Anastrozole or letrozole

[teedoff]

So trying to understand the pros and cons of each of these, or which one might be better.

I've read that some here recommending letrozole, but my hormone pa says he likes anastrozole better.

Does one suppress estrogen more or maybe faster? Isn't higher estrogen a good thing when test is elevated?

[Cylon357]

So trying to understand the pros and cons of each of these, or which one might be better.

I've read that some here recommending letrozole, but my hormone pa says he likes anastrozole better.

Does one suppress estrogen more or maybe faster? Isn't higher estrogen a good thing when test is elevated?

Primo and / or proviron. You are welcome.

But, to be a little more "helpful", why do you think you need either? Symptoms or just to keep on hand?

Higher estrogen is good as long as you don't get sides, thus the question above about "why either".

Which one is "better" is, IMO, going to be subject to personal experience. If you really have sides, try managing with other means (reducing dose, adding DHTs, etc) before adding in an AI.

[956Vette]

Letrozole is the big guns you want in case of emergency, in an attempt to reduce your size before needing gyno surgery. Arimidex is the first line AI doctors today are comfortable prescribing long term - side effects from typical anastrozole overdose are less intense than letrozole.

How are you doing teedoff, what's the latest? What course of action did your hormone consult recommend?

[teedoff]

Ok. Sorry I take for granted you guys remember my other threads related to my ongoing gyno issue. Lol

So to be brief, trt for almost 3 years. Developed a lump a year ago or so, but thought maybe it was just me being paranoid. Switched from gel to injections about 4 months ago. Lump remained as well as some soreness around my nipple.

So even on the gel, with test levels in range, gyno....

When I switched to injections I started out a bit high. Test wqs 1400 or so. I reduced my dose to half, but lump remained. Had a mammogram and confirmed it was indeed gyno. Last 3 weeks I've reduced try does in half again. Lump is still there as I haven't taken any ai. Hence my question.

I have adex on hand and will start it this week. My thinking is long term since apparently even trt dose levels seem to come with gyno for me. And my plans to do some blasts at some point when I get some weight off again.

[teedoff]

Letrozole is the big guns you want in case of emergency, in an attempt to reduce your size before needing gyno surgery. Arimidex is the first line AI doctors today are comfortable prescribing long term - side effects from typical anastrozole overdose are less intense than letrozole.

How are you doing teedoff, what's the latest? What course of action did your hormone consult recommend?

Mainstream dr recommends stopping trt, otherwise surgery.

Hormone Dr was the one that said he likes letrozole better. Like I said, I have plenty of arimidex in hand.

BTW. Now that I'm doing one dose a week. .75mg, I notice I don't feel as good. My pcp Dr suggested I go off trt, but said if I felt like crap he was fine if I stay on it.

[Cylon357]

Ok. Sorry I take for granted you guys remember my other threads related to my ongoing gyno issue. Lol

So to be brief, trt for almost 3 years. Developed a lump a year ago or so, but thought maybe it was just me being paranoid. Switched from gel to injections about 4 months ago. Lump remained as well as some soreness around my nipple.

So even on the gel, with test levels in range, gyno....

When I switched to injections I started out a bit high. Test wqs 1400 or so. I reduced my dose to half, but lump remained. Had a mammogram and confirmed it was indeed gyno. Last 3 weeks I've reduced try does in half again. Lump is still there as I haven't taken any ai. Hence my question.

I have adex on hand and will start it this week. My thinking is long term since apparently even trt dose levels seem to come with gyno for me. And my plans to do some blasts at some point when I get some weight off again.

Ok, yeah maybe I do remember something about that. Assuming you have tried nolvadex and raloxifene, have you also tried masteron? It was a breast cancer drug used to shrink breast tissue, IIRC.

There IS a protocol documented somewhere on the site that involves alternating letrozole and a SERM, I think, though I don't remember the details. It basically involves nuking your estrogen into the ground for an extended period of time, like a few months. It might be better than surgery though. Peep the various "gyno protocol" threads, it is around somewhere. I'll see if I can find it in the morning.

[956Vette]

Happy to hear you've scaled back the dose, feel you're on the right track...quitting isn't the answer. Do all you can to get back to homeostasis, be patient as it can be a slow grind to reduce size/symptoms. Don't delay, start with .25mg arimidex dosages every few days, it's entirely possible that you're early and can reverse course (bonus had you add daily SERM, such as tamoxifen).

