Do your shins bleed while deadlifting

[stunner5000pt]

I know some of you drag the bar along your shins, and some of you dont

what are your opinions for and against that practice?

[Hackamaniac]

Never happened to myself..

[Superhuman]

i think that if you use proper form and go nice and slow (bbing style) then you should never scrape your shins. If you try to go heavier than you can handle then you probably are

[Superhuman]

occasionally i'll get really bad bruises but no blood

[THE_DOME]

i dont but then again i never go abouve 400

[SVTMuscle*]

i'm a bleeder!

[Doc.Sust]

if you arent keeping the bar as close to your shins as possible, you are doing the lift wrong.throw a little baby powdr on your legs before you do the lift and it cuts down on friction. or(and i dont like this because i think it adds more friction, so i dont do this)where high socks or throw a strip of duct tape on your shins

[*Narkissos*]

if you arent keeping the bar as close to your shins as possible, you are doing the lift wrong.

Wrong for absolute strength.. or wrong for hypertrophy?

I know you and i are in different fields...that's why i asked

Personally for me.. even when pulling over 500 lbs for reps the bar never touches my shins. It's close.. yes, but it never touches.

[needmorestrength]

Wrong for absolute strength.. or wrong for hypertrophy?

I know you and i are in different fields...that's why i asked

Personally for me.. even when pulling over 500 lbs for reps the bar never touches my shins. It's close.. yes, but it never touches.

I think theres a lot of differing theories out there. I was taught to touch

[stunner5000pt]

Wrong for absolute strength.. or wrong for hypertrophy?

I know you and i are in different fields...that's why i asked

Personally for me.. even when pulling over 500 lbs for reps the bar never touches my shins. It's close.. yes, but it never touches.

yes i would like to see further discussion on this...

whats the diff

whats the diff between a 'bodybuilder' deadlift and a 'powerlifter' deadlift

[*Narkissos*]

yes i would like to see further discussion on this...

whats the diff

whats the diff between a 'bodybuilder' deadlift and a 'powerlifter' deadlift

focus maybe?

powerlifting deadlift: hip dominant.. focus on absolute strength development?

bodybuilding deadlift: focus on specific overload?

e.g. My deadlift.. tho relatively heavy, once reviewed isn't standard.

It's more akin to a stiff-leg deadlift. I use it to overload hams namely. My focus is on ham development. I don't drop my glutes. I use a bent-knee position...locking myself into that position: very little knee flexion tru-out. The negative is definately stiff-legged. The positive iniated by an explosive ham contraction..followed by glute contraction...ended by erector/trap contractions. Quad contraction is static... as opposed to dynamic like the standard deadlift would be.

Tonight i pulled 545 lbs for 2.

Nark

[zodiac666]

Tonight i pulled 545 lbs for 2. Nark

awesome weight for a bodybuilder

[stunner5000pt]

focus maybe?

powerlifting deadlift: hip dominant.. focus on absolute strength development?

bodybuilding deadlift: focus on specific overload?

e.g. My deadlift.. tho relatively heavy, once reviewed isn't standard.

It's more akin to a stiff-leg deadlift. I use it to overload hams namely. My focus is on ham development. I don't drop my glutes. I use a bent-knee position...locking myself into that position: very little knee flexion tru-out. The negative is definately stiff-legged. The positive iniated by an explosive ham contraction..followed by glute contraction...ended by erector/trap contractions. Quad contraction is static... as opposed to dynamic like the standard deadlift would be.

Tonight i pulled 545 lbs for 2.

Nark

couldnt we just get ham development from stiff leg deadlifts exclusively??

although i have tried the way DLing the you say and it feels different

[chest6]

Tonight i pulled 545 lbs for 2.

Nark

ahh..uve caught me..time to speed up..

Wrong for absolute strength.. or wrong for hypertrophy?

I know you and i are in different fields...that's why i asked

Personally for me.. even when pulling over 500 lbs for reps the bar never touches my shins. It's close.. yes, but it never touches.

I think I should just have "ditto" copy and pasted to reply to your posts


so..
Ditto..

[Doc.Sust]

Wrong for absolute strength.. or wrong for hypertrophy?

I know you and i are in different fields...that's why i asked

Personally for me.. even when pulling over 500 lbs for reps the bar never touches my shins. It's close.. yes, but it never touches.

wrong for both IMO, here ,lets read a study i have that compares boh sumo and conventional stances(conventional is the form that you use, sumo is the one i use. carlos, i am wiling to bet the you are also a conventional deadlifter, most BBers stick to this form)



Well what's it going to be a conventional stance or a sumo stance? Is there a difference? Here are some interesting studies done on the deadlift. Cholewicki et al. (1991) reported in a recent study comparing the sumo and conventional styles that there were no significant differences in compressive disc forces at the L4 or L5 vertebrae. However the conventional deadlift showed significantly more movement and load shear forces in the L4/L5 that the sumo. So as we all pretty much are already aware, the sumo deadlift takes much of the strain and movement from the low back. To further back this statement, Horn (1988) found through an EMG study that the erectors were twice as active in the conventional stance as the sumo.

