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Thread: A theory I cooked up; Semi-Permanent Fat loss?

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  1. #1
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    A theory I cooked up; Semi-Permanent Fat loss?

    I and many other people have noticed that after a DNP-cycle even after months less than 50% of the weightloss is gained back.
    (And that is even with crappy training and diet)
    While common rule in dieting is that the more weight one loses in a
    short time span, the more likely he/she is to gain all that weight back plus even a bit more fat most of the times (the dreaded YOYO-effect!!).

    Also this research confirms that 3 obese people (2 men and a women) after
    long term T3 and DNP supplementation lost a lot of weight and managed
    TO KEEP IT OFF!

    http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...S=PN/4,673,691

    As to so many cases of people not experiencing a drastic rebound with DNP
    (anything that guarantees under 50% of the weightloss gained back is an effective diet-aid in my opinion) it got me thinking as to WHY...

    So a simple theory which I came up with:

    DNP is so dangerous, because it doesn't involve in a feedback system
    (meaning if there is to much present in the blood there is no way the body can combat that).
    Also it is non-hormonal
    (hormonal systems always have a feedback-mechanism).

    This means that it doesn't affect your body's "setpoint"
    (which is what your body thinks is your "healthy" weight and thus always wants to return to that point).

    Some mechanisms in the "setpoint" are still unknown but it mostly has to do with dopamine/adrenaline and the various Neuropeptides
    (especially B, K and Y that all regulate appetite).

    The "setpoint" is best adjusted if weightloss is as gradually as possible
    (phentermine users always get the yo-yo effect meaning all the lost weight
    + some new fat comes back after discontinuance; not only because fat is lost so rapidly but mainly because it affects all those "setpoint" features and after discontinuance they will try to regain homeostasis!).

    DNP has no (significant) role in manipulating the "setpoint"
    (meaning your body will not feel the urge to gain some weight after discontinuance).
    Also it competes with T3, meaning after you stop DNP, T3 will peak
    (instead of like with most diets; will be on low)
    couple that with the fact that it is not catabolic
    (actually a bit anti-catabolic for that matter) so your BMR stays
    rougly the same after the DNP-cycle.

    And the conclusion confirms the reality -->
    Fat loss induced by DNP is not likely to come back for a significant part!

    Note:
    Most people supplement certain compounds with DNP -->
    I for instance take Sibutramine, T2, T3 and an ECY which are
    most likely to be the MAIN cause of the "gained weight afterwards"
    due to the KNOWN disturbance of some processes in the body's metabolism by these ancillaries.

    Let me know if you all agree or see some scientific weaknesses in my story!
    (also who wants to volunteer for a study )

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

  2. #2
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    Interesting observation and theory.Nice post!

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    Interesting observation and theory.Nice post!
    Thanks Friend!
    DNP is non-hormonal; and not included in any feedback system so why would it adjust the "setpoint"?
    Too bad it was "banned" due to inconsiderate irresponsible people, or there would be much more literature available on the subject!
    (same goes for AS)

    Greets
    Kingofmasters
    Last edited by kingofmasters; 07-31-2004 at 05:08 PM.

  4. #4
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    This is a very interesting concept......I have been pondering DNP usage for the end of a cutting cycle for the last few stubborn pounds....


    Good read


    <<LMO>>

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanMeOut
    ...I have been pondering DNP usage for the end of a cutting cycle for the last few stubborn pounds....

    Same here...but a low dose tho.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    Same here...but a low dose tho.


    Yea I have been thinking about doing a longer lower dose cycle..... like 200mg for 14 days or more..... and supplement t3 @ 50mcg after day 8. But I am not sure yet how I am going to do it, but it sounds safer this way.



    <<LMO>>

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    Same here...but a low dose tho.

    Same here. I have done many many cycles of DNP, but I think I could really benefit from it, plus I want to try it with T3 supplementation.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    Thanks Friend!
    DNP is non-hormonal; and not included in any feedback system so why would it adjust the "setpoint"?
    Anything that causes fat loss, whether slow or drastic (doesn't matter if it's diet, exercise, DNP, clen or anything else) will drop leptin.

    There's the hormonal feedback to the setpoint.

    Lyle

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by lylemcd
    Anything that causes fat loss, whether slow or drastic (doesn't matter if it's diet, exercise, DNP, clen or anything else) will drop leptin.

    There's the hormonal feedback to the setpoint.

    Lyle
    How does that exactly work?

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Demon Deacon
    How does that exactly work?
    How does what exactly work?