If in 2023 you're still unsatisfied with the size/discomfort of your glands, upgrade inhibitor to letrozole (and just like anastrozole, cut pills in 1/4 and space out) and add raloxifene as your estrogen blocker.

Even with successful gyno surgery, probably would recommend forgetting plans to blast hormones that aromatize. Perhaps a blast/experiment for one who is or has experienced estrogenic side effects from traditional testosterone would be to run heavy derivative, ~750mg/wk nandrolone (19-nortestosterone).

[teedoff]

Ok, yeah maybe I do remember something about that. Assuming you have tried nolvadex and raloxifene, have you also tried masteron? It was a breast cancer drug used to shrink breast tissue, IIRC.

There IS a protocol documented somewhere on the site that involves alternating letrozole and a SERM, I think, though I don't remember the details. It basically involves nuking your estrogen into the ground for an extended period of time, like a few months. It might be better than surgery though. Peep the various "gyno protocol" threads, it is around somewhere. I'll see if I can find it in the morning.

No, only thing I've used was arimidex. I mentioned nolva to my hormone Dr. That's when he said he liked letrozole.

[teedoff]

Happy to hear you've scaled back the dose, feel you're on the right track...quitting isn't the answer. Do all you can to get back to homeostasis, be patient as it can be a slow grind to reduce size/symptoms. Don't delay, start with .25mg arimidex dosages every few days, it's entirely possible that you're early and can reverse course (bonus had you add daily SERM, such as tamoxifen).

If in 2023 you're still unsatisfied with the size/discomfort of your glands, upgrade inhibitor to letrozole (and just like anastrozole, cut pills in 1/4 and space out) and add raloxifene as your estrogen blocker.

Even with successful gyno surgery, probably would recommend forgetting plans to blast hormones that aromatize. Perhaps a blast/experiment for one who is or has experienced estrogenic side effects from traditional testosterone would be to run heavy derivative, ~750mg/wk nandrolone (19-nortestosterone).

Thanks. I'm not sure I like how I feel on 75mg a week either. So if I get back that back up and feel good, I'm still dealing with the gyno side affects. I can't win. Lol

[956Vette]

Given you're on the aromatase inhibitor, would be okay to bump up the test dosage. Let us know if masteron, or even anavar are on your radar to make the experience not so bad.

[teedoff]

I did two anavar only cycles 2 years ago. Stuff is just too high. lol But I liked it for what it was. Pretty sure my hormone dr wouldnt prescribe it...at least not in doses like what I was taking.

My plan was to just do a couple of test cycles in the near future. I have plenty of arimidex on hand right now.

Also have 400 20mg dbol and 400 winstrol tabs as well. I think I've decided to not use the dbol.

[Honkey_Kong]

Thanks. I'm not sure I like how I feel on 75mg a week either. So if I get back that back up and feel good, I'm still dealing with the gyno side affects. I can't win. Lol

The gyno isn't probably as bad as you think it is (from somebody other than you's perspective). That being said, maybe it's time to put some cash away and look for surgical options? I think most of those type of doctors could have payment plans if you don't have the money up front.

[teedoff]

The gyno isn't probably as bad as you think it is (from somebody other than you's perspective). That being said, maybe it's time to put some cash away and look for surgical options? I think most of those type of doctors could have payment plans if you don't have the money up front.

You're probably right about it not being that bad yet. I'm just thinking long term trt use and continued gyno sides. But with my bf higher than it should be, ts nottjing noticeable. It's not like I have puffy nipples. Lol

But I'm also thinking of when I do cycle in the future and have that in the back of my mind. Low dose trt or higher dose trt doesn't seem to matter. Still get gyno. So yes surgery may be the end result at some point.

[Honkey_Kong]

You're probably right about it not being that bad yet. I'm just thinking long term trt use and continued gyno sides. But with my bf higher than it should be, ts nottjing noticeable. It's not like I have puffy nipples. Lol

But I'm also thinking of when I do cycle in the future and have that in the back of my mind. Low dose trt or higher dose trt doesn't seem to matter. Still get gyno. So yes surgery may be the end result at some point.

Since you're on trt, you're better off not worrying about gyno until it's a problem and then seeing your hormone doctor if something comes up

[956Vette]

Since you're on trt, you're better off not worrying about gyno until it's a problem and then seeing your hormone doctor if something comes up

If/when your testosterone doc recommends using letro, there's an issue and it's reasonable to worry, no?

