New Member
I have been on depo-test for about 3 months now. 200mg eow. I am eventually going to switch docs because he won't let me do self injections. I would like to be on 100mg/week. anyway, I have noticed some testicle atropy - more than I like. My question is if you can use something like HCG when on test for the rest of your life. Will the doc prescribe it? Does it do any harm or good to me??
Thanks!
New Member
The latest protocol for HRT suggests that one should have weekly shots of Test and supplement with 250 iu’s of HCG on the 5th and 6th day before your weekly injection. I have been on this protocol for about 2.5 years and it works great. I feel better and my testes are now back to full size.
New Member
test on every sunday, hcg on every monday and tuesday ?
Anabolic Member
Great post.
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:04 PM.
Associate Member
as stated above from swale's recipe for TRT:-
those on test cyp using weekly injections use 250iu of hcg/day for the 2 days prior to next test shot.
some also use 100iu of hcg per day every day alongside an appropriate amount of testosterone to reach desired levels(adding hcg this way may require tweeking testosterone(gel/inj dose)
.
some even go to the extreme of splitting the test into every third day(or even to every day to stabilise levels even more,the split dose is still equal to the original weekly dose only split appropriately).
if you are diagnosed hypogonadal you need this treatment the rest of your life if you want to feel right.
cycling TRT is a NO-NO as is using test only then coming of and using hcg cycle to recover testicular atrophy,from swale's experience he knows people do better on a protocol using both hcg and testosterone for optimal health.
read this carefully , when you've finished read it again:-
http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=145953
i hope this helps.
Last edited by toc67guru; 03-06-2006 at 11:50 AM.
New Member
I'm going to read the post tonight. One question, does HCG have any adverse affect of the testosterone therapy? Does it provide benefits that test therapy cannot provide alone or does it just help with testicle growth? Thanks.
Associate Member
from swale's RECIPE:-
I add in 250-500IU of HCG, on day five, and day six of the week, for those who use the IM injection. In other words, the two days prior to their shot. For those using a transdermal delivery system, every third day. For the IM patients, this compensates for the drop off in serum androgen levels by the half-life of the test cyp. But the main reason is to stave off atrophy of the testicles, by directly stimulating them with the LH analog.
Patients all report they feel dramatically better once the HCG regimen is initiated (and they were properly tuned up on testosterone before they started it). HCG, as a LH analog, increases the activity of the P450 SCC enzyme, which converts CHOL to pregnenolone. Thus all three hormonal pathways are stimulated in patients who may be either entirely, or very nearly, HPTA suppressed. It is my belief this may be a factor in the heightened sense of well-being my patients report throughout the week—far in excess of what a minimal dose of HCG would produce by virtue of induced testosterone production.
patients feel a sense of "well being" that testosterone itself does not give on its own swale feel's the best regime is a combination of both hcg and testosterone.
testosterone itself has benefits that hcg alone cannot give so therefore the combination.
Many TRT practitioners add in HCG for a short course every few months, to re-stimulate the testes. My opinion is that it is far better to keep them up to form and function all along the way. The physicians who intermittently use HCG also use it as a “break” in TRT, much the same way hormonally-supplemented athletes manage the typical anabolic steroid cycle. TRT should not be “cycled”. Once I get my patients properly tuned up, I want them to stay that way. They also erroneously believe this allows the HPTA to recover, when it clearly does not. The HCG-induced testosterone production is every bit as suppressive of the HPTA as the TRT, and the supplemented testosterone is still at suppressive serum levels during that time, anyway."
Last edited by toc67guru; 03-06-2006 at 04:25 PM.
New Member
Thanks for the info! I am going to a new doc next week because I have new insurance and my current doc doesn't accept them. I'll try to tell the new doc about this info - Also, I'm hoping that he'll let me inject myself weekly instead of eow...my current doc has me go to his office for the injections and won't let me do them myself.....it's kind of a pain. Anyway, I hope that he's understanding and he'll work with me. Wish me luck!
Last edited by SHANEDOGG; 03-06-2006 at 05:01 PM. Reason: messed up...
Associate Member
i recommend you take a copy of swale's RECIPE FOR TRT with you on the visit.
he is then able to read it for himself as it is self explanitary.
feel free to pm me if i can be of any help.
Junior Member
Too true!!! I know exactly what you are talking about! I have a doc that is the same way and I always request that the nurse or nurse practitioner come in after and talk the truth! Sometimes I just request seeing them instead of seeing the regular doctor at all!Originally Posted by Ufa
Associate Member
Not true at all, every other week injections don't work at all, you are screwing up your test levels because they rise and then fall, you will want to take 500 units of hcg on sat/sun and take atleast 100mg a week 200 would be better, and their is no adverse side effects of taking hcg with test
Junior Member
JR SHRED...
why are you quoting me and saying what you said...I am talking about doctor's that could be better...I already know all that stuff you are saying and am doing just what you said...
Member
dude I have never had a problem with my testicles and I have been on for almost 3 years now. I don't get this HCG stuff. I was never recommend it. My old urologist frown when he was given this info 2 and half yrs ago. Me I have had a testicle removed so, I can't say I'm like the rest of you. But my Urologist said that stuff " is the bb steriod stuff" which it doesn't even matter if you are going to be on for life. He also said there was something else but I can't rember what something that is used to make a horse go into labor or something.
