Adverse event -- testosterone cypionate

[catburgers]

I'm on week 5 of testosterone cypionate, 300mg.

For the past two weeks I've noticed intense anxiety, dizziness, confusion, cognition problems and dramatic reduction in short term memory for up to 72 hours post injection.

They seem to gradually increase post injection and peak 24-36 hours in.

Verbal memory and speed of thought are definitely hampered.

Is it possible this is dose related? Or estrogen side effects related?

At this point I plan on reducing my dosage and/or stopping the cycle and beginning PCT immediately 3 weeks after the last injection. I did not anticipate serious neurological effects.

Anybody care to chime in? Anybody else experienced these side effects?

[MuscleInk]

AAS use can result in alteration of neuronal and electrophysiological function in a number of brain regions responsible for memory, emotion, sleep, appetite, but these changes are more common among very young users (under 21 years of age) or chronic users of AAS and are not typical of episodic users.

Have you had any blood work done recently?

What is the frequency and duration of the symptoms?

Can you provide a bit more detail about the abnormal functions you are experiencing?

How confident are you about the supplier (please do NOT reference your source)?

[kelkel]

And what's your complete protocol?

[Bonaparte]

Riiight...

[catburgers]

Gear is not pharma grade however lab tests show it is legitimate. Material is a thin oil, yellow in color, no odor. BAC percentage and suspension material are unknown.

My profile/history: 30 year old male software engineer -- never used AAS or illicit substances before.

Lab results pre-cycle put me at the below the "low" threshold of normal (321ng/dl on range of 350-1,200ng/dl).

Neurological symptoms:
Starting at 6-8 hours post injection slight headache is present. By 12 hours verbal memory (recalling words, names of musicians, names of TV shows) is significantly impacted. By 24 hours there's a distinct "disconnect" from the real world -- inability to make sense of driving directions. Simple (for me...software engineer with math degree) mental chores (arithmetic, solving a differential equation, etc) become exhausting and impossible to comprehend. I can't keep focused on a person's words long enough to make sense of them. Remembering the topic of conversation becomes impossible. When I look at a map I can't comprehend the flow of traffic. Peripheral vision object detection "stops working" -- tunnel vision observed -- can only focus on the item/thing directly in front of me. Driving a vehicle is unsafe during this period. By 48 hours post injection my memory begins to start working again and conversation becomes possible again. Headache subsides by 48 hours post injection. By 72 hours mental acuity seems to return to baseline levels or near baseline levels and tunnel vision stops.

Psychiatric symptoms:
Anxiety ramps up approximately 12 hours post injection. "Dark" overwhelming thoughts of death, dying, something horrible happening, intense paranoia and fear. Anxiety peaks around 24-36 hours post injection. Anxiety slowly diminishes by 48 hours and no longer feels like the "world is ending". Mood is significantly depressed and morose. No indication of increased aggression or manic behavior. Slight increase in impulsiveness observed. Slightly increased level of emotional lability. At 72 hours return to baseline is observed.

Frequency of the symptoms is correlated with the 72 hour period immediately post injection. I have removed all stimulants (caffeine, chocolate, etc) from my diet. No other medications or supplements are being used. Diet is consistent and regular: chicken, eggs, cottage cheese, broccoli, spinach, oatmeal, fruits/vegetables, etc.

Complete protocol: 300mg 1ml shot Sunday nights at 9pm. No ancillaries being used.

[MuscleInk]

Riiight...

Would be the first time I'm seeing this to say the least.

[almostgone]

I'm not running anything currently, but in the past I actually found my thought processes to be somewhat sharper when on cycle....maybe because I'm older....IDK.

[GSXRvi6]

Gear is not pharma grade however lab tests show it is legitimate. Material is a thin oil, yellow in color, no odor. BAC percentage and suspension material are unknown.

My profile/history: 30 year old male software engineer -- never used AAS or illicit substances before.

Lab results pre-cycle put me at the below the "low" threshold of normal (321ng/dl on range of 350-1,200ng/dl).

Neurological symptoms:
Starting at 6-8 hours post injection slight headache is present. By 12 hours verbal memory (recalling words, names of musicians, names of TV shows) is significantly impacted. By 24 hours there's a distinct "disconnect" from the real world -- inability to make sense of driving directions. Simple (for me...software engineer with math degree) mental chores (arithmetic, solving a differential equation, etc) become exhausting and impossible to comprehend. I can't keep focused on a person's words long enough to make sense of them. Remembering the topic of conversation becomes impossible. When I look at a map I can't comprehend the flow of traffic. Peripheral vision object detection "stops working" -- tunnel vision observed -- can only focus on the item/thing directly in front of me. Driving a vehicle is unsafe during this period. By 48 hours post injection my memory begins to start working again and conversation becomes possible again. Headache subsides by 48 hours post injection. By 72 hours mental acuity seems to return to baseline levels or near baseline levels and tunnel vision stops.