[teedoff]

Since you're on trt, you're better off not worrying about gyno until it's a problem and then seeing your hormone doctor if something comes up

Define "problem". lol I mean I've had a lump in my left breast for about a year, except the couple weeks after taking arimedex a few months ago.

[Cuz]

Define "problem". lol I mean I've had a lump in my left breast for about a year, except the couple weeks after taking arimedex a few months ago.

Adex isnt gonna do shit for previous gyno, nolva or ralox “may” shrink it but its not going any. If those mfers start growing your only option is live with it or cut them out.

Letro is good for flat out crashing your estrogen and then you will feel like shit, nothing worse than having bitch tits and feeling shitty and your dick dont work..

[teedoff]

Adex isnt gonna do shit for previous gyno, nolva or ralox “may” shrink it but its not going any. If those mfers start growing your only option is live with it or cut them out.

Letro is good for flat out crashing your estrogen and then you will feel like shit, nothing worse than having bitch tits and feeling shitty and your dick dont work..

Ok now I'm confused. I thought adex was a drug many recommended if you started seeing signs of gyno....ie sensitivity and or lumps or puffiness.

It seemed to shrink it a few months ago when I took it.

Like I said, I asked hormone Dr about nolva and adex. Thats when he mentioned liking letrozole better.

Just had labs done this past Monday at that clinic, and I'll be seeing him on Tuesday for the follow up. Curious to see where my test levels are now that I'm only running 75mg once a week. Again. I don't feel all that great. Not terrible mind you, but I can tell I don't feel normal.

[Cuz]

Ok now I'm confused. I thought adex was a drug many recommended if you started seeing signs of gyno....ie sensitivity and or lumps or puffiness.

It seemed to shrink it a few months ago when I took it.

Like I said, I asked hormone Dr about nolva and adex. Thats when he mentioned liking letrozole better.

Just had labs done this past Monday at that clinic, and I'll be seeing him on Tuesday for the follow up. Curious to see where my test levels are now that I'm only running 75mg once a week. Again. I don't feel all that great. Not terrible mind you, but I can tell I don't feel normal.

Adex lowers E2. Nolva is a serm that blocks estrogen in the breast tissue.

[teedoff]

Adex lowers E2. Nolva is a serm that blocks estrogen in the breast tissue.

So then, nolva would be the better thing to take in my situation.

[Cuz]

So then, nolva would be the better thing to take in my situation.

Yes . Have you taken blood work to see where estrogen level is by chance?

[teedoff]

Yes . Have you taken blood work to see where estrogen level is by chance?

Mentioned above. Labs pulled Monday. Follow up to get results with hormone Dr this Tuesday.

Previously labs showed estrogen around 95 if I remember, but that wqs also with test at 1400.

[Cuz]

Mentioned above. Labs pulled Monday. Follow up to get results with hormone Dr this Tuesday.

Previously labs showed estrogen around 95 if I remember, but that wqs also with test at 1400.

Mine runs higher than that on my trt dose. I take adex .25 twice a week. But u can add nolva at about 20 mg a day until it goes away along side your adex. Trust me, you dont want letro

[teedoff]

Mine runs higher than that on my trt dose. I take adex .25 twice a week. But u can add nolva at about 20 mg a day until it goes away along side your adex. Trust me, you dont want letro

So I have taken some adex this week. But after labs were pulled Monday morning. Took .5mg twice. Maybe too much. Also have had jitters today. Wondering if adex would cause that.

FYI also on 20mg cialis a day now as well.

[teedoff]

So results from my latest labs.

Labs were pulled the day after my one weekly dose of 75mg, I think my end of week levels would still be lower.

[Cylon357]

So results from my latest labs.

Labs were pulled the day after my one weekly dose of 75mg, I think my end of week levels would still be lower.

Split that 75mg up into two or three injections per week. Yes, tiny dose but it will avoid you feeling like crap just before your next shot.

Possibly more importantly, it will also lead to more stable numbers. No, the peaks won't be as high, but the valleys won't be nearly so low. This includes flattening out the estradiol peaks and valleys that likely contributed to your issues in the first place.

It would be nice to add in some proviron or masteron to bind up some shbg and get your free t up. You are probably looking at the total t number and are disappointed but I would take that 800 or even 700 or 600 to get free t up 2x over range.

[teedoff]

Split that 75mg up into two or three injections per week. Yes, tiny dose but it will avoid you feeling like crap just before your next shot.

Possibly more importantly, it will also lead to more stable numbers. No, the peaks won't be as high, but the valleys won't be nearly so low. This includes flattening out the estradiol peaks and valleys that likely contributed to your issues in the first place.

