Simply Put....

[talon]

For those of you who have already read my other posts I am completely natural as of now. I want to start a cycle soon, maybe a 3 weeks to a month from now, when I top my creatine cycle out a 10 weeks. I have $250 to work with, including anti e's, cause I am a poor college student, lol. Going with average prices, cause I know everyone is different, what would be the best cycle to start with? Please give "gear" thats easier to obtain. THANK YOU.

[BDTR]

250 bucks isn't going to go very far bro... When you figure in clomid and nolva etc..

Your best bet is a test only cycle 500mg a week but its gonna be cutting it close.

[50%Natural]

I am a college student too. I wish I could make a cycle out of $250 but it could never happen if you want something good. If I were you I think I would save till you can afford a couple things. You ever look into difference checks? That is how I afford my gear.

[Billmister]

how about you wait and save up some money... depending on your supplier prices vary... some people pay 110 dollars for 100 tabs of dbol in the summer... while others get it for 40 dollars. So what i'm trying to say is it depends on your supplier. Good luck

[talon]

Thanks for the replies guys. 50%Natural...that is some funny stuff...financial aid supplies thousands of students a year with free gifts...lol. Well here goes...If I wanted to get started up, how much would I need with the cheapest most effective cycle, including anti-e's. I know this is a long shot but hey asking never hurts. THANKS.

[Rookiejay]

There's a thread, might help you out

http://anabolicreview.com/vbulletin/...ighlight=spend

[G Child]

Test only cycle will be fine for you.
I would say about 100-150 for 20ml's is about right.
Clomid and Nolva should not run you more than 100 at all for the needed amount.

[talon]

Thanks guys...RookieJay..I have read that thread before, I just search way to much...lol. Oh and G Child...I am new to this so which Test are you talking about, kinda need full name. Thanks. Oh yhea and $250 is an around guestimation I can go up some, just gotta pick up more shifts at the gym...lol.

[G Child]

I don't think ANY testosterone should cost more than 150 for 20ml's, even human grade.

Cheapest stuff you will find will be Vet gear,
there is too much to list

[MBaraso]

If your making good steady gains like it seems your doing then I'd hold off for awhile on the cycle.
Wait till you hit a wall...then think about doing a cycle.
And if you can't wait..Then save your $ till you have enough to do a good cycle like the guys above suggested.

[Iron_body03]

If I was you I would wait until I had a little more money, and try to make a really good first cycle with all anti's required, since your first cycle is I find one of the most important one.

[talon]

Oh guys dont get me wrong Im not going to jump into anything except the best one(cycle) for me. I was just getting a starting suggestion. I am making very good gains as of now, the reason I said a month is cause Im going to top out my cycle of creatine and last year my growth spurt came in the summer putting on almost 28 pounds (150 to 178) and then I didnt gain again in the fall and spring(sorry going by college semesters...lol), and this summer I hit another spurt going from 178 to 192,194ish. My dad hit his last growth spurt the summer when he reached 22, so Im figuring by genetic predispostion that this will be it. So, I figured another month going into the fall I will stop. I will DEFINANTLY, not start the gear until I feel I the bear has climbed on my back and I stopped progressing naturally. But more suggestions would be greatly appreciated, cause this is a very intelligent and thought out choice I am making in my life. Thanks everyone so far for the help.

[slobberknocker]

Depends on what you have access to, but at the very least you should be able to do a test only cycle with that. Maybe throw in some dbol, since it's dirt cheap.

[talon]

Lol, guys when you say TEST, I know it means testosterone, but which one by full name should I consider. Your help has been great, thanks from the newbie.

[Rookiejay]

$250 would get:

2 Nolvas (60 tabs)
1 Clomid (30 tabs)
8 weeks (500mg /w) of test (any) human grade.
if ordered overseas

in the gym
1 Nolva
1 Clomid

@$30 per 250ml vail
2 1/2 weeks supply of test


As they say - $250 could be enough for a cycle
or it may not be enough.......

Keep us posted - let us know how you stretched the $250

[Rookiejay]

Lol, guys when you say TEST, I know it means testosterone, but which one by full name should I consider. Your help has been great, thanks from the newbie.

I use test Enan.

But they're (costwise) all pretty much the same

[slobberknocker]

I use test Enan.

But they're (costwise) all pretty much the same

I usually see human grade suspension, prop, and sust, for a great deal more $$$ than enth or cyp or omna.

[talon]

WOW...the info is great...

[talon]

After reading all of the profiles on test, that I could find and reading about it I came to a somewhat conclusion. I understand it gives you great gains, the price is awesome, and the pump is great. But, everything keeps leading me to the conclusion that you keep little to none of what you obtain while on it. The sides are the usual. Is this true with the gains though? Because in a since it would be a waste if you gained it just to loose it...thanks.

[usualsuspect]

After reading all of the profiles on test, that I could find and reading about it I came to a somewhat conclusion. I understand it gives you great gains, the price is awesome, and the pump is great. But, everything keeps leading me to the conclusion that you keep little to none of what you obtain while on it. The sides are the usual. Is this true with the gains though? Because in a since it would be a waste if you gained it just to loose it...thanks.

Test does build up estrogen levels causing water retention for many of its users. Running an anti-e is highly suggested to combat this problem. Many people prefer femera although liquidex is not far behind.