    Lyle

  11. #11
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    very informative bro, thanx!

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    I feel more educated reading your posts. Glad you came to AR bro.

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    How lathargic do you think a person would be using 200 mgs ED of DNP for 10 days?

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    How lathargic do you think a person would be using 200 mgs ED of DNP for 10 days?


    Yea that's my only concern as well..... I want to be able to function normally while on DNP.....well atleast almost normal. I know your strength / endurance sucks while on, but to what extent is what I want to know. I have to be able to lift / go to work minimum. Activity outside of that is no big deal, I have no problem taking a month off from going out.


    <<LMO>>

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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanMeOut
    Yea that's my only concern as well..... I want to be able to function normally while on DNP.....well atleast almost normal. I know your strength / endurance sucks while on, but to what extent is what I want to know. I have to be able to lift / go to work minimum. Activity outside of that is no big deal, I have no problem taking a month off from going out.


    <<LMO>>
    Strenght goes down, 200 mg will not be too bad.
    But make sure to also take 10 grams of Potassium Gluconate per day
    (costs about 20 dollars per 3 lbs at 1fast400 I think!) to prevent musclepains.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    How lathargic do you think a person would be using 200 mgs ED of DNP for 10 days?
    Not at all (T2, T3 and Ephedra/cafeine combat that)!
    I wasn't tired after 20 days!

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    Not at all (T2, T3 and Ephedra/cafeine combat that)!
    I wasn't tired after 20 days!

    What kind of fat loss did you see after this cycle was over? And which diet theory did you use while on DNP? I have heard a few different opinions on diet while using DNP but can't make up my mind. I heard Moderate Protein, High Carb, Low Fat works well, and I have also heard high protein, moderate carb, low fat. Then some people say the exact opposite.


    <<LMO>>

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanMeOut
    What kind of fat loss did you see after this cycle was over? And which diet theory did you use while on DNP? I have heard a few different opinions on diet while using DNP but can't make up my mind. I heard Moderate Protein, High Carb, Low Fat works well, and I have also heard high protein, moderate carb, low fat. Then some people say the exact opposite.


    <<LMO>>
    A diet while on DNP is nonsense since due to its non-hormonal actions there is no benefit in shifting nutrients.

    Just remember that carbs will get you heated
    (so after carb intake you will start to feel warm for about 10 minutes, but without carbs you will find everything to taste disgusting!)

    the 2 gram per lbs of bodyweight protein rule is also nonsense!
    (you will find out that DNP is not catabolic).

    I lost about 14 lbs of pure fat while gaining 4 lbs of LBM from that exact cycle! Diet was normal as always and plenty of water!

    Also remember that while "on" you will feel fat and bloated and your muscles will be anything but pumped!
    Fun thing is 5-7 days after discontinuance you will see the drastic change in the mirror and on the scale!

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    A diet while on DNP is nonsense since due to its non-hormonal actions there is no benefit in shifting nutrients.

    Just remember that carbs will get you heated
    (so after carb intake you will start to feel warm for about 10 minutes, but without carbs you will find everything to taste disgusting!)

    the 2 gram per lbs of bodyweight protein rule is also nonsense!
    (you will find out that DNP is not catabolic).

    I lost about 14 lbs of pure fat while gaining 4 lbs of LBM from that exact cycle! Diet was normal as always and plenty of water!

    Also remember that while "on" you will feel fat and bloated and your muscles will be anything but pumped!
    Fun thing is 5-7 days after discontinuance you will see the drastic change in the mirror and on the scale!

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

    LOL..... so normal diet - the cardio + DNP will yield the results Good stuff..... I am gona give it a run after I get done cutting naturally for a few more weeks. Wish me luck, I'll keep ya posted.

    Oh yea.... last question. So is it true that starchy carbs rice/potatos/bread make you hotter than sugary carbs?


    <<LMO>>

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    A diet while on DNP is nonsense since due to its non-hormonal actions there is no benefit in shifting nutrients.

    Just remember that carbs will get you heated
    (so after carb intake you will start to feel warm for about 10 minutes, but without carbs you will find everything to taste disgusting!)

    the 2 gram per lbs of bodyweight protein rule is also nonsense!
    (you will find out that DNP is not catabolic).

    I lost about 14 lbs of pure fat while gaining 4 lbs of LBM from that exact cycle! Diet was normal as always and plenty of water!

