Why does test need to be taken as a base...just curious

[DRAMBRO]

Can someone explain to me what is the scientific reason tren must be used as a base with tren or deca..

I know test will offfset many ofthe sides that tren or deca causs...but simple questoon...whyp

[Matt]

You need to edit the first line of your question..........

Ask yourself this question, as a man imagine not having any testosterone and the negative effects of not having testosterone...

[DRAMBRO]

The reason I ask is I did a tren only.cycle which.didnt.shut me down.....but reallly messsed up my libido and ability to erections...


All bw came back normal though....which tren messsed up my receptors or maybe.i have high prog levels...as my.endo didnt order yhat tested

He tested..test..free test...lh..fsh....estradioll...shbg..prolacton etc


Should prog should have beeen loooked at also....

And would go ok n back n doin a test only cycle.reverse any of this damage to libido n erectons

[Matt]

You need to post your full test results because what your saying just doesn't make sense.

If you took real tren then trust me you were completely shut down and you said it yourself, you had no libido and couldn't get erections which means you were shut down....

And no running a test only cycle will only shut you down further, you need to run a good solid pct with maybe some hcg before you start...

[DRAMBRO]

Total test 714
Frest test 101
Estradiol 39
Shbg 50
Prolacton 6.l
Lh 5.9
Fsh 5.9
cortisol...dht also in range

Been off tren...pct for six monthz...

Still no libido and ability to get an erction without viagrA

o

I didnt get progesterone looked at...could that.be

Or could tren binded to receptors n im still messed up

[DRAMBRO]

Anyone please chime in on posssible hypothesese of what.could be.the issuso

[Srobis15]

High levels of progesterone and or prolactin can have side effects, usually which is ED and no libido , sometimes gyno. Thats why they tend to say stack with Test, as well as keep some Caber or the such around to keep the levels down. However, there is an article that pertains to this on the forums that even AI's have the ability to negate the negative side effects from progeterone related gyno and ED. Deca and Tren are probably the 2 AAS I would NEVER take without Test as a base, if I had no ability to get Test. Then again.....I wouldnt do AAS without Test on hand.

Good luck friend

[guitario]

The reason given is 'imagine as a man not having testosterone' but what about The steroids that increase libido, give you a sense of well being and are androgenic enough to simulate test?

[DRAMBRO]

Are progesterone n prolactin independent..

Reason I ask...my prolactin came back normal.in my blooodwork but the endo didnt.test my progesterone


Maybe the progesterone is still an issue and outta wack n caussin my isssues...

Please advise..if this is possible...ill ask my endo to order my progesterone in blooodwork


Any advice would be awesome

[PK-V]

Yes testosterone along side 19-nors will help regulate DHT levels which will keep gyno at bay

[DRAMBRO]

Not worried about gyno..more sexualsidez..ed...low libido etc


I had prolactin checked...came back normal...so did test..estraduiol..shbg etc

Worth getttin proge ste rone loooked at as I read tren can mess up prog levels

[AstheticKing]

heres the evidence

your dick will be limp

[DRAMBRO]

Agreeed...i messsed up...but tryin to figure out why im still havin isssues eight months after cycle..


My bw is posted above....should I get progesterone checked....all other levels apppear normal

[Lemonada8]

you are still having issues? or are you wanting to know why you need test as a base?

You stop natural test production, and testosterone has many more effects than just building muscle. When you use a compound that doenst react with the enzymes the same way test does that adds the potential for big problems.

and progesterone wont really make a difference, its the 'mother of all hormones'. its acts like a resivoir for men for test production. but if it makes you feel good, then go for it.

[DRAMBRO]

Was great while takin the test lemonada..just wrappped up like pct n passed two days.noticed my isssues are.comin back...


Im lost why this is happpening.

With a totak test above 700 and everything else in range...why is my libido nill

[Matt]

I presume those blood test results were taken six months after you finished your cycle??

[DRAMBRO]

yes...6 months

I spoke to a professional in HRT today

he said that my SHBG -estradiol being both in the high 40s is almost def causing the issue


althoigh my test is normal...700....i need to get SHBG and Estradiol down in the mid-20s



he recommended
50mg of anavar a day for a month
1ml of liquidex every 3rd day for a month

he said if i can get both those in the 20s...i should be good to go

he also said anavar wont supress my htpa...wanted ur thoughts

[gixxerboy1]

i dont agree with the anavar.
And 1ml of l-dex? How many mg's is that?

