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Thread: Illegal Diplomacy: Did Nancy Pelosi commit a felony when she went to Syria?

  1. #1
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    Illegal Diplomacy: Did Nancy Pelosi commit a felony when she went to Syria?

    Illegal Diplomacy: Did Nancy Pelosi commit a felony when she went to Syria?
    http://opinionjournal.com/extra/?id=110009908
    Wall Street Journal
    Friday, April 6, 2007

    House Speaker Nancy Pelosi may well have committed a felony in traveling to Damascus this week, against the wishes of the president, to communicate on foreign-policy issues with Syrian President Bashar Assad. The administration isn't going to want to touch this political hot potato, nor should it become a partisan issue. Maybe special counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, whose aggressive prosecution of Lewis Libby establishes his independence from White House influence, should be called back.

    The Logan Act makes it a felony and provides for a prison sentence of up to three years for any American, "without authority of the United States," to communicate with a foreign government in an effort to influence that government's behavior on any "disputes or controversies with the United States." Some background on this statute helps to understand why Ms. Pelosi may be in serious trouble.

    President John Adams requested the statute after a Pennsylvania pacifist named George Logan traveled to France in 1798 to assure the French government that the American people favored peace in the undeclared "Quasi War" being fought on the high seas between the two countries. In proposing the law, Rep. Roger Griswold of Connecticut explained that the object was, as recorded in the Annals of Congress, "to punish a crime which goes to the destruction of the executive power of the government. He meant that description of crime which arises from an interference of individual citizens in the negotiations of our executive with foreign governments."

    The debate on this bill ran nearly 150 pages in the Annals. On Jan. 16, 1799, Rep. Isaac Parker of Massachusetts explained, "the people of the United States have given to the executive department the power to negotiate with foreign governments, and to carry on all foreign relations, and that it is therefore an usurpation of that power for an individual to undertake to correspond with any foreign power on any dispute between the two governments, or for any state government, or any other department of the general government, to do it."

    Griswold and Parker were Federalists who believed in strong executive power. But consider this statement by Albert Gallatin, the future Secretary of the Treasury under President Thomas Jefferson, who was wary of centralized government: "it would be extremely improper for a member of this House to enter into any correspondence with the French Republic . . . As we are not at war with France, an offence of this kind would not be high treason, yet it would be as criminal an act, as if we were at war." Indeed, the offense is greater when the usurpation of the president's constitutional authority is done by a member of the legislature--all the more so by a Speaker of the House--because it violates not just statutory law but constitutes a usurpation of the powers of a separate branch and a breach of the oath of office Ms. Pelosi took to support the Constitution.

    The Supreme Court has spoken clearly on this aspect of the separation of powers. In Marbury v. Madison, Chief Justice John Marshall used the president's authority over the Department of State as an illustration of those "important political powers" that, "being entrusted to the executive, the decision of the executive is conclusive." And in the landmark 1936 Curtiss-Wright case, the Supreme Court reaffirmed: "Into the field of negotiation the Senate cannot intrude, and Congress itself is powerless to invade it."
    Ms. Pelosi and her Congressional entourage spoke to President Assad on various issues, among other things saying, "We came in friendship, hope, and determined that the road to Damascus is a road to peace." She is certainly not the first member of Congress--of either party--to engage in this sort of behavior, but her position as a national leader, the wartime circumstances, the opposition to the trip from the White House, and the character of the regime she has chosen to approach make her behavior particularly inappropriate.

    Of course, not all congressional travel to, or communications with representatives of, foreign nations is unlawful. A purely fact-finding trip that involves looking around, visiting American military bases or talking with U.S. diplomats is not a problem. Nor is formal negotiation with foreign representatives if authorized by the president. (FDR appointed Sens. Tom Connally and Arthur Vandenberg to the U.S. delegation that negotiated the U.N. Charter.) Ms. Pelosi's trip was not authorized, and Syria is one of the world's leading sponsors of international terrorism. It has almost certainly been involved in numerous attacks that have claimed the lives of American military personnel from Beirut to Baghdad.