It would be nice to add in some proviron or masteron to bind up some shbg and get your free t up. You are probably looking at the total t number and are disappointed but I would take that 800 or even 700 or 600 to get free t up 2x over range.

Hormone Dr recommended going back up a bit and splitting 120mg into two doses.

Either way, one thing I've heard and read about provirone is it can have negative affects on ppl with already higher cholesterol, which I kinda have. Depending on who I ask. Lol.

Not in this lab, but in the previous one at my PCP my total cholesterol is around 170

[Cuz]

Hormone Dr recommended going back up a bit and splitting 120mg into two doses.

Either way, one thing I've heard and read about provirone is it can have negative affects on ppl with already higher cholesterol, which I kinda have. Depending on who I ask. Lol.

Not in this lab, but in the previous one at my PCP my total cholesterol is around 170

Its pretty bad on cholesterol but pretty much all aas is. Thats why people that take loads of gear for year after year end up dying with heart problems. Not everyone is effected the same but generally speaking.

[teedoff]

Its pretty bad on cholesterol but pretty much all aas is. Thats why people that take loads of gear for year after year end up dying with heart problems. Not everyone is effected the same but generally speaking.

Ok have proviron and nolvadex in my cart if my bank will ever finalize my bitcoin purchase. Lol

Think I'll run 20mg of nolva a day and see if the lump clears up. Also will add in the proviron to see if I can get my free test up. What dose for the proviron? Or did I miss the suggested amount.

I'll have labs pulled in a few weeks so I can keep check on my cholesterol particularly. As well as free test.

Also, what do you guys think on mk677 tabs? Found them on Mike Arnold and thinking about trying them since who the heck can afford hgh!

[956Vette]

bruh, I'll revert back to ignore as I feel bad for offering unsolicited advice, beg your pardon. worried untreated sleep apnea may be complicating problem solving. first, there's nearly no circumstance in 2022 paying with newly acquired bitcoin for ancillaries will be something you look back fondly on. for someone who has had thorough breast cancer screening for their gyno, how is it your team of medical doctors appear to be gatekeeping a dirt cheap rx such as nolvadex? why on earth would you be focusing on a small detail such as free testosterone? best of luck with your journey, consider stocking up on nolvadex as 20mg/day unlikely to suffice...at least initially.

[teedoff]

bruh, I'll revert back to ignore as I feel bad for offering unsolicited advice, beg your pardon. worried untreated sleep apnea may be complicating problem solving. first, there's nearly no circumstance in 2022 paying with newly acquired bitcoin for ancillaries will be something you look back fondly on. for someone who has had thorough breast cancer screening for their gyno, how is it your team of medical doctors appear to be gatekeeping a dirt cheap rx such as nolvadex? why on earth would you be focusing on a small detail such as free testosterone? best of luck with your journey, consider stocking up on nolvadex as 20mg/day unlikely to suffice...at least initially.

Sorry I'm not following you. You'll revert back to ignore? Not sure what that means.

As far as bitcoin, the source I'm using only takes crypto as a payment option. Maybe that's only for a new customer for now. Either way I have no problem paying this way.

My team of doctors? I just have my primary and the ine i see at the hormone clinic. Mainstream Dr's, or at least mine won't prescribe nolva or adex or primo.

I ordered proviron on advice here to help my trt dose work better and get my free test up. I ordered nolvadex on advice here as well as the dose amount.

So please elaborate on what you mean. I'm trying to research the advice given to me. Perhaps nolva eont work but I wanted to at least try.

[956Vette]

Sorry I'm not following you. You'll revert back to ignore? Not sure what that means.

As far as bitcoin, the source I'm using only takes crypto as a payment option. Maybe that's only for a new customer for now. Either way I have no problem paying this way.

My team of doctors? I just have my primary and the ine i see at the hormone clinic. Mainstream Dr's, or at least mine won't prescribe nolva or adex or primo.

I ordered proviron on advice here to help my trt dose work better and get my free test up. I ordered nolvadex on advice here as well as the dose amount.

So please elaborate on what you mean. I'm trying to research the advice given to me. Perhaps nolva eont work but I wanted to at least try.

