3 weeks

[PJS19]

Hi all.Today marks 3 weeks of the start of my TRT. I know blood work is the only real measure of anything but I wanted to report how its going and get feedback.

So far I have not felt any improvements in any symptoms, but night time erections are better.

I wasnt expecting my mental symptoms (depression brain fog etc low libido) to improve yet, but one thing I am dissapointed in is that I expect some of my physical symptoms to improve quicker.

When I was on clomid, within 10 days my body started to feel better atleast. Joints/back pain, all felt better.

With TRT I am still experiencing the joint pain/clicking/aches/weak and the back pain.

My protocol is..

50mg test cyp E3D Sub Q.
400IU HCG E3D

For the first 10 days I did 1/4 AI E3D but decided to not take any AI so after my first blood work I have a better picture of what E2 is doing and adjust accordingly.

Part of me thinks I am not absorbing the sub Q correctly or my dose isnt enough. I know its a slow process, but I know from experience with clomid that when my Test raises, my joints/bones/back feels better pretty quickly. Like I said I expect the mental symptoms to take more time than the physical.

[xcraider37]

Hi all.Today marks 3 weeks of the start of my TRT. I know blood work is the only real measure of anything but I wanted to report how its going and get feedback.

So far I have not felt any improvements in any symptoms, but night time erections are better.

I wasnt expecting my mental symptoms (depression brain fog etc low libido) to improve yet, but one thing I am dissapointed in is that I expect some of my physical symptoms to improve quicker.

When I was on clomid, within 10 days my body started to feel better atleast. Joints/back pain, all felt better.

With TRT I am still experiencing the joint pain/clicking/aches/weak and the back pain.

My protocol is..

50mg test cyp E3D weekly Sub Q.
400IU HCG E3D

For the first 10 days I did 1/4 AI E3D but decided to not take any AI so after my first blood work I have a better picture of what E2 is doing and adjust accordingly.

Part of me thinks I am not absorbing the sub Q correctly or my dose isnt enough. I know its a slow process, but I know from experience with clomid that when my Test raises, my joints/bones/back feels better pretty quickly. Like I said I expect the mental symptoms to take more time than the physical.

If you don't think the subq is working. Then MAKE a change to IM. Why do we over complicate this stuff? Good luck your still early on. Be patient.

[PJS19]

Thanks for the advice. Is switching to IM as easy as ordering different needles? Ill also have to learn how to inject IM but Im sure its not hard. I wanted to wait to see blood work before I made any changes, and my doctor was very against IM he said subQ is better, but I dont think thats the case for everyone. Maybe Ill just make a switch now.

Thanks

[PJS19]

Can you steer me towards the right needle size/length on ar-r.com for IM injections?

[hawk14dl]

1.5" and gage of your choice. I'm using 25g I believe

[PJS19]

Ok thanks. Now is it like the insulin syringes where you load and inject with the same needle?

[Rrexy]

Just my .02 cents -
I recently started TRT as well, completing my 5th injection last Saturday.
I pin 100mg / 1x week SubQ.
This is my first experience with Test. of any kind.
That being said, I'm just now starting to feel the effects.

In my experience / opinion and from reading on these forums, three weeks seems too soon to expect to feel any significant effects from your TRT.
Although It shouldn't necessarily matter which injection method you use, by switching now you won't know if changing from SQ to IM made a difference, or if it was simply the additional week or two of injections........

[Beethoven]

Usually around week 4 or 5, not to put a time on it but that's about the time you should start feeling better. That doesn't mean you're magically cured, it takes time to get dialed in as well. Be patient, you will need to see bw after about 6 weeks to see where you are at. Not everyone is the same and it's a trial and error process.

[GSXRvi6]

I don't see the need to switch to IM if SQ is getting your numbers up, give it a few more weeks and do your labs.

I do IM but that is how I started and that got me where I need to be so I run with it, several have success with SQ. Give it at least 4 to 6 weeks between "changes" to your protocol for you to adapt and settle in to the adjustment, TRT is not an overnight dial in.

[bullshark99]

Some people do NOT absorb very well SubQ, IM may make a difference but I would prob sit tight continue on course until it's time for bloods.

[hawk14dl]

Definitely wait out for your bw.

To answer your question, I actually posted that very question a couple of weeks ago. Seems the concensus is split, some draw and pin, some change the needle. I personally tried both, I prefer to change.

I believe on arrs site, you can buy the syringes that change tips as well as the ones you cannot. So that would be up to you. I do hcg sub q with an insulin syringe. Draw and inject, no problems ever. With the im injection, for some reason I couldn't do it. Probably just me.

[2Sox]

Hi all.Today marks 3 weeks of the start of my TRT. I know blood work is the only real measure of anything but I wanted to report how its going and get feedback.

So far I have not felt any improvements in any symptoms, but night time erections are better.

I wasnt expecting my mental symptoms (depression brain fog etc low libido) to improve yet, but one thing I am dissapointed in is that I expect some of my physical symptoms to improve quicker.

When I was on clomid, within 10 days my body started to feel better atleast. Joints/back pain, all felt better.

With TRT I am still experiencing the joint pain/clicking/aches/weak and the back pain.