[talon]

Thanks...but, even if I run anti e's how much of my gains can I really expect to still obtain?...sorry for the guestimation ques.

[tryingtogetbig]

depends on many different variables: diet, routine, rest, cycle, etc. Everybody reacts differently. My first go at it I kept about 10-12 lbs of solidness and lost about 4% bf. If you continue to work out and diet correctly, you should keep many of your gains. You will lose just a little muscle mass, but mainly just water retention. So if you gain 20lbs on the juice and lose 8 - 10 lbs, most of it was water retention anyway. Hope this helps.

peace,

ttgb

[Rookiejay]

Thanks...but, even if I run anti e's how much of my gains can I really expect to still obtain?...sorry for the guestimation ques.

IMO - anti-e's don't affect the lean mass gains (or at least the affect is very modest.)

Without anti-e's you'll gain more like 25lbm and keep 15

with them you'll gain 17 and keep 14. and your chances of getting sides are significantly reduced.

Also, I don't like the bloating feeling.... I started using 20mg nolva and feel much better.

[legend]

save your money and get enough for a good first cycle. and don't waste money on things you don't need....like books or food !!!

[BUYLONGTERM]

And not only will you need money for gear, your FOOD bill will go through the roof!!!! Remember you have to EAT, EAT, EAT.

[talon]

BUYLONGTERM...not a prob. I love to eat. I already sacrafice half of my montly earnings to food...lol And holy shizznet I reached junior member status in 1 day. LOL>

[djsir007]

Hey Talon,
Here you go. I have posted a hundred times about all you need is 250mg/week of enanthate or sus. 10 weeks about $100+/-
Clomid $50 online research companies
Nolvadex $50 online research companies
total $200

As long as your gear is real you will put on about 15+lbs.

[talon]

DJSIR...Thanks for you very helpful input, I will look in to this. But still since Im dealing with TEST wont I lose almost all of what I put on, even with diet, supplementation, and workout regimens right?

[someday]

The key to keeping any gains is staying in the gym after you come off and doing proper post cycle therapy. You will lose some of the weight sure....but it is mostly water like what was stated above. Many people have gained 20-25 pds on a first cycle and kept 15+pounds of it. That is a lot of muscle to put on. Just remember the key is your post cycle therapy and staying with your training.

[talon]

Ok guys after all of your very intellectual comments and very very helpful info, plus weeks, days, and hours of research, I have came to the conclusion of what my first cycle is going to be, but I still need a little info for the Post Cycle Clomid Therapy. Here is the cycle:

Weeks 1-10, 300mg of Test Enan

Clomid Therapy-300/100/50, the norm (Thanks G-Child!)

Nolvadex 20mg through end of PCT (Thanks again G-Child...lol)

PS-Does anyone have a round about guestimation on the cost of this entire cycle?

Diet: (simplified)
250-300grms of protein, through meals(high BV) and shakes
50 to 100grms of carbs, (this depends on energy needs for the day)
20grms of fat
This is all daily except Sun. which will be more of a carb. loading day
Multivitamins throughout, and EAA's esp. glut. for recovery.

Water intake: 1 gallon on lift days, and 90 to 100 ozs on off day (half body weight, norm. calc. for HOH intake)

Workout: Push vs. Pull theory: (simplified)
Monday:Chest,tris
Tues:cardio,legs
Wed:Back,bis
Thurs:cardio,legs
Friday:Shoulders
Sat:mix day
Sun: off, more carb loading then protein.

Cardio is going to follow the FITT formula (frequency, intensity, time, and type.)

Some of this stuff is very simplified. Please give mad comments back on this letting me know what you think and what needs to be tweaked. I also need info on the nolvadex and PCT. Thank you very much. I would also like everyone to know that I do know alot about diet and training, so added info would be great. LOL, I study it every day. Once again THANKS.
P.S. I have no GOAL, persay on how much mass or cut I wanna ad to the pic. just some good gains, plus a test run at this.

[G Child]

Clomid 2 weeks after your last injection should do it. 300/100/50 - 300mg day one, 100mg for 10 days then 50mg for another 10 days is the norm.

If I don't run Arimidex I use 20mg Nolva all the way through Clomid. If you get the 10mg tabs you need 210, if you get 20mg tabs you need 105.

[talon]

G CHILD thanks you for the info on Clomid and Nolvadex. Does anyone also have comments on the cycle, diet, or workout regimen? Comments in all areas would be great as this is a big step for me.

[daWhoady]

I'd say bring your Test Enan down to 250mg/wk for like 10-12 wks, or up to 500 mg/wk for 8-10 (trying to work within your budget). Your vials will probably come in 250mg vials, so that will make it easier then doing 300mg/wk. Just my 2 cents.

[talon]

Yes, was figuring 250mg to 500mg per week, but I still wanted to stay on the lower dosage side so I was estimating 300mg in the beginning. If the test comes in 250mg vials Ill take it that way to make things earsier. Thanks.

[talon]

Anymore suggestions or good to go?

[talon]

Well it looks as if the cycle is changing! Here goes:
12 wk deca 300mg per wk
Nolvidex throughout
HCG, plus PCT

Same diet, plus workout routine as above. Please comment!

[G Child]

GH as in Growth Hormone?

[talon]

No gchild my bad. Its HCG, I was typing extremely fast....LOL...GH would be sick.