There are many anecdotal reports as well that claim the sumo deadlift is much more technical and requires more skill. Many also say this technique is more biomechanically sound and more efficient because the bar does not have to travel as far. How true are these anecdotal reports?

To investigate some of these claims McGuinan and Wilson (1996) recently did some extensive biomechanical analysis of the sumo and conventional style deadlift. The following is a summary of what they found:

The liftoff

The sumo has a trunk angle that is significantly closer to vertical that conventional lifters. Sumo lifters were also found to have much larger hip and knee angles at the start of the lift. This style shifts the bulk of the load on the hips and knees. While the conventional lifter with a more stooped-over trunk position at liftoff utilizes more low back muscles to get the weight moving off the floor.

The distance the bar must travel

As reported in other studies, this study also found that the average total distance the bar must travel to complete the lift was reduced by 19%. As we all know work is defined by taking the amount of force or weight and multiplying it by the distance the bar must travel. So by reducing the distance by 19%, the sumo lifter has automatically reduced the amount of work necessary to lift a given amount of weight.

Bar path

Grabiner and Garhammer (1989) noted that the most of the most important factors to be considered in lifting weights is to keep the weight as close to the body as possible. This reduces the lever arm distance, thus significantly reducing the resistive torque. Cholewicki et al. (1991) found that using the sumo stance not only kept the bar closer to the body than the conventional stance but it also reduced the lever arm distance by shortening the movement of the lumbar. McGuinan and Wilson (1996) similarily found that the sumo lift kept the bar path significantly closer to the body that of the conventional stance.

so as a sumo lifter, i am going to naturaly keep the bar closer than a conventional deadlifter, so i will get more cut up BUT the objective is the same for both, you want to keep the bar as close as possible to get the best bio mechaincal advantage using the bodies natural levers most efficently

Lift time

Power is defined as total work divided by time. So the actual amount of power it takes to lift the weight is highly dependent on the amount of time it takes to lift the weight. However, McGuinan and Wilson (1996) determined that both the sumo and conventional stance required an average of 2.0 seconds to complete. Thus, there is no difference in the amount of power produced by either lift.

Sticking points

It was found half of the sumo lifters had a sticking point somewhere in the second half of the lift where only 15% of the conventional style lifters got stuck here. However, there seemed to be no exact point in common between the lifters. McLaughlin et al. (1977) claims that these sticking points are actually caused at the point where the most effective muscles in the deadlift are in a disadvantaged position. Because we are all built slightly different, this point could vary from lifter to lifter. This exact position can be determined with a Peak motion analysis. Horn (1988) determined that a kinetic analysis using an EMG study of the ankle, hip, and low back in conjunction with strength testing could also accurately determine which muscle group would limit performance during the deadlift. Then proper assistance work could be used to lessen these sticking points.

The available literature does seem to indicate that there were several biomechanical advantages in using the sumo over the conventional style of deadlift.

1. Greater range of knee extension at the bottom of the lift.

2. A more upright posture.

3. The distance the weight must be moved is greatly reduced.

4. The bar path is kept closer to the body, thus making the levers more efficient.

[peteroy01]

i found out quick(after 3times lol) to wear loose workout pants. they slide up with the weight, so ur like steve erkel in the up position.

[helium3]

never scrape shins period.

[Carlos_E]

It never touches me either.

[godkilla]

my shins look like hamburger

[doctadank]

its not my shins, but right above my kneecaps is where the bar hits sometimes and causes them to bleed. ****ing painful shit

[collar]

it never touches my shins, proper form i dont see why they should touch

[Carlos_E]

umm... wear nylon pants

[Haro3]

they definately touch me...but im 6' but then again my old training partner was like 5'7 and his didnt touch at all....so i dont know if its a height issue or what

[DSM4Life]

I am 5'7 and i touch. I was always taught to keep the bar as close as possible. The last thing i am worried about when pulling that heavy @$$ weight up is if my shins are going to get bo bo's .

[Tein]

they definately touch me...but im 6' but then again my old training partner was like 5'7 and his didnt touch at all....so i dont know if its a height issue or what

I'm 6'2 and have some long ass legs, I find them hard to do without scraping my shins at least a little unless stiff legged.

[Schmidty]

I only do reps so i use really good form because i have heard of people ****in ther back up not usin perfect form

[*Narkissos*]

^^that has nothing to do with reps

That has to do with them using bad form.

I'm sure Doc Sust would agree that injury is more likely with higher rep deads than low..because form loosens as the set progresses..and fatigue sets in.

[stunner5000pt]

^^that has nothing to do with reps

That has to do with them using bad form.

I'm sure Doc Sust would agree that injury is more likely with higher rep deads than low..because form loosens as the set progresses..and fatigue sets in.

ill do reps for the warm up sets and those weeks where i have to do maybe 60% of my max

otherwise its singles or doubles maybe triples

[Doc.Sust]

^^that has nothing to do with reps

That has to do with them using bad form.