Psychiatric symptoms:
Anxiety ramps up approximately 12 hours post injection. "Dark" overwhelming thoughts of death, dying, something horrible happening, intense paranoia and fear. Anxiety peaks around 24-36 hours post injection. Anxiety slowly diminishes by 48 hours and no longer feels like the "world is ending". Mood is significantly depressed and morose. No indication of increased aggression or manic behavior. Slight increase in impulsiveness observed. Slightly increased level of emotional lability. At 72 hours return to baseline is observed.

Frequency of the symptoms is correlated with the 72 hour period immediately post injection. I have removed all stimulants (caffeine, chocolate, etc) from my diet. No other medications or supplements are being used. Diet is consistent and regular: chicken, eggs, cottage cheese, broccoli, spinach, oatmeal, fruits/vegetables, etc.

Complete protocol: 300mg 1ml shot Sunday nights at 9pm. No ancillaries being used.

Get blood work then please post it, I'm curious to see what your deal is because cyp @ 300mg/wk makes me feel like a bad ass, sleep like a baby, and screw like a champion. But I run AI, CoQ10 and a bunch of other crap too for general nutrition supplementation and I've done blood work to verify my stuff is in the green.

If your not on TRT why did you choose cyp of you don't mind my asking (just curious)

[catburgers]

If your not on TRT why did you choose cyp of you don't mind my asking (just curious)

I had suffered an MS relapse earlier in the summer and I asked my GP to run my T levels just for the hell of it along with lots of other lab work. I thought low T might be the cause of my crippling fatigue. Liver, kidney, CBC and thyroid panel all came back in the green except for T. I attempted a clomid challenge and had my T retested 30 days later -- results came back at 600ng/dl so secondary hypogonadism was the diagnosis of the endocrinologist. GP refused to treat because it's the domain of endocrinologist, endocrinologist refused to treat without signoff from neurologist, neurologist refused to sign off in general to anything that isn't strictly a DMD (disease modifying drug). I decided to use cyp because my "doctor train" couldn't come to a consensus.

[easterbunny]

I wasn't aware that MS, which is an autoimmune disease, had anything to do with sex hormones... And it doesn't. There's more than one type of MS: relapsing-remitting; primary-progressive; idiopathic (one or two off situations); and of course the most text-book relapsing-remitting progressing to primary-progressive... It has to do with various immune cells penetrating the CNS, which typically doesn't happen. Its not facilitated by the male sex hormone, which is seen with women having more incidence/prevalence than men.

[easterbunny]

I had suffered an MS relapse earlier in the summer and I asked my GP to run my T levels just for the hell of it along with lots of other lab work. I thought low T might be the cause of my crippling fatigue. Liver, kidney, CBC and thyroid panel all came back in the green except for T. I attempted a clomid challenge and had my T retested 30 days later -- results came back at 600ng/dl so secondary hypogonadism was the diagnosis of the endocrinologist. GP refused to treat because it's the domain of endocrinologist, endocrinologist refused to treat without signoff from neurologist, neurologist refused to sign off in general to anything that isn't strictly a DMD (disease modifying drug). I decided to use cyp because my "doctor train" couldn't come to a consensus.

Another point with the MS thing. Patients with malignant prostatic cancer often have hormone treatment with E2 and/or test blockers. Despite gyno and other E2 sides, fatigue is not typically a reported symptom. Fatigue is normally associated with decreased O2 delivery (V/Q mismatch); < Hb; depression (massive cause); decreased metabolic rate (over many months ie; <TSH; <T3/T4). I am doubting you would see a linear relation between test levels and fatigue. - feeling like shit and fatigue are different things btw.

[John Andrew]

Interesting reading in Wikipedia about ms. So much sems to be unknown. They state stress and no clear indications from hormone treatment but maybe some solvents can exacerbate the situation.

Try using Test prop or Sustanon or Test E instead; hopefully from another source. Maybe some solvent in your Test C is causing your problems.

Good luck mate, remember it says stress is a factor, try to relax!!!

Kindest regards,

John

[AD]

Another point with the MS thing. Patients with malignant prostatic cancer often have hormone treatment with E2 and/or test blockers. Despite gyno and other E2 sides, fatigue is not typically a reported symptom. Fatigue is normally associated with decreased O2 delivery (V/Q mismatch); < Hb; depression (massive cause); decreased metabolic rate (over many months ie; <TSH; <T3/T4). I am doubting you would see a linear relation between test levels and fatigue. - feeling like shit and fatigue are different things btw.

Are you saying that it's impossible for hypogonadal men to ever feel fatigue or lethargy?

[easterbunny]

they are different things. one starts upon waking, the other becomes progressively apparent through-out the day...

and yes, they "do".

sorry: edit the above to: yes, of course they can!. it depends upon which, and in which specific context (of the so-called cause)...

sry, that was the context of the previous statement. AD, you were right to focus my comment.