    The U.S. is in the midst of two wars authorized by Congress. For Ms. Pelosi to flout the Constitution in these circumstances is not only shortsighted; it may well be a felony, as the Logan Act has been part of our criminal law for more than two centuries. Perhaps it is time to enforce the law.

  2. #2
    She's the speaker of the House, she is the United States.

    >The Logan Act makes it a felony and provides for a prison sentence of up to three years for any American, "without authority of the United States," to communicate with a foreign government in an effort to influence that government's behavior on any "disputes or controversies with the United States."

  3. #3
    Bush is currently protecting a group labeled as terrorist by the US State Department in Iraq

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...sts/index.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by eliteforce
    She's the speaker of the House, she is the United States.

    >The Logan Act makes it a felony and provides for a prison sentence of up to three years for any American, "without authority of the United States," to communicate with a foreign government in an effort to influence that government's behavior on any "disputes or controversies with the United States."
    Foreign policy is made the Executive branch. This is not open to opinion, it is fact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mcpeepants
    Bush is currently protecting a group labeled as terrorist by the US State Department in Iraq

    http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/meast/...sts/index.html
    And?
    "The State Department said Friday the Geneva Conventions protections apply only to MEK residents of Camp Ashraf, and the organization as a whole and its members elsewhere are subject to prosecution for terrorist or criminal acts."

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    Wow. I wonder if anything will come if this...


    Logan--

    Readin' the journal, huh? Did you get them to let you trade stocks in your 401k? lol

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    Well, if they want to bash Pelosi for this, they're gonna have to bash several congressional Republicans too:

    http://news.yahoo.com/s/bloomberg/20...a4r6kszkdec0_1

    Pelosi, in Defiance of Bush, Seeks Syria Dialogue Laura Litvan

    Wed Apr 4, 10:51 AM ET

    April 4 (Bloomberg) -- House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (news, bio, voting record) met with Syrian President Bashar al-Assad in Damascus in defiance of President George W. Bush, who called the visit ``counterproductive.''

    The talks were ``very productive,'' Pelosi said in a televised news conference in the Syrian capital today, adding she was ``determined that the road to Damascus would be the path to peace.''

    Assad gave assurances of his willingness to restart talks with Israel on the Middle East peace process, Pelosi said. She said she was able to convey a message from Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert that his country is also ready to engage in peace talks.

    Some congressional Republicans support Pelosi's diplomatic overture. Republican Representative David Hobson of Ohio is one of six members of Congress traveling with her. Three other Republican representatives made a separate visit to Syria this week, over the objections of the White House.

    Republican Representatives Frank Wolf (news, bio, voting record) of Virginia, Joseph Pitts (news, bio, voting record) of Pennsylvania and Robert Aderholt (news, bio, voting record) of Alabama said in a statement that while they support Bush's Iraq policy, they also believe that ``there should be an aggressive diplomatic effort.''

    `Mixed Signals'

    Bush said at a White House news conference yesterday that the administration has ``made it clear to high-ranking officials, whether they be Republicans or Democrats, that going to Syria sends mixed signals.''

    Pelosi, 67, is following the suggestion of the bipartisan Iraq Study Group, which said last year that the U.S. should engage Iran and Syria to help stabilize Iraq, her spokesman said.

    Bush rejected that recommendation because the administration considers Syria a state sponsor of terrorism through its support of the Lebanese militant group Hezbollah and the Palestinian group Hamas.

    Pelosi's two-day trip and her legislative efforts to force Bush to end the war in Iraq demonstrate the Democrats' determination to challenge policies that they say were repudiated by voters in the November election.

    Lee Hamilton, a co-chairman of the Iraq Study Group, said he supports the trip because ``the policy of not talking to Syria has not worked.''

    ``I do not think conversation is capitulation or talking is appeasement,'' said Hamilton, a former Democratic representative from Indiana.

    Took Control

    The trip is Pelosi's second to the Middle East since Democrats took control of the House in January.

    Bush said Pelosi's meeting with Assad lets Syrian officials believe they're part of the mainstream. He said Assad's government has done ``little to nothing'' to rein in the militant groups and has aided the movement of foreign fighters from Syria into Iraq.