    Also remember that while "on" you will feel fat and bloated and your muscles will be anything but pumped!
    Fun thing is 5-7 days after discontinuance you will see the drastic change in the mirror and on the scale!

    Greets
    Kingofmasters
    KOM is right, while on my cycle of dnp i felt really bloated and looked even fatter, then 7 days after and the sides was gone and everyone was asking what diet i was on. felt great, im just stocking up for my next cycle im gonna try a few other dose methods as a sort of mini experiment to see what results i get.

  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    Not at all (T2, T3 and Ephedra/cafeine combat that)!
    I wasn't tired after 20 days!
    Ok,because I'll be running it with prop/fina/halo/masteron.That should keep my energy level up.I don't mind sweating(I live in south Florida).I just don't want to be dragging for 10 days or so.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    Ok,because I'll be running it with prop/fina/halo/masteron.That should keep my energy level up.I don't mind sweating(I live in south Florida).I just don't want to be dragging for 10 days or so.
    I think you'd better save DNP for the last days of PCT...
    If your PCT is 25 days and you want to do 10 days of DNP
    then start day 10 (that way the waterweight will have gone to and your muscles will be pumped again by the end of the entire cycle + PCT).

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

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    You mean after all these years I can eat fruit again?..lol..

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Da Bull
    You mean after all these years I can eat fruit again?..lol..
    LMAO

  25. #25
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    So correct me if I am wrong then, but after 20 days @ 200mg the most you will have in your system at any time is 540mg correct? Or is my math off?


    <<LMO>>

  26. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeanMeOut
    So correct me if I am wrong then, but after 20 days @ 200mg the most you will have in your system at any time is 540mg correct? Or is my math off?


    <<LMO>>
    Yes that's about right! (36 hour halflife)
    Greets
    Kingofmasters

  27. #27
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    Thumbs up

    dammit , I though DNP can KILL YOU if you use it?

    I was suggested to stay away of DNP, even when I have 5 years of lifting and gym experience!

    This thread will make me found more information on dnp.

    Thanks,
    Mr. Juice

  28. #28
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    Talking

    DAMMM DNP...RAISES YOUR TEMPERATURE TO 50%?!?!?!

    Thats incredible! I though it was just 20%!

    Damm I defenetly need a source for it!

    Mr. Juice

  29. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr Juice
    DAMMM DNP...RAISES YOUR TEMPERATURE TO 50%?!?!?!

    Thats incredible! I though it was just 20%!

    Damm I defenetly need a source for it!

    Mr. Juice
    1. Dont ask for sources
    2. You sound like you dont know what you're getting yourself into. Leave this thread and go research. See you in 3 months.

  30. #30
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    nice theory king, makes sense since the DNP is non-hormonal, makes me want to research somemore into the subject myself! good post

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Z-Ro
    nice theory king, makes sense since the DNP is non-hormonal, makes me want to research somemore into the subject myself! good post
    Thanks a lot bro!

  32. #32
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    Let me see if I am understanding this correctly.

    21 Day PCT (Clo/Nolv/Ldex)
    30day low dose DNP @ 200mg
    Ephedra, Cafeine, Yohimbine, S. Guggelsterones @ 25/200/5/40 mg
    1500mg Vitamin C
    600mg Vitamin E
    1200 mcg T2
    45mcg T3

    All of this during PCT? I will gladly be the guinea pig for your theory as I am planning to use DNP soon and will be jumping on PCT in a short time. Give me a bit more coaching and instructions and I am glad to hook it up.

  33. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne
    Let me see if I am understanding this correctly.

    21 Day PCT (Clo/Nolv/Ldex)
    30day low dose DNP @ 200mg
    Ephedra, Cafeine, Yohimbine, S. Guggelsterones @ 25/200/5/40 mg
    1500mg Vitamin C
    600mg Vitamin E
    1200 mcg T2
    45mcg T3

    All of this during PCT? I will gladly be the guinea pig for your theory as I am planning to use DNP soon and will be jumping on PCT in a short time. Give me a bit more coaching and instructions and I am glad to hook it up.
    and i just got my dnp... and had planned on running it only at 200mg for 14 days... but could go longer depending on the lethargy experienced.. i am on cycle right now.... at week 12... going 10 more........
    The answer to your every question

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  34. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne
    Let me see if I am understanding this correctly.

