First Cycle = Need advice on dosages etc.

[LA89]

Hey guys,
I'm new to this whole thing but I've been training hard for several years and have done my homework.
Stats=
Age: 22
Heigh: 6' 0"
Weight: 190
Diet: Low to moderate fat high carb high protien
Side note: have done 2 cycles of superdrol and am quitting use bc of the high liver toxicity.

I plan on stacking deca 250 plus sust 250 (both 10ml vials) for 10 weeks. 1ml per week of each (250mgs). I can also use test e 250, but read that it causes more bloat, gyno etc. I have read all kinds of diff opinions on sust injections.
1.One guy said every day for 3 weeks, others say every other day, and most say once per week.
2.This is why I am wondering if i should just use test-e.
3.I have also read that Deca causes the infamous deca dick...should I be overly concerned with this?
4.Also I am considering stopping sust at week 9 to allow the 3 week half life to end with decas 2 week half life. Is this a good idea?
5.Should I follow with winstrol to help with water retention and/or round bloated look?
6.Should I wait to start PCT (arimadex + nolvadex) 21 days after last sust and 14 days after last deca shot (week 12)?
7.I realize my doses are not crazy high, but being my first go around I would rather play it more on the safe side. Please reply with knowledgeable and on subject replies. Thanks!

PS- I have each question numbered if you could reply according to that number to keep everything from gettin jumbled I would appreciate it.

[LA89]

Anybody?

[BigGuy90]

At 22 years old, nobody here is going to advise you to start taking AAS. They will tell you to do research on the endocrine and hpta, and hold off for another couple of years till at least 24 years old.

[LA89]

I have done ALOT of research and like I said above the only reason I'm taking the injectables is bc of the liver toxicity of the orals. Do you have any opinions/thoughts on the cycle above?

[songdog]

Orals or injectables neither is good for you.

[LA89]

I know you guys are tryin to look out for me and all but I "might" have already bought everything and am already committed...the best way you could help me is give me advice so I don't do anything wrong. Thanks

[randymeans]

[QUO! TE=LA89;5860728]I know you guys are tryin to look out for me and all but I "might" have already bought everything and am already committed...the best way you could help me is give me advice so I don't do anything wrong. Thanks[/QUOTE]

Nope! Train harder the next few years! Before I cycled I was 24 5'7" and 195lbs! Your 6 foot and 190lbs so I'm sure you can gain 15-20 more pounds!

[LA89]

You do have a good point...but I've been training for the last 4 years and intensely for the last year and plateaued at 185....orals were the only way I could really gain without jus putting fat...

[dooie]

Hey guys,
I'm new to this whole thing but I've been training hard for several years and have done my homework.
Stats=
Age: 22
Heigh: 6' 0"
Weight: 190
Diet: Low to moderate fat high carb high protien
Side note: have done 2 cycles of superdrol and am quitting use bc of the high liver toxicity.

I plan on stacking deca 250 plus sust 250 (both 10ml vials) for 10 weeks. 1ml per week of each (250mgs). I can also use test e 250, but read that it causes more bloat, gyno etc. I have read all kinds of diff opinions on sust injections.
1.One guy said every day for 3 weeks, others say every other day, and most say once per week.
2.This is why I am wondering if i should just use test-e.
3.I have also read that Deca causes the infamous deca dick...should I be overly concerned with this?
4.Also I am considering stopping sust at week 9 to allow the 3 week half life to end with decas 2 week half life. Is this a good idea?
5.Should I follow with winstrol to help with water retention and/or round bloated look?
6.Should I wait to start PCT (arimadex + nolvadex) 21 days after last sust and 14 days after last deca shot (week 12)?
7.I realize my doses are not crazy high, but being my first go around I would rather play it more on the safe side. Please reply with knowledgeable and on subject replies. Thanks!

PS- I have each question numbered if you could reply according to that number to keep everything from gettin jumbled I would appreciate it.

I have done ALOT of research and like I said above the only reason I'm taking the injectables is bc of the liver toxicity of the orals. Do you have any opinions/thoughts on the cycle above?

ALOT of research hey???
1. Your 2 young
2. Your too light, u could be much bigger natty
3. You don't stack for your first cycle
4. Your doses are wrong
5. One guy said every day for 3 weeks, others say every other day, and most say once per week. Oh dear, There is just too much inconsistency, better off not doing it and hurting yourself
6. Your 4th point is a VERY bad idea
7. Winstrol?? Really?? Another compound, bloat is caused by diet!!
8. Arim for PCT??

I thought you said you did ALOT of research? Hmm

[LA89]

Look man...everything I had questions about was in a forum that somebody else recommended. All I'm doing is trying to find the best way to run this. I have read the book Chemical Muscle Enhan***ent several times and guess I'm jus gonna follow his advice. Btw...im pretty sure he was 5'7" and 130lbs when he started.

[felk87]

best advice is listen to the vets man, they know the advice they are giving you is a wise one, dont rush into things because you just want to get big for a few months and that's with very hard dedicated work/diet, and then focking up the rest of your life just because you rushed into something that your body wasn't ready to handle. give it time and eat and train hard and by the time you are 25 you will be more than ready if you still want to do AAS.

[LA89]

Felk...thanks for the advice. I guess I'll just try it natural for now. But for the record my diet really is legit and I workout with both a bodybuilder and a world record holding powerlifter...so I have all that down for the most part. Not saying I know it all, but I always research before I take action and thought that 21 with 2 to 3 years of training qualified somebody to consider AS. In the book CME...he recommends a starter 4 week cycle of decca...could I do this with little to no sides?