    Pelosi's Middle East trip included an address to the Israeli Knesset April 1. Olmert has told reporters he asked Pelosi to carry a message to Assad that his nation will engage in talks with Syria if Syria backs away from its support of terrorist groups.

    Soldiers' Abduction

    The abduction of Israeli soldiers by Hezbollah and Hamas was discussed during the talks with Assad, Pelosi said at the news conference, without elaborating.

    Pelosi said the delegation members also ``expressed our concern about Syria's connections'' to militant groups and discussed the issue of fighters slipping across the Syrian border into Iraq, the Associated Press reported.

    Pelosi this week also traveled to Lebanon, and met with Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas in the West Bank city of Ramallah. Pelosi, a California Democrat who is second in line to the presidency after Vice President Dick Cheney, is the highest-ranking American to visit Syria since Colin Powell went there as secretary of state in May 2003.

    Last month, the U.S. attended a conference on Iraq that Syria and Iran joined. The meeting marked the first time that the U.S. officials have met in Baghdad with representatives of Syria and Iran to discuss Iraq's future.

    Direct Talks

    The Bush administration has accused Syria of fomenting sectarian violence in Iraq and aiding attacks on U.S. troops there. The U.S. also blamed Syria for the assassination of former Lebanese Prime Minister Rafiq Hariri.

    Congressional leaders have previously bucked a president on overseas trips, in some cases even presidents in their own party, said Don Ritchie, associate historian for the U.S. Senate.

    Former Senate Foreign Relations Committee Chairman William Fulbright, an Arkansas Democrat, clashed with President Lyndon Johnson over the Vietnam War and over a decision to send U.S. troops to the Dominican Republic in 1965 to intervene in a civil war. Johnson, in response, withdrew an offer to let Fulbright use a military plane on one trip to Southeast Asia, Ritchie said.

    ``Johnson made him fly commercial, which was a lot longer flight,'' Ritchie said. Fulbright's staff sent him off on the long journey with reading material on U.S. policies in Southeast Asia, and he returned an even stronger foe of Johnson's positions, Ritchie said.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    And?
    "The State Department said Friday the Geneva Conventions protections apply only to MEK residents of Camp Ashraf, and the organization as a whole and its members elsewhere are subject to prosecution for terrorist or criminal acts."
    we're using them to spy on Iran and problem more (there were recent attacks in Iran a few weeks ago by groups opposed to the Iranian regime). this is the type of thing that will come back to bite us in the butt: remember Osama

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    Quote Originally Posted by mcpeepants
    we're using them to spy on Iran and problem more (there were recent attacks in Iran a few weeks ago by groups opposed to the Iranian regime). this is the type of thing that will come back to bite us in the butt: remember Osama
    I can not disagree with that mcpeepants, but we do need some insiders.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by mcpeepants
    we're using them to spy on Iran and problem more (there were recent attacks in Iran a few weeks ago by groups opposed to the Iranian regime). this is the type of thing that will come back to bite us in the butt: remember Osama
    Absolutely.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    I can not disagree with that mcpeepants, but we do need some insiders.
    We tend to fundamentally misunderstand those insiders' roles in the countries they originate from. The Kurds aren't some pacifistic group that "draws when they must." They're as murderous and vengeful as any Sunni Muslim and given a free hand, would gas the Iraqis just as their people were.

    Yet we arm and support them and once we leave, who knows what will happen.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinlander
    We tend to fundamentally misunderstand those insiders' roles in the countries they originate from. The Kurds aren't some pacifistic group that "draws when they must." They're as murderous and vengeful as any Sunni Muslim and given a free hand, would gas the Iraqis just as their people were.

    Yet we arm and support them and once we leave, who knows what will happen.
    Perhaps, but the Kurds are not the one's making the road-side bombs.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    Perhaps, but the Kurds are not the one's making the road-side bombs.
    You're right. We're helping the Kurds so it wouldn't make sense for them to blow us up. If we turned on them, they'd be making the bombs.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinlander
    You're right. We're helping the Kurds so it wouldn't make sense for them to blow us up. If we turned on them, they'd be making the bombs.
    I do not think so. They are a warring tribe, but not a terrorist one.

