winstrol/stromba - newbie

[uzzobb]

I want to take oral winstrol for a short course (5-6 weeks) just to enhance my body's phisique. I never took steroids and im not planning of taking any after that.

My question is what are the side effects? Can it stun growth(like some other steroids), since im not that old and may still have some development going on?
(assume i use it properly (i have good guidance)).

[TractionIssues]

You are not ready for Winstrol. Please don't make a big ego problem over this, just trust us, Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo! Not to mention a winny only cycle is very stupid.

[marcus300]

You are not ready for Winstrol. Please don't make a big ego problem over this, just trust us, Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo! Not to mention a winny only cycle is very stupid.

That is not correct at all, jeez !!!

We need to know alot more about yourself before we can give advice, stats ect!!

check this out
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=367187

[TractionIssues]

Marcus you just like following me around and trying to prove me wrong don't you? Pleas enlighten me why you think this kid should do a Winny only cycle I would love to know...

[stelq61th]

to add muscle while burn fat

[TractionIssues]

to add muscle while burn fat

Winstrol will give MINIMAL muscle gain and fat loss, it's not meant for that.

[marcus300]

Marcus you just like following me around and trying to prove me wrong don't you? Pleas enlighten me why you think this kid should do a Winny only cycle I would love to know...

Ive no idea what your talking about, ive not seen you before, if you feel thats happening maybe you should take a look at yourself and your advice before making such stupid comments.

I think you need to go back and re-read what i said, where did i say anything about him doing a winny cycle? please enlighten me?

I said and I quote "That is not correct at all" and I quoted your post and highlighted it, which was "Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo"

I stick with what i said because in my opinion what you said is not correct, if you said something what i thought was correct i wouldnt say anything, would I. If you truely believe what you said fine, i just wanted to say I DONT.

Have you escaped from hospital or something?

[TractionIssues]

Ive no idea what your talking about, ive not seen you before, if you feel thats happening maybe you should take a look at yourself and your advice before making such stupid comments.

I think you need to go back and re-read what i said, where did i say anything about him doing a winny cycle? please enlighten me?

I said and I quote "That is not correct at all" and I quoted your post and highlighted it, which was "Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo"

I stick with what i said because in my opinion what you said is not correct, if you said something what i thought was correct i wouldnt say anything, would I. If you truely believe what you said fine, i just wanted to say I DONT.

Have you escaped from hospital or something?

It was a joke, don't take things so serious... Just saying so because on another post you misunderstood what I wrote possbily because the way it was worded, but said the exact same thing I did... Anyway, back to the topic, why do you believe someone who is not in competition should use winstrol?

[marcus300]

It was a joke, don't take things so serious... Just saying so because on another post you misunderstood what I wrote possbily because the way it was worded, but said the exact same thing I did... Anyway, back to the topic, why do you believe someone who is not in competition should use winstrol?

You said its useless unless your about to do a comp, do you really think that?

[TractionIssues]

I asked you first lol... Okay, I'll reword this also so you understand my point. In my opinion, if you are not about to compete in a competition, Winstrol is not necessary, esspecially if you weigh the pros and cons of the compound. There are much better compounds for the everyday bodybuilder, like Masteron, which will also help Fat Loss more than Winstrol and still give that "Dry look".

[marcus300]

I asked you first lol... Okay, I'll reword this also so you understand my point. In my opinion, if you are not about to compete in a competition, Winstrol is not necessary, esspecially if you weigh the pros and cons of the compound. There are much better compounds for the everyday bodybuilder, like Masteron, which will also help Fat Loss more than Winstrol and still give that "Dry look".

Oh my god its getting worse lol

I think you need to get more experience in ther world of AAS before giving advice, winny is a good AAS and is not just for competition,

[TractionIssues]

Oh my god its getting worse lol

I think you need to get more experience in ther world of AAS before giving advice, winny is a good AAS and is not just for competition,

Please... don't give me this hot head attitude, I gave my opinion that Masteron is better if you look at the pros and cons of it, I did not say winny was bad either, I just said that it makes more sense to use it if you are preparing for a competition. Winny's effects are mainly aesthetic, and don't give much long term results, that being said, what is the use of it for the everyday bodybuilder? I gave my opinion, you have no said anything to why you think the opposite except for rude comments. We are all adults here please keep these discussions mature and informative, I would love to learn your views on why you feel so highly about winny.