[AD]

they are different things. one starts upon waking, the other becomes progressively apparent through-out the day...

Really? Which medical dictionary are you using?

[catburgers]

Another point with the MS thing. Patients with malignant prostatic cancer often have hormone treatment with E2 and/or test blockers. Despite gyno and other E2 sides, fatigue is not typically a reported symptom. Fatigue is normally associated with decreased O2 delivery (V/Q mismatch); < Hb; depression (massive cause); decreased metabolic rate (over many months ie; <TSH; <T3/T4). I am doubting you would see a linear relation between test levels and fatigue. - feeling like shit and fatigue are different things btw.

I think you're missing my point -- I have MS and I also happen to be hypogonadal. The two are not related. I have been suffering from MS for 10 years now. My discovery of my T levels happened because I had the audacity to ask my doctor for a lab test after an MS flare. I know what an MS attack feels like and this is not an MS attack. I am not implying a hormonal cause of MS and I am not implying MS had an effect on my hormone levels. I am merely noting symptoms I experience after administration of test cyp.

[austinite]

Really? Which medical dictionary are you using?

lol. Made me laugh. Thanks AD.

[GSXRvi6]

I think you're missing my point -- I have MS and I also happen to be hypogonadal. The two are not related. I have been suffering from MS for 10 years now. My discovery of my T levels happened because I had the audacity to ask my doctor for a lab test after an MS flare. I know what an MS attack feels like and this is not an MS attack. I am not implying a hormonal cause of MS and I am not implying MS had an effect on my hormone levels. I am merely noting symptoms I experience after administration of test cyp.

So your trying self medicate for low T by taking 300mg per week? What was your T levels at, that you decided to self medicate?

couple of things, 300mg/wk is most likely too much for hormone replacement therapy imo

Second, if you just had low T before, your about to completely shut your body down, if your source dry's up your going to be hung out to dry with full on crashed T levels not just low levels.

Kiss your nuts good bye, literally, they are gonna shrivel up if all your running is test, don't ask me how I know this cause I may be tempted to posted a picture (j/k )

If you truely have low T keep going to new doctors until you find one that is willing to treat you. Having a script with a steady supply of pharm grade cyp and syringes keeps you off the black market and you know for certain the stuff you inject is not fake or worse. You can also then get access to other treatment options that may be better for you like androgel etc.

Are you saying that it's impossible for hypogonadal men to ever feel fatigue or lethargy?

I thought they were two different things, lethargy --> perfectly content sitting in a chair staring at the wall daydreaming and just being "blank". Fatigue --> feeling tired, no energy.

This has always been my perception, not sure if it's right.

[Bonaparte]

It sounds like these side effects are either psycho-somatic and stemming from the anxiety that injecting illegal steroids is causing you, or that they are somehow related mainly to your MS. Because these sides are unheard of, especially on such a low dose of simple testosterone (and so shortly after injection, when it takes weeks to really start working).

[GSXRvi6]

It sounds like these side effects are either psycho-somatic and stemming from the anxiety that injecting illegal steroids is causing you, or that they are somehow related mainly to your MS. Because these sides are unheard of, especially on such a low dose of simple testosterone (and so shortly after injection, when it takes weeks to really start working).

When I started my low T treatment I started to notice results in just a couple of days. I would say I didn't feel the "full effect" for several weeks but there was a fast response. Maybe TMI but my morning wood was back in a couple of days, so I know it wasn't all just mental anticipation.

[austinite]

[catburgers]

It sounds like these side effects are either psycho-somatic and stemming from the anxiety that injecting illegal steroids is causing you, or that they are somehow related mainly to your MS. Because these sides are unheard of, especially on such a low dose of simple testosterone (and so shortly after injection, when it takes weeks to really start working).

Injecting intramuscular is no worry -- I did it for 5 years with interferon so there's absolutely no injection anxiety. Flu like side effects of interferon were too much so had to stop interferon.

I'm gonna have to rip on you for effectively saying "it's all in your mind". These are very real neurological effects. How can these side effects be unheard of?

Side effects listed on rxlist state:

"Call your doctor at once if you have any of these serious side effects:

swelling, rapid weight gain;
increased or ongoing erection of the penis;
bone pain, increased thirst, memory problems, restless feeling, confusion, nausea, loss of appetite, increased urination, weakness, muscle twitching; or
nausea, vomiting, stomach pain, loss of appetite, and jaundice (yellowing of the skin or..."

[catburgers]

My initial post states that I'm on week 5 and have only been experiencing these sides for 2 weeks.

[dnyce]

If you don't mind me asking, do you have a psychiatric history, also can you please list the full list of medications your on? (frequency & dose)

[johnnymctrance]

Scary stuff..