  15. #15
    What the heck are you talking about? Since when are guerilla tactics "terrorism?" IUDs are a boobytrap, same as claymore mines, tripwires, landmines, etc. Acts of violence in a declared conflict are "warfare," and we are in a declared war.

    ter·ror·ism (těr'ə-rĭz'əm) Pronunciation Key
    n. The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
    Last edited by Vinlander; 04-07-2007 at 05:20 PM.

  16. #16
    You act like anyone who fights against the U.S. government is a "terrorist." Most of the soldiers opposing ours in Iraq are former Iraqi military, Syrian mercenaries and other militarily trained personnel from Arab nations.

  17. #17
    I though this thread was about "did pelosi commit a felony by visiting assad" ?
    why did mcpee not start a new thread instead of post #3?

    Power is something that is assigned by US law, pelosi has the powers vested in her position as Speaker, she does not have the power to sign treaties etc. Nothing was done here except talking. The president trying to lable the speaker a 'felon' because she had a meeting with someone is yeltsin-power-struggle type crap. he will fail miserably if he tries to do this. Concerning the Iraq dispute with congress-recently the US military drew up plans for a US evacuation of Iraq in the event it is mandated-this was a direct slap in the face of bush who insists the US military will go no-where unless he orders it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by eliteforce
    I though this thread was about "did pelosi commit a felony by visiting assad" ?
    why did mcpee not start a new thread instead of post #3?

    Power is something that is assigned by US law, pelosi has the powers vested in her position as Speaker, she does not have the power to sign treaties etc. Nothing was done here except talking. The president trying to lable the speaker a 'felon' because she had a meeting with someone is yeltsin-power-struggle type crap. he will fail miserably if he tries to do this. Concerning the Iraq dispute with congress-recently the US military drew up plans for a US evacuation of Iraq in the event it is mandated-this was a direct slap in the face of bush who insists the US military will go no-where unless he orders it.
    Did you even read the article?

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    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinlander
    What the heck are you talking about? Since when are guerilla tactics "terrorism?" IUDs are a boobytrap, same as claymore mines, tripwires, landmines, etc. Acts of violence in a declared conflict are "warfare," and we are in a declared war.

    ter·ror·ism (těr'ə-rĭz'əm) Pronunciation Key
    n. The unlawful use or threatened use of force or violence by a person or an organized group against people or property with the intention of intimidating or coercing societies or governments, often for ideological or political reasons.
    Seriously, can you point me to a report on how the Kurds were blowing up little kids on buses on their way to school?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?
    How many Speakers of the House went to Syria?

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    Quote Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?
    BTW, you can keep trying, and trying, and trying, and whining all that you want - logic will beat out your idealogy every time.

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    Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?

    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    How many Speakers of the House went to Syria?
    Oh, so the law against meddling in foreign policy applies only to the Speaker of the House, and not Republican congressmen?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    How many Speakers of the House went to Syria?
    Just Pelosi.

    But then again, in a precedent-making visit, Dennis Hastert, the future Speaker of the House, back in 1997, visited Columbia:

    http://thinkprogress.org/2007/04/04/hastert-colombia/

    In 1997, Rep. Dennis Hastert (R-IL) led a delegation to Colombia at a time when U.S. officials were trying to attach human rights conditions to U.S. security assistance programs. Hastert specifically encouraged Colombian military officials to “bypass” President Clinton and “communicate directly with Congress.”

    . . . and where, oh where, were all the Republicans who objected to his shenanigans?

    Nowhere to be found . . . just like you won't hear any criticism of the Republicans who have been in Syria for the past while . . .

    ======================
    Here's the entire article:


    FLASHBACK: Hastert Traveled Abroad, Told Foreign Leaders Not To Listen To Clinton
    President Bush yesterday said Speaker Pelosi’s bipartisan delegation to Syria sends “mixed signals,” implying that Pelosi overstepped her bounds by merely visiting Syria.

