Deca, Test & Dbol.. Opinions!

[Eduke93]

Hey,

What do you guys think, run 12-13 weeks higher dose or 15 weeks lower.

My question is what you’d run and why? A lot of guys here recommend not exceeding a gram others happy to go over, just want to know your thoughts.


Wk: 1-6: Dbol 60mg ED
Wk: 1-15: Test E 600mg P/W
Wk: 1-15: Deca 400mg P/W
Wk: 1-15: Arimidex 0.25 mg EOD

VS

Wk: 1-6: Dbol 60mg ED
Wk: 1-13: Test E 600-900mg
Wk: 1-13: Deca 600mg
Wk: 1-13: Arimidex 0.25 mg EOD

Caber on deck, injections split Mon/Thur.

No PCT as on TRT

I’ve used several Deca esters high and low doses up to 1.2 grams

FYI 1.2 grams I didn’t notice a difference from 600-800 apart from feeling bloated and shitty also this was a mixture of deca’s inc NPP

Cheers!

[Dannyboy51577]

Have you run deca/dbol before? Im guessing you are trying to put on size/mass?

I run test/deca now, didnt use dbol this time, but usually i dont need so much dbol to start. You might be different, but usually 30-40mg a day does it for me as long as my diet is ok. It will make ya hold water, but too much at the start tends to make me hold a shit ton more. I would say your lower dose with longer run is better option. Deca doesnt get going for quite a while, usually about wk 6 or 7 is when i can really just start to see the effects.
Ive run the combo quite a few times and am runnin 700test/500deca now and thats right in my range of sweet spot. When u start getting into even higher test and deca, you have to pay real close attention to sides- its noticeable at my levels, even more so at higher levels. I would say at 600test/400 deca with a dbol kickstart you will get more than enough gains-provided diet is legit- because you wont like these compounds on a shitty diet- you will end up with fat and bloat- i learned that from experience

If you run shorter, you are gonna cut it off right as you start to really get going with the deca

[Eduke93]

Have you run deca/dbol before? Im guessing you are trying to put on size/mass?

I run test/deca now, didnt use dbol this time, but usually i dont need so much dbol to start. You might be different, but usually 30-40mg a day does it for me as long as my diet is ok. It will make ya hold water, but too much at the start tends to make me hold a shit ton more. I would say your lower dose with longer run is better option. Deca doesnt get going for quite a while, usually about wk 6 or 7 is when i can really just start to see the effects.
Ive run the combo quite a few times and am runnin 700test/500deca now and thats right in my range of sweet spot. When u start getting into even higher test and deca, you have to pay real close attention to sides- its noticeable at my levels, even more so at higher levels. I would say at 600test/400 deca with a dbol kickstart you will get more than enough gains-provided diet is legit- because you wont like these compounds on a shitty diet- you will end up with fat and bloat- i learned that from experience

If you run shorter, you are gonna cut it off right as you start to really get going with the deca

Changed the question, wasn’t specific enough. Cheers.

[Dannyboy51577]

Yeah, ive done the same and not really noticed any positive really come out of deca at the higher dosages. Your longer plan seems a better idea, you should still be able to get gains with the deca after wk 10 with a good diet. As far as the dbol, you can start at 60 if thats what you want to do, ive just seen good results with lesser sides at a bit smaller dosages myself.

[Eduke93]

Yeah, ive done the same and not really noticed any positive really come out of deca at the higher dosages. Your longer plan seems a better idea, you should still be able to get gains with the deca after wk 10 with a good diet. As far as the dbol, you can start at 60 if thats what you want to do, ive just seen good results with lesser sides at a bit smaller dosages myself.

Yeah I’m more toward that as well, purely for health and the fact that there really isn’t a huge difference in terms of positive effects.

Dbol I handle well, usually run 50mg so upping it slightly.

Cheers pal

[fit_deskjocky]

I posted this same question a few months back when I was planning my 3rd cycle and have was advised to use 400mg Test a week w/ 600 mgs of Deca with 10wk taper method for the Dbol so you won't piss your gains away and I'm really liking the cycle so far as I'm in week 5.

Cycle length of 14 weeks, wk 1-12 Deca/ Test, wk 13-14 Test only as the long ester of Deca clears. The Dbol, 50mg wk 1-4, 25mg wk 5-7, 12.5mg wk 8-10.

With the lower Test than Deca the sides are very minimal to none for me. Zero caber needed and typically I'm not very estrogen prone so AI use is minimal. How ever bloods will tell but still waiting to get midcycle bloods.

[Eduke93]

Hey.

Sounds good, haven’t heard of tapering Dbol before so will look into that for sure.

I’ve used high Tren low test, but haven’t tried it with Deca before, may look into that also!

[Dannyboy51577]

Yeah it seems to be a person specific preference. I see alot of guys say it needs to be run a certain way or another all the time. Ive run it a few different ways and i prefer my test higher than my deca, just feels better for me. Sides and gains seemed to be about the same either way, at least for me. Im not really estrogen or prolactin prone either, so other than a little prami i dont really need much.
Theres alot of guys that prefer it even, or the other way around. I think if more guys based their dosages on how they feel or controlling sides, instead of doing it one way because someone told them they had to, it would be pretty easy to figure out which way it worked best for them individually.

[GearHeaded]

Hey.