[randymeans]

Felk...thanks for the advice. I guess I'll just try it natural for now. But for the record my diet really is legit and I workout with both a bodybuilder and a world record holding powerlifter...so I have all that down for the most part. Not saying I know it all, but I always research before I take action and thought that 21 with 2 to 3 years of training qualified somebody to consider AS. In the book CME...he recommends a starter 4 week cycle of decca...could I do this with little to no sides?

Try this.....cycle creatine+beta alanine+aminos! I weighed 170 a year ago and it took 10months to get 195lbs! That's my opinion of what cycle you should use!

[LA89]

I'll try that...thanks

[Scabtree]

Hey LA89; I somewhat know what you mean... there are many books and resources I've read that claim a cycle like the one you mentioned would be perfectly fine for the first time; However, it seems that on this forum Test is the was to go for the initial cycle; no doubt about it.

[felk87]

I'll try that...thanks

the problem doesn't start whether sides are an issue or not, is just you really are not fully developed, and by introducing a foreign compound to your body you can potentially damage or throw your hpta out of control leaving you with a limp dick for the rest of your life, having low test for the rest of your life, depression, and other effects that will make life difficult. which is why its advice to wait at least till you are 25 years of age to minimize the chances of this issues to occur, its not that people don't want you to take them, and sure there are some that do take them before and didn't get anything but good experiences, but at the same time there are those who got focked up for life and now are hrt, trt, and must take irregular routines that most of us wont have too just to get day by day, just wait, train hard, make your body reach natural limits, and if by the time you are 25 years old you still want to do AAS, you can decide if its the right time.

[LA89]

Scabtree...im glad I'm not the only one who read that on other forums! Whoever it was mentioned that I was too inconsistent above, but man...all the advice I've gotten from all these forums has been nothing but inconsistent! One forum was saying to front load the sust + decca cycle with d-Bol and then follow with winstrol and EQ to harden and dry up gains for a first cycle! You can see why I have been so confused! And felk...I understand that now and I have decided not to do any long cycles and def not test right now bc according to CME it can inhibit future gains?! But I'm gonna have to meet in the middle w u and do some low side effect compounds at lower dosages for shorter cycles to pick up maybe 5-10lbs at a time. The author of CME reccomends a 4 week cycle of decca for a starter and said it should offer good gains w no pct required (even though I will do something ovc to boost test levels). Thanks for all the advice! If you don mind...let me know what u think about this short cycle.

[Whoady]

test boosters wont prevent gyno. You need some anti-aromatase.

[LA89]

Got arimidex and nolvadex on hand...should I try hcg 2 weeks after last decca shot to jump start test levels followed by a product called metabotest which is basically tribulus. It's the best I've found ovc for a natural test booster. Also found some stuff called Estrofuse that works well with gyno. Some guys in the gym got some gyno after taking SD and Estrofuse dried it up in two weeks! Main ingredients are indole-3-carbinol and DMI

[Whoady]

Most places I read say do HCG throughout the entire cycle and stop a week or two after you stop injecting or start 2 weeks after injecting and run it through the whole cycle at 500/week split in 2 on two diff days. I wouldn't do this at 21 but it's your body and your life you know what I mean. When I was 21 I thought I was invincible. I'm 25 and I realize I'm not. Besides you'd be able to find all this stuff out anyway eventually.

[LA89]

Yea...ive read both ways too...but HCG acts as a lutenizing hormone and tells the testes to produce testosterone. I can see why you would want this during cycle, but it seems to make more sense to do this after a cycle followed by Clomid to encourage natural LH to be triggered. I got this info from CME and from what I understand the guys a M.D so I guess he knows what he's talking about. And I don't see why 4 weeks of decca or even test would be any worse than doing a round of SD, which I did last year and haven't had any problems. Of course I followed proper pct protocol....another question since you seem to want to help...what do you think about EQ? Some guys swear by it...others hate it! I was thinking about alternating it and decca in short cycles to kinda grow and harden and strengthen...

[Whoady]

I don't know much about EQ, a lot of guys on here say it's worthless like throwing your money away.

What I think is the case with HCG is that because it doesn't allow your balls to shrivel up on cycle that your HPTA recovers faster since it got the mechanism. Then all you're left with is the pituitary and hypothalamus to recover. Preventing the balls from shrinking too much, I would think, is better than letting them shrink and then trying to bring them back while worrying about other things and trying to keep your gains. you can have your engine running and brakes working but if you got a flat tire, what's the use?

[Whoady]

Also, ever heard of decca dick? I hear it's pretty bad on your hpta. I've seen a lot of guys come on here complaining of erection problems after doing cycles of decca. Be careful, and of course I don't know what PCT they had but I would assume that you need a proper PCT like with anything.

[Whoady]

BTW you in LA?

[LA89]

Yea I have heard that but I've also heard that its more from prolonged use. I don't think 4 weeks will hurt, plus the CME guy didn't seem too worried about it...And I've heard both sides concerning EQ...for an advanced user it might not do what they want it to, but for a novice it might jus give me some solid strength and size gains and some good hardness and muscle density!

[aronjrsmil]

Way too young. Wait til your mid 20's at least. Hormone chaos will ensue if you start now.

[dooie]

Yea I have heard that but I've also heard that its more from prolonged use. I don't think 4 weeks will hurt, plus the CME guy didn't seem too worried about it...And I've heard both sides concerning EQ...for an advanced user it might not do what they want it to, but for a novice it might jus give me some solid strength and size gains and some good hardness and muscle density!

4 weeks is a dumb idea bro! It'll take that long for the deca to even kick in!
Just wait mate!
If you do a cycle it'll only hinder your gains later