    Bush’s supporters have been repeating the argument:

    Former ambassador John Bolton: “I would simply hope that people would understand that, under the Constitution, the president conducts foreign policy, not the speaker of the House.”

    Former Gov. Mitt Romney: “It has long been the established principle of this country that the president of the United States leads our foreign policy. And if you don’t like the president, then you change him. But you don’t have the two parties each conducting foreign policy in the way they think it ought to be conducted.”

    Speaker Pelosi has done nothing to suggest that she intended to speak on behalf of President Bush or the U.S. Government. But her predecessors haven’t been so respectful.

    In 1997, Rep. Dennis Hastert (R-IL) led a delegation to Colombia at a time when U.S. officials were trying to attach human rights conditions to U.S. security assistance programs. Hastert specifically encouraged Colombian military officials to “bypass” President Clinton and “communicate directly with Congress.”

    …a congressional delegation led by Rep. Dennis Hastert (R-IL) which met with Colombian military officials, promising to “remove conditions on assistance” and complaining about “leftist-dominated” U.S. congresses of years past that “used human rights as an excuse to aid the left in other countries.” Hastert said he would to correct this situation and expedite aid to countries allied in the war on drugs and also encouraged Colombian military officials to “bypass the U.S. executive branch and communicate directly with Congress.”

    Subsequently, U.S. Ambassador to Colombia Myles Frechette sent a cable complaining that Hastert’s actions had undermined his leverage with the Colombian military leadership.

    In other instances, Hastert actually guided congressional staff to unilaterally reach deals with Colombian officials:

    House Foreign Affairs Committee staff, at the direction of the Hastert group, would fly to Colombia, meet with the nation’s anti-narcotics police and negotiate the levels and terms of assistance, the scope of the program and the kinds of equipment that would be needed. Rarely were the U.S. diplomatic personnel in our embassy in Bogata consulted about the “U.S.” position in these negotiations, and in a number of instances they were excluded from or not even made aware of the meetings.

    If the right is looking for members of Congress clearly infringing on the president’s constitutional prerogatives, they should look at Hastert, not Pelosi

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tock
    Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?


    Oh, so the law against meddling in foreign policy applies only to the Speaker of the House, and not Republican congressmen?
    Foreign policy is made by the Executive branch, end of story. I do not care what political party one belongs to, if you go against the stated policy, you are in violation. But to say that the Speaker of the House is just another Congressman/woman is silly, this position is 3 heart beats away from the Presidency. Therefore I guess that Tock and bgmc31 are both in agreement that what Pelosi did was wrong, since you have both pointed to others for having been wrong.

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    Quote Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?
    And when YOU start responding to my other threads in here, than I will answer yours.

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    No Logan what we are saying is if the administration is going to claim what Pelosi did was wrong, then they must also state that their own counterparts are wrong for the same thing.

    What posts haven't I answered, please clarify?

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    Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?

    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    And when YOU start responding to my other threads in here, than I will answer yours.
    That's just Logan's way of saying, "Tock's got it all over me again!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tock
    Originally Posted by BgMc31
    Logan, what is your response to Tock's post #7?


    That's just Logan's way of saying, "Tock's got it all over me again!"
    Let's not be lazy next time and do your own looking.
    post#25
    "Foreign policy is made by the Executive branch, end of story. I do not care what political party one belongs to, if you go against the stated policy, you are in violation. But to say that the Speaker of the House is just another Congressman/woman is silly, this position is 3 heart beats away from the Presidency. Therefore I guess that Tock and bgmc31 are both in agreement that what Pelosi did was wrong, since you have both pointed to others for having been wrong."

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    Quote Originally Posted by BgMc31
    No Logan what we are saying is if the administration is going to claim what Pelosi did was wrong, then they must also state that their own counterparts are wrong for the same thing.

    What posts haven't I answered, please clarify?
    Even with half of my brain tied behind my back, bgmc31 and tock get owned.

    Man, I am going to have to think up a "how many tocks and bgmc31s does it take to screw in a light bulb" joke........