My protocol is..

50mg test cyp E3D Sub Q.
400IU HCG E3D

For the first 10 days I did 1/4 AI E3D but decided to not take any AI so after my first blood work I have a better picture of what E2 is doing and adjust accordingly.

Part of me thinks I am not absorbing the sub Q correctly or my dose isnt enough. I know its a slow process, but I know from experience with clomid that when my Test raises, my joints/bones/back feels better pretty quickly. Like I said I expect the mental symptoms to take more time than the physical.

I would also suggest that you not switch your injection method. I agree with your doctor. As has been said, all responses are individual but SQ has a proven record of making for a more steady state release of T and therefore mimics the natural state of the body.

However, I would suggest you reduce you hCG dose to 250iu twice a week which would reduce you estrogen load. It's very important to keep in mind the very real effect of E2 levels on your feeling of well being. You may very well have significant T levels but a high E2 level would make you feel like nothing is happening. And the same goes for a low E2 level. How long have you been off the AI?

[slates]

I would also suggest that you not switch your injection method. I agree with your doctor. As has been said, all responses are individual but SQ has a proven record of making for a more steady state release of T and therefore mimics the natural state of the body.

However, I would suggest you reduce you hCG dose to 250iu twice a week which would reduce you estrogen load. It's very important to keep in mind the very real effect of E2 levels on your feeling of well being. You may very well have significant T levels but a high E2 level would make you feel like nothing is happening. And the same goes for a low E2 level. How long have you been off the AI?

Where is this been shown? (Not doubting you at all, just haven't seen many studies on SubQ testosterone administration.)

[2Sox]

Duplicate post.

[2Sox]

Where is this been shown? (Not doubting you at all, just haven't seen many studies on SubQ testosterone administration.)

It's very good that you are asking this question. Healthy skepticism on forums is very useful.

LowT, who speaks for LowTestosterone.com has commented on this on various threads. I also remember an article on SQ citing Canadian research. Sorry, but I'll have to leave any other Googling to you.

Just think of the difference in the two tissues. Fat and muscle tissue absorb and disperse T into the bloodstream at different rates. Muscle tissue has a richer vascular supply than fat tissues, therefore T is absorbed into the bloodstream at a faster rate when injected IM.

[ppwc1985]

What 2sox says, give it time op because three weeks is nowhere near enough time. Different lengths of time you will notice different things happening. But it can take up to 6 months to a year to realize all the benefits.

[PJS19]

thanks 2sox and everyone else for the advice. I will stick to subq until blood work.

2sox you asked when I stopped 1/4 AI e3d, that was after probably day 10. But I think I am going to do just 1/4th AI on wednesdays only. Im hesitant because my joint pain symptoms resemble low e2, but I dont think that means I should assume low e2.

thanks

[2Sox]

thanks 2sox and everyone else for the advice. I will stick to subq until blood work.

2sox you asked when I stopped 1/4 AI e3d, that was after probably day 10. But I think I am going to do just 1/4th AI on wednesdays only. Im hesitant because my joint pain symptoms resemble low e2, but I dont think that means I should assume low e2.

thanks

Again, you may want to consider reducing you hCG dose. I think many men underestimate or are unaware of the very real impact of the increased estrogen load they get as a result of high hCG dosing. I know I did. I had been taking 250iu EOD for awhile but I backed that down to 250iu 3x week. My E2 still was not under control. Only until I backed it down to 250iu - ONLY on Mondays and Fridays - did I realize what a difference it made. So far, the response has been very encouraging. My protocol of 200mg DIM, 50mg zinc, 4mg copper seems to be keeping my E2 under control for now. Keeping my fingers crossed. It may be too early to tell because it's only been a week that I have not taken an AI. (I had ONLY been taking 0.13mg E4D anyway - a very small dose, in comparison.) But my gut feeling is that reducing my hCG is the factor that made this difference.

[PJS19]

Good advice 2sox. Ill drop to 250 2x per week. Should I keep doin 1/4 ai once a week or wait till blood work before I add an ai

[2Sox]

Good advice 2sox. Ill drop to 250 2x per week. Should I keep doin 1/4 ai once a week or wait till blood work before I add an ai

If I were in your position, that's what I'd do. It's a toss up on whether or not I'd continue the .25mg adex/week. You have to go by how you feel. You'll just have to decide what you think is best.

[PJS19]

2sox, Im not sure if 250 is enough for me. Yesterday I did 250, and today my testicles still have an ache and are pretty tight. I wonder if that isnt enough for me or if I need to give it more time at that dose?

[2Sox]

2sox, Im not sure if 250 is enough for me. Yesterday I did 250, and today my testicles still have an ache and are pretty tight. I wonder if that isnt enough for me or if I need to give it more time at that dose?

Just to let you know, I'm far from an expert on TRT. I'm still learning like everyone else. With that said, it's common knowledge that there is no "one size fits all" with anything in TRT. If you have a feeling that 250iu twice a week doesn't work for you, why don't you play around with the doses? Some do 100iu ED and others 125iu EOD, and so many other combinations. Experiment and see what works for you - of course keeping in mind your E2 level.