps?

Sorry for all the questions, I am just trying to gather some good info for when I eventually get my cycle plans in order.

[LATS60]

So for a heavy cycle someone would be advised to take all three? Or for ANY cycle it would be a good idea?

I know Clomid at high doses can be bad for your eyes and also can make people be overly emotional. Would using Aromasin along with Nolva/Clomid combo allow for a lower dose of Clomid perhaps?

Sorry for all the questions, I am just trying to gather some good info for when I eventually get my cycle plans in order.

Any cycle IMHO. As for high doses of clomid thats why i keep it low 100mg ED in the 1st wk only is sufficent, thats only equivelent to around 30mg nolva.
As for a lower dose of clomid because your using aromasin, well as above, it's a low dose anyway, but no, because they different drugs for different reasons.

[Mulciber]

i can avoid most of clomids sides by not taking over 100mg and taking it before bed and sleep through it

[Sherman01]

Good info, thanks guys! I will use all 3 for my PCT when I do my cycles.

[WARMachine]

Let me just point out that aromasin being a type I steroidal AI makes a good addition to a clomid/nolva PCT in that it keeps libido up and helps prevent much of the estrogen rebound post PCT, but it's also worth posting this again for those who don't think clomid is neccessary.

Because clomid does something that nolva cannot, in 7days at 100mg it increases LH and FSH by as much as 50%,and when used together they work better than their sum. Although these drugs are similar compounds they are not the same. Nolva isn't used to test HPTA function clomid is, Nolva isn't used to treat secondary hypgonadism, clomid is.
Clomid unlike nolva, exerts a direct estrogenic rather than an antiestrogenic effect on the pituitary by enhancing the GnRH-stimulated release of gonadotropin.
This tells us that for our purposes, fooling the HPTA to talk to the pituitary to produces these gonadtropins, clomid will always make your PCT more successful

Great post bro!!! Very solid! Let this be known to newbies...

[LATS60]

Great post bro!!! Very solid! Let this be known to newbies...

Thanks bro, always open to compliments

[football12345]

btw, thinking about running adex throughout whole cycle...this is good idea correct? trying to prevent gyno at all costs...

[Mulciber]

yeah its fine

[Lemonada8]

running adex during is fine if u know ur gyno prone... but since this is ur first cycle id say go w/o it and if u start to get signs of it get some letro and follow the gyno reversal thread ( its basically letro ed at diff mgs)..... did/do u have pubescent gyno? that would be a good tell.....

and 12 weeks w/ prop is a long time... be sure to follow thru on ur pct all the way through... id advise getting some hcg at the end of ur cycle...

[football12345]

actually considering in doing a 6 week prop cycle. i've been researching good amount of shorter cycles and they appeal so what. I'd rather gain 12 lbs and keep 10 than gain 20 and keep 15 or so. does any1 know much about the shorter cycles and effectiveness?

[sportfan33]

dude, if ur gonna do a short cycle do it for 8 weeks. And i would shoot 50mg to 75mg ed. for the duration of the 8 weeks.

[NEOSUP]

I would say go longer i just finished pct from a 7 week 50mg ed prop only cycle went from 182 at 12 bf to 202 and after pct im at 190 at 10bf next time im definetly going longer

[football12345]

damn dude you lost 12 lbs? i'm definitely going to ask around about 8 week cycle, i like the idea of body not ompletey shutting down and not as much sides...

[fit4ever180]

His BF dropped 2% as well, so about 3 lbs. of that weight loss was fat

[muhammad1185]

good luck with ya cycle bro, first cycle and you want to go with a short ester, eod injections. hmmmm, i would have a serious rethink if i was you....and your pct needs changing

[Lemonada8]

i did a prop cycle of 8 weeks... i went from 235 at 15% to 250 at 10% then after pct i am 240 at 10% bf.... id recommend a 7 or 8 week cycle of prop, then u can do a simple-r pct of just nolva... if u do a longer cycle, be sure to do a fuller pct... my first cycle was prop and i did ED shots i personally enjoyed the shots cause it made me feel like it waqs workin adn a daily reminder to go work out cause if i didnt the oil would pool in the muscle and hurt like a bitch....