[marcus300]

Please... don't give me this hot head attitude, I gave my opinion that Masteron is better if you look at the pros and cons of it, I did not say winny was bad either, I just said that it makes more sense to use it if you are preparing for a competition. Winny's effects are mainly aesthetic, and don't give much long term results, that being said, what is the use of it for the everyday bodybuilder? I gave my opinion, you have no said anything to why you think the opposite except for rude comments. We are all adults here please keep these discussions mature and informative, I would love to learn your views on why you feel so highly about winny.

All because you made to look rather stupid dont have a go with the attitude ok, you making this even worse now, winny doesnt give long term results and is mainly aesthetic!! lol lol i can see i am wasting my time and effect so you think what ever you want about winny being useless unless in comp, i have other ideas.

And your now your changing what you said, you didnt say winny makes more sense to use if you are prepping, you said "Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo"

Now keep this thread on topic and think next time and make sure you know what your talking about next time you post something, lol jeez

Back on topic!

[TractionIssues]

All because you made to look rather stupid dont have a go with the attitude ok, you making this even worse now, winny doesnt give long term results and is mainly aesthetic!! lol lol i can see i am wasting my time and effect so you think what ever you want about winny being useless unless in comp, i have other ideas.

And your now your changing what you said, you didnt say winny makes more sense to use if you are prepping, you said "Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo"

Now keep this thread on topic and think next time and make sure you know what your talking about next time you post something, lol jeez

Back on topic!

Again, thanks for actually posting your reasons why you think differently instead of your immature oh your just not as smart as me, bullshit. Oh but hey your right, winstrol will definitely give you HUGE LONG TERM GAINS!! EVERYONE SHOULD GET ON IT AND GO PRO!!!

[marcus300]

Again, thanks for actually posting your reasons why you think differently instead of your immature oh your just not as smart as me, bullshit. Oh but hey your right, winstrol will definitely give you HUGE LONG TERM GAINS!! EVERYONE SHOULD GET ON IT AND GO PRO!!!

Why should i educate you when you wont even do it for yourself?

No need to start crying about it, there you go again putting words in my mouth, did i say it will give you HUGE LONG TERM GAINS? and you could turn pro? nope i didnt, doesnt matter if you put it in caps either it still looks stupid lol

If seem to be unable to understand so i will just explain what i said again - winny isn't useless and its not just for competition,

You have talk total bull all the way through this thread, now stop posting bull and move on, if thats what you think so be it, i think different!

lol

[TractionIssues]

Why should i educate you when you wont even do it for yourself?

No need to start crying about it, there you go again putting words in my mouth, did i say it will give you HUGE LONG TERM GAINS? and you could turn pro? nope i didnt, doesnt matter if you put it in caps either it still looks stupid lol

If seem to be unable to understand so i will just explain what i said again - winny isn't useless and its not just for competition,

You have talk total bull all the way through this thread, now stop posting bull and move on, if thats what you think so be it, i think different!

lol

Really... I was expecting a little more class man, you dissapoint me. I am trying to have a discussion with you, I state my points, and all you do is launch insults and act like a child, and give nothing to back up what you say except really low remarks... You would think someone who has so many posts would know how to have a proper conversation instead of flaming. If you think winny is so great, that's fine, tell me opinion on it and we can look at it from both angles, there's nothing wrong with that, this is a discussion board, that's the point. And I like to hear people opinions on different subject, that is why I come here. But you... I constantly see you going around saying how you think people are doing things wrong, rarely backing up what you say or even giving your personal opinion, and to me that's what a parrot is. Please don't respond back if all you have to say are childish insults and try to mock my intelligence to make yourself look better... If your gonna answer back please give me your own personal opinion and have a grown up conversation. Is that so hard to understand?

[Mooseman33]

traction, let it go man....

u made a broad statement, Marcus disagreed...
u wanted to know why, he didnt want to tell/educate you....i will say marcus does not parrot bro, when he speaks, most listen, i know i do...

let it go and give this guy his thread back....

[c-Z]

Please. Take bullshit to PM's....... Winstrol alone is very poor.