I'm sure Doc Sust would agree that injury is more likely with higher rep deads than low..because form loosens as the set progresses..and fatigue sets in.

totaly agree,never more than 5-6reps

[C_Bino]

totaly agree,never more than 5-6reps

And I thought we were friends. WTF man you knew I was doing deads last night and you never warned me ahead of time. I went and hit 7 reps on one set you nasty SOB.

Now Im f*cked...all thanks to you.

[Doc.Sust]

And I thought we were friends. WTF man you knew I was doing deads last night and you never warned me ahead of time. I went and hit 7 reps on one set you nasty SOB.

Now Im f*cked...all thanks to you.

hey sometimes i break the rule, but ONLY in a situation like this, lets say i amgoing to pull 500lb for five, and all five reps feel light as air, i may consider pulling another 2 or 3 reps, ONLY if it is my final set of the night and ONLY if i feel my form isnt being compromised,and i am still pulling quickly off the floor. as soon as the bar speed starts to get slower, and i dont feel that i am in the"groove" i stop. this happens once in a blue moon

[stunner5000pt]

where are all the biomechanics experts ???

are there any on this forum anyway??

[kloter1]

never happend

[UpstateTank]

i get bruiiiiiises

[C_Bino]

Never have I touched my legs while doing deadlifts.

[*Narkissos*]

awesome weight for a bodybuilder

Thanks...Honestly i train cus i love it. Functional strength is a big part of it for me. I don't think any of my thoughts on training actually fall into the category of mainstream bodybuilding..so i seldom discuss 'em.

My maintenance weight used to be 500 lbs. (that'd be the lowest i'd pull on any workset even while cutting). But i did a short DNP run and that affected all my lifts. Months later i'm still trying to regain what would've been my maintenance strength (i.e. the lightest i'd go for a workset at any point in time). It's been a struggle. That shit is poison.

couldnt we just get ham development from stiff leg deadlifts exclusively??

Yes and no. I don't really see people pushing themselves on SLDLs cus most see it as a complimentary stretching movement... leg-curls being the basis of the leg-routine. They see it as an isolatary exercise... while technically it isn't. Yes it more ham-dominant than Standard DLs.. but it is still a multi-joint exercise. So yea you can get great hams if you revise the perception of the exercise...and put more effort into it.

I think however the potential for overload is greater with a modified DL.. A hybrid... Like what i use. Think about it. Slight Bent knee drive on the positive...Locked position on the negative.. means you'll be able to drive more weight off the ground on the positive..and it'll be more taxing on the negative...

Nark

[novastepp]

Thanks...Honestly i train cus i love it. Functional strength is a big part of it for me. I don't think any of my thoughts on training actually fall into the category of mainstream bodybuilding..so i seldom discuss 'em.

My maintenance weight used to be 500 lbs. (that'd be the lowest i'd pull on any workset even while cutting). But i did a short DNP run and that affected all my lifts. Months later i'm still trying to regain what would've been my maintenance strength (i.e. the lightest i'd go for a workset at any point in time). It's been a struggle. That shit is poison.



Yes and no. I don't really see people pushing themselves on SLDLs cus most see it as a complimentary stretching movement... leg-curls being the basis of the leg-routine. They see it as an isolatary exercise... while technically it isn't. Yes it more ham-dominant than Standard DLs.. but it is still a multi-joint exercise. So yea you can get great hams if you revise the perception of the exercise...and put more effort into it.

I think however the potential for overload is greater with a modified DL.. A hybrid... Like what i use. Think about it. Slight Bent knee drive on the positive...Locked position on the negative.. means you'll be able to drive more weight off the ground on the positive..and it'll be more taxing on the negative...

Nark

awesome explanation on the modified DL there at the end Nark, thanks.

[*Narkissos*]

np

I think in reviewing the thread that common factor with regard to scraping or not may be height

I think generally the guys under 5'10" are less likely to scrape shins

Bumping this for Doc.

Doc?

[fLgAtOr]

np

I think in reviewing the thread that common factor with regard to scraping or not may be height

I think generally the guys under 5'10" are less likely to scrape shins

Bumping this for Doc.

Doc?

Tahts what I was going to ask...I'm 6'2" and always scrape.

My old WO partner had a PL background and always did sumo style...he said becuase of his height (6'3").

[Doc.Sust]

np

I think in reviewing the thread that common factor with regard to scraping or not may be height

I think generally the guys under 5'10" are less likely to scrape shins

Bumping this for Doc.

Doc?

it poses some factor along with some of the other natural biomechanical difference from person to person(examples, arm length, trunk length, height of the hips, leg length,circumference of the waste etc etc etc.,)but i think it also depends on what form you are using(conv, sumo) and your technique as well. i am at about 5'10 and i scrape the HELL out of my legs. also i have another friend who is shorter than me (5'7) and he bleeds all the time as well. we both pull sumo. now my friend used to pull conventional, and he barely ever would bleed. so again, this is why i think it depends more on form and tech. more than anything. BUT the one thing i certainly stand by, no matter what form you use, you want to keep the bar as close as possible to you to put the minimal ammt of stress on your lower back and to use the natural levers of your body to their best advantage