Sounds good, haven’t heard of tapering Dbol before so will look into that for sure.

I’ve used high Tren low test, but haven’t tried it with Deca before, may look into that also!

I'm the guy that advocates and came up with the taper method for Dbol. The reason Dbol has a bad name with a lot of guys and they say the gains are not keepable cause you literally piss the gains away when you come off is because of the water . well the issue is these guys run Dbol at a high dose for 5 weeks or so and then they stop all together.. Dbol is great at partitioning glucose/glycogen into muscle cells. when this occurs the glucose is also brining along with it amino acids, nutrients, creatine, and WATER.. muscle is 70% water. the more water we can force into the cell the bigger fuller and stronger we will be.
the reason for the taper method is to give your body a chance to acclimate and get accustomed to the bigger fuller muscle cell filled with more water.. 5 weeks is simply not enough time. you literally piss the gains away. you need to give your body enough time to hold onto the new gains and acclimate to them. thats why I recommend 10 weeks of Dbol with the taper method.

example
weeks 1-5 - 60mg Dbol
weeks 6-8 - 40mg Dbol
weeks 9-10 - 20mg Dbol

doing this will help you acclimate to the new gains and higher body weight and thus help you keep and hold onto it when you come off.


on a side note-- not sure who says to not go over 1 gram of gear for a cycle. when I blast I'll generally use a 1 gram base and build my cycle around that 1 gram base.. example - either 1 gram of test, then all my other compounds are built around that. or if I want to do a low test cycle I'll do say 200mg of test and 800mg of EQ, ant those two together give me my 1 gram base and then I build the cycle with tren, mast, etc.. around that 1 gram base (EQ is nothing more then a non esztrgeoneic from of Test, thats why I use it to get that 1 gram base)

[GearHeaded]

regarding your cycle - and again I'm repeating myself here as I've said this many many times in other threads.. add MASTERON to your 19 nor cycles. it is very beneficial. it antagonizes both prolactin and estrogen receptors (thus giving you far fewer negative side effects) and it also has a strong affinity to SHBG, thus giving you a lot more free testosterone to go towards muscle building. its synergistic and will just make everything in your cycle work better.

[Eduke93]

I'm the guy that advocates and came up with the taper method for Dbol. The reason Dbol has a bad name with a lot of guys and they say the gains are not keepable cause you literally piss the gains away when you come off is because of the water . well the issue is these guys run Dbol at a high dose for 5 weeks or so and then they stop all together.. Dbol is great at partitioning glucose/glycogen into muscle cells. when this occurs the glucose is also brining along with it amino acids, nutrients, creatine, and WATER.. muscle is 70% water. the more water we can force into the cell the bigger fuller and stronger we will be.
the reason for the taper method is to give your body a chance to acclimate and get accustomed to the bigger fuller muscle cell filled with more water.. 5 weeks is simply not enough time. you literally piss the gains away. you need to give your body enough time to hold onto the new gains and acclimate to them. thats why I recommend 10 weeks of Dbol with the taper method.

example
weeks 1-5 - 60mg Dbol
weeks 6-8 - 40mg Dbol
weeks 9-10 - 20mg Dbol

doing this will help you acclimate to the new gains and higher body weight and thus help you keep and hold onto it when you come off.


on a side note-- not sure who says to not go over 1 gram of gear for a cycle. when I blast I'll generally use a 1 gram base and build my cycle around that 1 gram base.. example - either 1 gram of test, then all my other compounds are built around that. or if I want to do a low test cycle I'll do say 200mg of test and 800mg of EQ, ant those two together give me my 1 gram base and then I build the cycle with tren, mast, etc.. around that 1 gram base (EQ is nothing more then a non esztrgeoneic from of Test, thats why I use it to get that 1 gram base)

Makes sense, I knew you have written on this before but couldn't pinpoint a thread where you go into detail so thanks for your reply. I am not an advocate for anything at this point, I've used high and low doses and was looking for other peoples opinions, i am still trying to find my "sweet spot". I think most guys on here and other forums who do advise not to exceed a gram is purely for long term health and usually advise using this lower dose method unless your looking to compete.

Appreciate your input.

[Eduke93]

regarding your cycle - and again I'm repeating myself here as I've said this many many times in other threads.. add MASTERON to your 19 nor cycles. it is very beneficial. it antagonizes both prolactin and estrogen receptors (thus giving you far fewer negative side effects) and it also has a strong affinity to SHBG, thus giving you a lot more free testosterone to go towards muscle building. its synergistic and will just make everything in your cycle work better.

Thanks, I have used mast with tren and had great results, never with deca though. I think i will follow your protocol/ideas for this blast as below, let me know your thoughts.

Orals:
1-5 Dbol 40mg ED
5-7 Dbol 30mg ED
7-10 Dbol 20mg ED

Injectables:
1-16 Test E 900mg
1-16 Deca 750mg
1-16 Mast 400mg

Ai .25mg EOD (will adjust blood work/feel dependant)
Caber on hand.

Cheers

[GearHeaded]

looks pretty good to me. with the Masteron in there you can probably get by with a lower dose of Test (again because they Mast is going to free up more Test then you would otherwise have without it being in there)

[Eduke93]

Makes sense, would prefer to run less test if that’s the case.

Will drop the test down to match the Deca at 750.

Cheers GH