[marcus300]

Really... I was expecting a little more class man, you dissapoint me. I am trying to have a discussion with you, I state my points, and all you do is launch insults and act like a child, and give nothing to back up what you say except really low remarks... You would think someone who has so many posts would know how to have a proper conversation instead of flaming. If you think winny is so great, that's fine, tell me opinion on it and we can look at it from both angles, there's nothing wrong with that, this is a discussion board, that's the point. And I like to hear people opinions on different subject, that is why I come here. But you... I constantly see you going around saying how you think people are doing things wrong, rarely backing up what you say or even giving your personal opinion, and to me that's what a parrot is. Please don't respond back if all you have to say are childish insults and try to mock my intelligence to make yourself look better... If your gonna answer back please give me your own personal opinion and have a grown up conversation. Is that so hard to understand?

LOL your funny and i can see your upset, but you talk rubbish and i dont think my experience is in question here, it was your statement what made me question yours! Why dont you go through my post's and see if i have any knowledge, maybe then you will understand and be able to comment on that instead of looking rather stupid, for your interest ive been in the bodybuilding world for over 22yrs, ive ran competitions, ran an online consultation company for bodybuilders and athletes all over the world, mixed circles with some very high profile people in this industry and i have a huge history of experimenting with all kinds of AAS, I could go on but i think i will stop there, with that alone i think i could have my say. I could at this point ask you your background but I dont need to i can gather that from your post's lol

Now all because you got upset becasue i questioned your answer, dont make things worse for yourself. winny is not useless unless in competition, it does produce some nice lean muscle tissue and gives good strength gains via the androgen recepter in the short term this is why it can be used within a cutting cycle and mass cycle, it can be used in various cycles not just when dieting for competition and its not useless IMHO. Not everyone experience gains from winny just like any other AAS but to state its useless unless in competition is really wrong.

Now please put this thread back on topic and think before you write next time.

[marcus300]

Please. Take bullshit to PM's....... Winstrol alone is very poor.

I agree, there are far better options

[T-MOS]

To the OP,

Please list your complete stats please so we can try to help you , winny by itself is NOT the way to go

age
height
weight
bodyfat %
Diet
yrs training
any previous cycles
PCT planned for this cycle
Goals for this

this will help us help you.

[TractionIssues]

This will be my last post on the subject.

If marcus is to believe something about winny, that is purely his opinion, except I don't even know what he thinks because he didn't even tell me any. Now I am appauled as how someone would go and flame someone else just because their opinion was different and then try to mock my intelligence over it. Becuase I believe winstrol is not worth it if you are not getting ready for a competition is purely my opinion, and you can agree or disagree thats fine. But I state my opinion and this is what I end up with:

That is not correct at all, jeez !!!

We need to know alot more about yourself before we can give advice, stats ect!!

you should take a look at yourself and your advice before making such stupid comments.

I stick with what i said because in my opinion what you said is not correct, if you said something what i thought was correct i wouldnt say anything, would I. If you truely believe what you said fine, i just wanted to say I DONT.

Have you escaped from hospital or something?

I think you need to get more experience in ther world of AAS before giving advice, winny is a good AAS and is not just for competition,

All because you made to look rather stupid

Now keep this thread on topic and think next time and make sure you know what your talking about next time you post something, lol jeez

Why should i educate you when you wont even do it for yourself?

nope i didnt, doesnt matter if you put it in caps either it still looks stupid lol


You have talk total bull all the way through this thread, now stop posting bull

Now tell me at what point a mature and educated bodybuilder would answer like this with such attitude and rudeness? I never said anything to insult marcus, why insult me? I do not try to start any problems on the board and just like intersharing knowledge between eachother, and marcus I don't want you to go and give me this whole attitude bullshit, can you please just state your opinion and then forget about this?

[TractionIssues]

it can be used within a cutting cycle and mass cycle,

Winny on a mass cycle... and your telling me I don't know what I'm talking about?

[T-MOS]

Traction, if Marcus says something about winny or ANY other steroid related subject. i can guarantee to you that it is MUCH more than just opinion. He has more personal experience in this field then most people on this board put together....

Now quit with the BS here and get back to the OP's questions !!!!

[T-MOS]

Winny on a mass cycle... and your telling me I don't know what I'm talking about?

YES, you can use any compounds for cutting or bulking...ITS ALL DIET REMEMBER???