My apologies for becoming frustrated, community sincerely cares about your well being. Unsure how valuable our advice is as it feels as though you have resisted and/or been slow to follow through. Was it easy to convince you that 200mg/wk TRT was out of bounds (for a guy with gyno), as is/was 150mg/wk? Did you seriously believe your gynecomastia was a tumor and getting screened for breast cancer was a responsible use of time/energy? At no point have you yet felt comfortable/confident enough to ask bozo doctor or either specialist (one of which is willing to write letro) to do you a solid and scribe a SERM? Were you proactive or resistant to taking arimidex to alleviate your tender enlarging breasts? Do you contend ordering from the underground is the path of least resistance to procure quality anti-estrogens/estrogen blockers? Did we miss when you asked for help sourcing reliable black market ancillaries paid through traditional means? Can understand proviron is difficult and paying with crypto to an AAS dealer might consolidate your purchase...if that's is not the case, fail to realize why bitscoin offers utility. Do you still think that you can use steroids or hormone therapy and somehow sleep apnea will pass? Hope I am not mixing you up with someone else.... To beat a dead horse, in closing, prepare to consume 20mg nolvadex like skittles (initially) in hopes to combat your situation...best of luck!!!

[Cylon357]

Ok have proviron and nolvadex in my cart if my bank will ever finalize my bitcoin purchase. Lol

Think I'll run 20mg of nolva a day and see if the lump clears up. Also will add in the proviron to see if I can get my free test up. What dose for the proviron? Or did I miss the suggested amount.

I'll have labs pulled in a few weeks so I can keep check on my cholesterol particularly. As well as free test.

Also, what do you guys think on mk677 tabs? Found them on Mike Arnold and thinking about trying them since who the heck can afford hgh!

I typically dose proviron at 25mg (12.5 x2) per day. It seemed to do a good job controlling my E2 when I was just on 20% test cream and hcg. I have not found 25mg per day to do anything at all to my cholesterol numbers, in fact, they looked pretty good last time. That is a low dose, though, and I may very well have been blessed with the "good cholesterol gene".

20mg per day nolvadex for the first couple of weeks would be ok, but then you could drop to 10mg per day and probably be fine. It is based on your response, though.

I would hold your dose wherever it was for the blood work you posted, only alteration I would make would be the multiple doses per week instead of fewer as mentioned previously.

Would recommend not adding in another variable (MK677) at this time. If something comes up when you start it and the proviron, then what did what?

[teedoff]

I typically dose proviron at 25mg (12.5 x2) per day. It seemed to do a good job controlling my E2 when I was just on 20% test cream and hcg. I have not found 25mg per day to do anything at all to my cholesterol numbers, in fact, they looked pretty good last time. That is a low dose, though, and I may very well have been blessed with the "good cholesterol gene".

20mg per day nolvadex for the first couple of weeks would be ok, but then you could drop to 10mg per day and probably be fine. It is based on your response, though.

I would hold your dose wherever it was for the blood work you posted, only alteration I would make would be the multiple doses per week instead of fewer as mentioned previously.

Would recommend not adding in another variable (MK677) at this time. If something comes up when you start it and the proviron, then what did what?

Thanks Cylon. Yes was not my intention to add mk at this time and I shouldn't have mixed that question in with this thread. Was just curious as to the effectiveness of the tab form and doseage. I'd thought about it down the line after I get my current issues under control.

Thanks for the help and advice. I don't want anyone thinking I'm here asking questions and then disregarding any advice given. That's not my intention. I take advice and research and make decisions on all available data. Like the good programmer I am. Lol. So not sure why vette thinks I don't listen to you guys. But that's for another post when I have the time to compose.

Anyway, hopefully I can get this stuff ordered and here in the next week. Like mentioned before, my gyno isn't that bad. If I were 8 or 10% bf you'd probably be able to see the lump, but it's probably not even the size of a jellybean.

I've ordered some 1ml syringes as well. The 3mil I have is near impossible to get consistent dosing when trying to do this small amount. At least it is for me. And splitting up 75mg will be even harder. They should be here Wed.

[Cylon357]

I've ordered some 1ml syringes as well. The 3mil I have is near impossible to get consistent dosing when trying to do this small amount. At least it is for me. And splitting up 75mg will be even harder. They should be here Wed.

One half and even one third ml syringes are readily available, some of the one third ml ones have half unit measures. I use the 3/10 ml ones for peptides and hcg, and I am presently using 1/2 unit 27g 1/2" ones to draw my test.

[teedoff]

One half and even one third ml syringes are readily available, some of the one third ml ones have half unit measures. I use the 3/10 ml ones for peptides and hcg, and I am presently using 1/2 unit 27g 1/2" ones to draw my test.

Thanks, I'll keep that in mind.