I' dont' know but I'm going to see a new endo this month and I 'm going to ask about this HCG stuff again.
Member
oH and btw I only remeber my balls shrinking up when I had torsion, but then again that was an optical illusion cause one was swollen. But to this day my one ball looks full and healthy.
I also don't really stare at my balls
so honestly I couldnt' tell you I noticed any diffrence except when I had surgery. As long as my stuff didn't get shorter or skinnier and could get hard, I could care less about my balls.
Last edited by kaorialfred; 03-07-2006 at 08:24 PM.
Associate Member
This is a confusing issue, let us know what your new endo says.
New Member
you would care if you did notice shrinkage - like George from Seinfield...I was in the pool!!! That wasn't the "real" me!
Anyway, I have an appt. next week w/ a new doc and I'll ask the question. It almost seems like some places offer it as standard protocol. I'm just a little concerned because they definately shrunk in 3 months!!
Member
SG that's where a lot of times on these boards we tend to think one solution or method works for everyone, that's why I tend to side with the individual more than the group effect. I was on 3cc of test for more than 8 weeks and that was every week injections but my blood work was in the 450 range or at 5 even. I think each person is diffrent and one protocol doesn't fit all. That's why I kinda worry about HRT clinics and they way they do business.
New Member
Wow! I am on 200mg/eow and my last blood test 8 days after my injection, I was in the 750 range.....I can live w/ that. before test I was 215. one problem is that i'm packing on the pounds I've gained about 10lbs in about 3 months. I am hungry all the time since getting on test. I do cardio and lift, but I've been injured the last 1-1/2 months so I haven't been hitting the weights much. Anyone else experiencing this type of weight gain. I have definately gained muscle, but I'm concered about my gut - I want to lose it! Any suggestions?
Member
yup I'm going to see an endocrinologist here next week. I just got thru running 1gram of test for about 4 months and was taking in 4000 cal and working out intensely with limited cardio, and I didn't go up in weight at all or go down. I started at 266 and was 272/271/270/ now after a month of laying off injections just to see what I had and lost I'm 254 as of this morning. I retain a lot of water. Very disapointed with what was going on. I also was not using my HGH 2 iu a day till the last month. Didn't make a diffrence. I just think some people are genecticly coded diffrently then others.
I mean I have looked at my diet routine and training and I'm sure it was just wrong chemicals or my bod used up what it was being given and didn't retain any gains or size. I don't know I will hopefully find out something next week.
New Member
My doc gave me something for retaining water because I noticed some retention in my face especially. I took it a couple times, but really don't think I'm retaining too much - if i do, i'll get on it again....check it out - i can get you the name of it if you want.
Anabolic Member
It's all good!
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:04 PM.
New Member
You don't quit or layoff HRT - I take testosterone because I have low levels of test. you don't cycle it because your on it for life - not because I'm on a "cycle" or "bulking up"....I don't produce enough test for a normal functioning life - Period! All I was asking if HCG not HGH works while taking it - as in my research, it appears that it does. In fact, it's standard protocol in some HRT regimens.
Anabolic Member
Best advice I've gotten.
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:09 PM.
Member
This endo says that its a drug that " helps with testicle size and is used for males who testicles have not descended, but its gained a lot of popularity for people who abuse test, and have hormone issues. It is a fertility class drug but it can be used for other things. Not that I would recommend it."
So that's what he said. We also argued over armour thyroid vs. synthroid and that was a fun issue.
So yeah hey it works, but hey he doesn't feel comfortable prescribing it.
Member
but on the other side of coin I didn't ask him but I wondered, now what if your balls are just looking small and you order this stuff off line or where ever do you think it would make your balls bigger?
You would be pumping this stuff in you, and your balls would inflate like a ballon? I don't know its just a wierd drug. IMOP
Anabolic Member
Thanks for the nice comment!
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:08 PM.
Associate Member
This UFA character needs to be banned, his advice is not only ridiculous, but he tries to discredit anyone with any knowlege in the feild of HRT (take a look at the SWALE's best thoughts on TRT thread).
BTW, according to UFA, if you use Hcg your LEWDIG CELLS will desensitize, LOL!
its LEYDIG CELLS you uneducated moron, and you have no idea wtf your talking about!
Anabolic Member
Best ever. Thanks!.
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:08 PM.
Member
Intresting, I am going to have ot side with AB on the one.
Ufa you really need to watch yourself and try and behave more. We appreciate the input but the attitude we can do without.
Anabolic Member
No pain no gain..
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:07 PM.
Member
What I'm saying you are validating. Why such an attitude, and you are calling me a homo/ or "Are you an Bruce an item?" which is = you too romantically involved?
Look here MR. UFA, I appreciate you input on this board but I don't appreciate you putting down people, and just being arrogant towards other. You are being disrespectful. That is all I'm saying on the matter.
Anabolic Member
Thanks for asking?
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:06 PM.
Anabolic Member
Excellent posts tonight!
Last edited by Ufa; 04-02-2006 at 11:05 PM.
New Member
Shred do you have a bowl problem,why have you got a dyper on in your photo,sorry i just thought you might want to talk about it.
Anabolic Member
You got it.
There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)
Posting Permissions
Reply With Quote