I have bulked on Tren
and used deca in cutting cycles.... its about DIET not compounds

[TractionIssues]

Sorry T-MOS I'm really just trying to have a mature discussion, but it doesn't seem to be possible with him. As for the OP, he has not responded to the htread since he started it.

[marcus300]

Ive never said winny is wonderful or i am trying push winny for that matter, if you go back and read, i disagreed with what you said, which was its useless unless in a competition, i dont think it is, now lets get this thread back on track and if you do go back and re-read you will see it was you who started the attitude because i disagreed with you, chill out and move on

[TractionIssues]

YES, you can use any compounds for cutting or bulking...ITS ALL DIET REMEMBER???

I have bulked on Tren
and used deca in cutting cycles.... its about DIET not compounds

Yes I agree, just that winny would yield insignificant gains and would most likely restrict the use of intense training for mass due to it's effects on tendons and joints and I would highly not recommend it. Not to mention the added strength and size you will put on during a mass cycle would cause serious problems because of this.

[marcus300]

Winny on a mass cycle... and your telling me I don't know what I'm talking about?

yes you can use it within a mass cycle why not? it works great for the start of any mass cycle if used correctly, only because you have never tried it doesnt mean it isnt effective. Agreed other compounds might be a better option but it can be used if winny is the desired choice

read this section from this ref -

Winny is also quite effective at promoting strength because it binds very well at the androgen receptor. Short term stanozolol use can promote drastic strength, a feat often employed early in a bulking cycle (although d-bol would be more suited in that case) or late in a cutting cycle to prevent a decrease in performance. This combined with the red blood cell count-stimulating properties of its androgen affinity make it popular among track athletes as well in order to beget better results. As many, including Ben Johnson, did not take into account it can be detected for quite some time after last use so its not advisable for drug tested athletes. Many have assumed otherwise due to the short half-life, but apparently some inactive metabolites are easily esterified, so they can be found up to 5 months after the last injection.

Winny is mostly quite well-tolerated in men. Cramps, headaches, elevated blood pressure and cholesterol levels and liver damage are noted, but on a not so-frequent basis. Standard virilization symptoms associated with the stimulating of the androgen receptor, however, are a problem. Acne, prostate hypertrophy and an aggravation of male pattern baldness can occur, so use by women has to be discouraged.

Due to the frequent rate of injections, users generally have to go spotting for different sites of injection on the body. Calves, shoulders, arms and such. When doing so they noted a localized increase in mass which has given root to the myth that Winny can add muscle where it is injected. What I'm about to say goes for all compounds known to date : Steroids do not increase mass locally. The observance is noted because the injection breaks the fascia around the muscle, which possibly gives a muscle a little more room to grow. This is mostly temporary, and in the best cases very limited. Multiple injections would not increase the size in comparison. When the fascia heals, if it heals, it can lead to something called compartments syndrome, where a nerve is pinched between a muscle and its fascia. Leading to numbness quite often and in some cases to a paralysis of everything that nerve controls. This is not a frequent occurrence. This is rare, but my point was documenting that localized growth spurred by an injection is a myth.

A last note about injectable Winny is : shake before use. Its called an aqueous solution, but the Winny being a steroid is not particularly polar, meaning it doesn't dissolve in the water. When the stuff sits, it will accumulate at the bottom of the vial. A good way to recognize the real stuff as well. So shake before you draw it into a syringe or mix it before you drink it, and perhaps even stir it again once in the syringe prior to injection.

References

1 Ellis AJ, Cawston TE, Mackie EJ., The differential effects of stanozolol on human skin and synovial fibroblasts in vitro: DNA synthesis and receptor binding., Agents Actions 1994 Mar;41(1-2):37-43

2 Brestel EP, Thrush LB., The treatment of glucocorticosteroid-dependent chronic urticaria with stanozolol., J Allergy Clin Immunol 1988 Aug;82(2):265-9

[T-MOS]

Yes I agree, just that winny would yield insignificant gains and would most likely restrict the use of intense training for mass due to it's effects on tendons and joints and I would highly not recommend it. Not to mention the added strength and size you will put on during a mass cycle would cause serious problems because of this.

agreed, and I probably wouldn't use it in a bulking cycle....but one could...