[deeznutts]

your hrt specialist recommended anavar to help your libido/erection problems?

[Str8Jakked]

he also said anavar wont supress my htpa...wanted ur thoughts

Tell him he is an idiot... after only 5 days and at only 15mg per day suppression will occur.

[jimmyinkedup]

your hrt specialist recommended anavar to help your libido/erection problems?

in addition to this he apprently recommended research chem armidex rather than prescription tabs and specified dosage in ml - not milligrams....
True professional huh ?

[DRAMBRO]

He said anavar will lower shbg and anavar and won shut me dowm at aloe.dose

What.do u guys recommend to.lower my.shbg as thats what may be causin my libido issues

[DRAMBRO]

Guys..please dont.attack me.....not.doing what.he.said...just was gettin ur opinion on it


How.do i get my.shbg from.48 to mid .20s....

Please.advise

[jimmyinkedup]

Guys..please dont.attack me.....not.doing what.he.said...just was gettin ur opinion on it


How.do i get my.shbg from.48 to mid .20s....

Please.advise

I cant speak for anyone else but i was commenting more on the adivce you were given as opposed to attacking you.

Im no "expert" but perhaps low dose aromasin is the ticket here. Will obviously lower estrogen and reduce shbg as well. Just a thought - again im no expert. Id try this route rather than say adex with proviron to lower shbg or even just proviron alone as some may suggest......jmo...

[gixxerboy1]

Guys..please dont.attack me.....not.doing what.he.said...just was gettin ur opinion on it


How.do i get my.shbg from.48 to mid .20s....

Please.advise

Dont think anyone was attacking you or meant to. Sometimes its hard to tell how things come across on a board.

Well except for Jimmy he was attacking you but, then again he is an ass

[jimmyinkedup]

Dont think anyone was attacking you or meant to. Sometimes its hard to tell how things come across on a board.

Well except for Jimmy he was attacking you but, then again he is an ass

You know Gix even a statement said in jest contains an element of truth ...
Unless you werent saying it in jest...
In which case id agree .... *LOL*

[gixxerboy1]

You know Gix even a statement said in jest contains an element of truth ...
Unless you werent saying it in jest...
In which case id agree .... *LOL*

My wife always says that and it gets me in trouble. I'll say something to her completely joking and it turns into some kinda fight cause I must have meant it on some level according to her.

So now after that you are an ass lol

[jimmyinkedup]

My wife always says that and it gets me in trouble. I'll say something to her completely joking and it turns into some kinda fight cause I must have meant it on some level according to her.

So now after that you are an ass lol

Oh so now im acting like a woman?
So I guess im an ass that acts like a woman? Nice Gix Anthing else you feel the need to criticize me for today ? I mean have at it ...

*LOL* God thats scary huh? I mean some people (cough cough some women) actually think exactly that way ...

I tease the little lady all the time - Ill say oh i guess now we are playing the Seamus said -Stefanie heard game. Because i'll say one thing and she hears sonmething TOTALLY different....

[jtuner77]

The reason I ask is I did a tren only.cycle which.didnt.shut me down.....but reallly messsed up my libido and ability to erections...


All bw came back normal though....which tren messsed up my receptors or maybe.i have high prog levels...as my.endo didnt order yhat tested

He tested..test..free test...lh..fsh....estradioll...shbg..prolacton etc


Should prog should have beeen loooked at also....

And would go ok n back n doin a test only cycle.reverse any of this damage to libido n erectons

First line of your statement=being shut down guy

[DRAMBRO]

Heres what I dont understamd....everyone is sayin my.ed isssues are cuz.tren shut.me down...

I thought a.shutdown is defined as ur body stops makin its own test...


I got.bw done amd my.total test.was 702...That seeems lke a goood level six monts aftern.

So was my.ed still caused by this.shutdown...or high.shbg 49

[Honkey_Kong]

Drambro, there is no doctor in the ****ing world that will recommend you take a research chem. Especially when he possesses a prescription pad and can write you an RX for the real deal.