    21 Day PCT (Clo/Nolv/Ldex)
    30day low dose DNP @ 200mg
    Ephedra, Cafeine, Yohimbine, S. Guggelsterones @ 25/200/5/40 mg
    1500mg Vitamin C
    600mg Vitamin E
    1200 mcg T2
    45mcg T3

    All of this during PCT? I will gladly be the guinea pig for your theory as I am planning to use DNP soon and will be jumping on PCT in a short time. Give me a bit more coaching and instructions and I am glad to hook it up.
    if you are using 21 days PCT why not do 21 days DNP along with it?
    The t2 and T3 should be split up as much as possible for optimum effects
    (so 3 times a day would be the minimum)
    540 mg if it is PURE Vitamin E (1200 IU) but if you are using for instance Water-soluble Vitamin E you should double the dosage
    (since WS Vitamin E only yields 50% Vitamin E per gram).

  35. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    if you are using 21 days PCT why not do 21 days DNP along with it?
    The T2 and T3 should be split up as much as possible for optimum effects
    (so 3 times a day would be the minimum)
    540 mg if it is PURE Vitamin E (1200 IU) but if you are using for instance Water-soluble Vitamin E you should double the dosage
    (since WS Vitamin E only yields 50% Vitamin E per gram).
    Who carries T2? I know biotest used to make T2 but I thought they quit making it. I am 100% serious that I will go with this combo the first week of Sept and update the board through a Member results page. I may contact you through PM's to work out a few details but I am definetly down for this.

  36. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheChosenOne
    Who carries T2? I know biotest used to make T2 but I thought they quit making it. I am 100% serious that I will go with this combo the first week of Sept and update the board through a Member results page. I may contact you through PM's to work out a few details but I am definetly down for this.
    Team LR makes it --> They also have researches on their site about it's characteristics (not catabolic, less suppresive on TSH so thyroid than T3 etc)

    Also a tip: DNP will provide a hideous sent of it under your Armpits due to the sweating (especially in the last few days) so always wash under your armpits a couple of times a day and put plenty deodorant under it even before bed
    (I swear the scent will annoy you in bed).
    Also: DNP leaves a foul and dry taste in your mouth all day long; I found out that drinking Diet Softdrinks helps against it (normal softdrinks contain sugar: best bets Fanta, Fanta Pomelo, Fanta Cassis, Fanta Lemon, Coca Cola Lemon, Sprite etc. ALL LIGHT!).
    I finish about 2 bottles a day (drinking water all day also gets tiresome!).

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

    P.S. Team LR probably uses ethanol (Nail polish remover) as a dissolver so the stuff tastes like crap, right before taking it, put it in a Empty cap (the cap will dissolve within 2 minutes of coming in contact with a liquid so take it just before!)
    Last edited by kingofmasters; 07-31-2004 at 05:59 PM. Reason: Forgot to mention something!

  37. #37
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    Okay due to the confusion of all the posts there is some misunderstanding from my side thus I wrote some false info:

    Correction and summarized:

    Quote Originally Posted by kingofmasters
    Still using DNP while PCT has two sides --> Just realized this!

    If you are using it for anti-catabolism
    do PCT @ 100 mg DNP without any T2 or T3

    If you are using it for fatloss during PCT
    (like for instance when coming off bulking)
    do the described 20 day cycle
    (PCT usually is 25-30 days but that is too much for a novice DNP user)

    Best thing though is to use DNP as a cycle of its own!
    (So not during PCT!)

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

  38. #38
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    very awesome read KOM. my head hurts cause i just learned soo much new **** jsut reading what you, bull, and LMO wrote. it also opened me up to trying a low dose cycle. ive always been afriad but after reading what u wrote i think im gonna give it a try. jsut have to decided when.

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    Quote Originally Posted by w_rballs
    very awesome read KOM. my head hurts cause i just learned soo much new **** jsut reading what you, bull, and LMO wrote. it also opened me up to trying a low dose cycle. ive always been afriad but after reading what u wrote i think im gonna give it a try. jsut have to decided when.
    Good for you bro!
    Why suffer the traditional 7-10 days @ 400 mg-600 mg
    when 20 days at 200 mg is far easier and yields the same if not more results.

  40. #40
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    Still using DNP while PCT has two sides --> Just realized this!

    If you are using it for anti-catabolism
    do PCT @ 100 mg DNP without any T2 or T3

    If you are using it for fatloss during PCT (like for instance when coming off bulking)
    do the described 20 day cycle
    (PCT usually is 25-30 days but that is too much for a novice DNP user)

    Best thing though is to use DNP as a cycle of its own!
    (So not during PCT!)

    Greets
    Kingofmasters

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