[TractionIssues]

Ive never said winny is wonderful or i am trying push winny for that matter, if you go back and read, i disagreed with what you said, which was its useless unless in a competition, i dont think it is, now lets get this thread back on track and if you do go back and re-read you will see it was you who started the attitude because i disagreed with you, chill out and move on

How am I supossed to even know what you think if you STILL HAVN'T ANSWERED MY QUESTION. WHAT IS YOUR OPINION ON WHY YOU THINK WINNY WOULD BE A GOOD ALTERNATIVE FOR HIM. I didn not insult you once and every single one of your comments was insulting towards me, and you say that I'M THE ONE that gave you attitude? Cmon now are you delusional?

[TractionIssues]

yes you can use it within a mass cycle why not? it works great for the start of any mass cycle if used correctly, only because you have never tried it doesnt mean it isnt effective. Agreed other compounds might be a better option but it can be used if winny is the desired choice

read this section from this ref -

Winny is also quite effective at promoting strength because it binds very well at the androgen receptor. Short term stanozolol use can promote drastic strength, a feat often employed early in a bulking cycle (although d-bol would be more suited in that case) or late in a cutting cycle to prevent a decrease in performance. This combined with the red blood cell count-stimulating properties of its androgen affinity make it popular among track athletes as well in order to beget better results. As many, including Ben Johnson, did not take into account it can be detected for quite some time after last use so its not advisable for drug tested athletes. Many have assumed otherwise due to the short half-life, but apparently some inactive metabolites are easily esterified, so they can be found up to 5 months after the last injection.

Winny is mostly quite well-tolerated in men. Cramps, headaches, elevated blood pressure and cholesterol levels and liver damage are noted, but on a not so-frequent basis. Standard virilization symptoms associated with the stimulating of the androgen receptor, however, are a problem. Acne, prostate hypertrophy and an aggravation of male pattern baldness can occur, so use by women has to be discouraged.

Due to the frequent rate of injections, users generally have to go spotting for different sites of injection on the body. Calves, shoulders, arms and such. When doing so they noted a localized increase in mass which has given root to the myth that Winny can add muscle where it is injected. What I'm about to say goes for all compounds known to date : Steroids do not increase mass locally. The observance is noted because the injection breaks the fascia around the muscle, which possibly gives a muscle a little more room to grow. This is mostly temporary, and in the best cases very limited. Multiple injections would not increase the size in comparison. When the fascia heals, if it heals, it can lead to something called compartments syndrome, where a nerve is pinched between a muscle and its fascia. Leading to numbness quite often and in some cases to a paralysis of everything that nerve controls. This is not a frequent occurrence. This is rare, but my point was documenting that localized growth spurred by an injection is a myth.

A last note about injectable Winny is : shake before use. Its called an aqueous solution, but the Winny being a steroid is not particularly polar, meaning it doesn't dissolve in the water. When the stuff sits, it will accumulate at the bottom of the vial. A good way to recognize the real stuff as well. So shake before you draw it into a syringe or mix it before you drink it, and perhaps even stir it again once in the syringe prior to injection.

References

1 Ellis AJ, Cawston TE, Mackie EJ., The differential effects of stanozolol on human skin and synovial fibroblasts in vitro: DNA synthesis and receptor binding., Agents Actions 1994 Mar;41(1-2):37-43

2 Brestel EP, Thrush LB., The treatment of glucocorticosteroid-dependent chronic urticaria with stanozolol., J Allergy Clin Immunol 1988 Aug;82(2):265-9

You probably could, just like you COULD do ANYTHING at any time. Does that mean it SHOULD be done? No... There are so many better alternative that it would make no sense to do so.

[marcus300]

How am I supossed to even know what you think if you STILL HAVN'T ANSWERED MY QUESTION. WHAT IS YOUR OPINION ON WHY YOU THINK WINNY WOULD BE A GOOD ALTERNATIVE FOR HIM. I didn not insult you once and every single one of your comments was insulting towards me, and you say that I'M THE ONE that gave you attitude? Cmon now are you delusional?

What are you on about, ive have never said within this thread that winny could be a good AAS for him, i dont know nothing about him and winny alone isnt the best way forward.

I WILL TRY AND TELL YOU AGAIN IN CAPS (SO IT MAY SINK IN)

YOU SAID "Winstrol is useless overall unless you are about to do a competition and you are already cut like a mofo" I SAID THATS NOT CORRECT.

Ive never said anything about the thread starter and what he should do because we need to know more about him.

Is this sinking in now?