[DRAMBRO]

He didnt say thats what.he would presecribe....He said he would prescribe me aramasin

I told him I had a bottle of unopned liquidex...he said that would prob.work if its.a.reputable comany


The guy wanted me to submit a physcial ..bw etc to havr.him prescribe anything....

[DRAMBRO]

Can someone plz answer my.question in post 30...thank u

[jimmyinkedup]

Can someone plz answer my.question in post 30...thank u

Ok lemme take a stab at this. The prob is you took tren only with no test. Now your off. While u were on your body had no test to be 5alpha reduced to dht. DHT plays a crucial role in regulating shbg. Now your off ..your test is normal (or in that range) however one effect of tren is that it antagonizes the 5ar enzyme. So test is prob not effciently being 5 alpha reduced to dht -allowing shbg levels to remain higher than normal. Also tren is believed to increase aromatase...what does that mean - well not much when you were on since you had no test exogenous or endogenous to be aromitized...but ahh Now you do. Excess aromatase = excess estrogen. The problem isnt the shutdown - the problem is the body is a complicated mechanism that strives to reach homeostais and test plays a crucial role in it. You are now expeiencing the effects of not including it on cycle and you body struggling to return to normal. You took a powerful steroid with other effects or side effcts that to an extent are minimized when run with test..but you didnt do that. Now those effects are rearing their head post cycle and poct pct. Of course this is all just my opinion - i truly am not expert - this is largely educated speculation on my part. You should educate yourself re: proper cycles and potential of using hcg and proper pct to help alleviate this - for now i strongly recommend low dose aromasin - it will lower estrogen and shbg without rebound.l After some time you shoulkd be able to discontinue it with no rebound and hopefully your body will have returned to normal.


Also guitario (post #8) should read this. There really is no steroid to speak of other than dball that fitys your descripotion (and that has its shortcomings) - the rest offer potential issues just like described here.

[guitario]

@ Jimmyinkedup

The main steroid i was referring to was Dbol. I have taken it twice alone and both times literally feel no different (bar more libido) and totally fine during and after pct. The dose i take seems to achieve balance for me with regards to 'test' levels. Maybe i'm just lucky as i hear others find Dbol to be problematic. The only other steroid i would take alone is Anavar due to it being (at regular doses) mild on your body. Also i have friends who have done it and report good things.

I would like to add that i wouldnt do a harsh steroid or an injectable without test. Infact i aim to do test e at 450mg for 10 weeks in January.

[carbo]

yes...6 months

I spoke to a professional in HRT today

he said that my SHBG -estradiol being both in the high 40s is almost def causing the issue


althoigh my test is normal...700....i need to get SHBG and Estradiol down in the mid-20s



he recommended
50mg of anavar a day for a month
1ml of liquidex every 3rd day for a month

he said if i can get both those in the 20s...i should be good to go

he also said anavar wont supress my htpa...wanted ur thoughts

Let's see.. In my view, this is too harsh for a simple post-cycle correction.

I'd try proviron at 50mg ED for a month, and see how that works out for you.

[mlb29]

this what i would do.
hcg- 300ius every day for 3 weeks and arimidex at .25mgs every day if gyno is a prob then i would do a PCT
Clomid- 100mgs for 1 week, 50mgs week 2, 50 mgs week 3
Nolva- 20 mgs for 4 weeks

[DRAMBRO]

Thanks mlb...one of th few ppl who offer a possible solution

[jimmyinkedup]

Thanks mlb...one of th few ppl who offer a possible solution

-First you start a thread asking why test should be that base of all cycles.

-Then it turns out you f'ed up and didnt use it as such.

-Then we discover you are messed up and got some shitty advice from an "expert" andf wanna know what people think. Why you didnt speak to your endo - since that who was supposedly ordering and monitoring bloodwork god only knows.

-Then you want to knopw WHY tren alone did this to you (like it ****ing matters -its done) . Another good question for your endo btw.

-Then someone tell you to do a basic pct and you act like no one has bothered to offer you any info or advice....

This thread is BS ....

[DRAMBRO]

Jimm


Calm down.dude.....ur gettin all.fired.up.for no reason....

all I was saying.is ppl post for advice and many vets flip.on.them.for no reASON....