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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan13
    Even with half of my brain tied behind my back, bgmc31 and tock get owned.
    We look forward to you untying your brain . . . I'm sure it will improve your postings . . .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tock
    We look forward to you untying your brain . . . I'm sure it will improve your postings . . .
    Yes, I did not think that you would respond to the other posting..........

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    One of my clients is a retired professor of history, specializing in military and diplomatic history. He's a democrat. I had a meeting with him today and asked him what he thought about the whole thing. I didn't take it too far, obviously, but I asked him his opinion. He said he didn't think it was illegal, but he thought it was in poor taste. He said there are diplomatic channels to go through. He asked me my opinion and I said, "oh, I don't know, I just read that it could be considered illegal under the Logan act which was originated because of a situation such as this. But of course, you would know more than I would...." He squirmed for a second, and just said, " I don't necessarily agree with that...." I left the air clear for a second to see if he would elaborate, but he didn't.

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    I also agree it was in poor taste. I think Pelosi did it to rub it in Bush's face. Indeed playing politics. My point of contention is why the uproar when Republicans did the same thing.

    I'm seriously looking for someone to educate me on this. And no Logan I don't want you to put your right wing spin on this. I want to know why it could be illegal for Pelosi to do it but not the Republicans who did it? Is it simply because the Republicans had the blessings of the administration? I'm hear for educational purposes just as much as I am to annoy the hell out of Logan! LOL!!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by BgMc31
    I also agree it was in poor taste. I think Pelosi did it to rub it in Bush's face. Indeed playing politics. My point of contention is why the uproar when Republicans did the same thing.

    I'm seriously looking for someone to educate me on this. And no Logan I don't want you to put your right wing spin on this. I want to know why it could be illegal for Pelosi to do it but not the Republicans who did it? Is it simply because the Republicans had the blessings of the administration? I'm hear for educational purposes just as much as I am to annoy the hell out of Logan! LOL!!!
    again, see post #25 for your answer.
    You can not annoy me, but I do pity you.

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    Originally posted by: Logan13

    House Speaker Nancy Pelosi may well have committed a felony in traveling to Damascus this week, against the wishes of the president, to communicate on foreign-policy issues with Syrian President Bashar Assad. The administration isn't going to want to touch this political hot potato, nor should it become a partisan issue. Maybe special counsel Patrick Fitzgerald, whose aggressive prosecution of Lewis Libby establishes his in***endence from White House influence, should be called back.

    The Bush administration is not going to touch this and there won’t be a special counsel investigation because it’s TOTAL BS!!


    Originally posted by: Logan13

    The Logan Act makes it a felony and provides for a prison sentence of up to three years for any American, "without authority of the United States," to communicate with a foreign government in an effort to influence that government's behavior on any "disputes or controversies with the United States." Some background on this statute helps to understand why Ms. Pelosi may be in serious trouble.
    “The Logan Act, designed to cover relations between private citizens of the United States and foreign governments, has prompted much controversy as to its scope and effect in its more than 200 years.”

    State De.partment, 1975: “The clear intent of this provision [Logan Act] is to prohibit unauthorized persons from intervening in disputes between the United States and foreign governments. Nothing in section 953, however, would appear to restrict members of the Congress from engaging in discussions with foreign officials in pursuance of their legislative duties under the Constitution.”



    SOURCE: (much more credible than an editorial IMO)
    CRS Report for Congress
    Conducting Foreign Relations Without Authority:
    http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL33265.pdf

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    Quote Originally Posted by TAPPER
    The Bush administration is not going to touch this and there won’t be a special counsel investigation because it’s TOTAL BS!!

    “The Logan Act, designed to cover relations between private citizens of the United States and foreign governments, has prompted much controversy as to its scope and effect in its more than 200 years.”

    State De.partment, 1975: “The clear intent of this provision [Logan Act] is to prohibit unauthorized persons from intervening in disputes between the United States and foreign governments. Nothing in section 953, however, would appear to restrict members of the Congress from engaging in discussions with foreign officials in pursuance of their legislative duties under the Constitution.”

    SOURCE: (much more credible than an editorial IMO)
    CRS Report for Congress
    Conducting Foreign Relations Without Authority:
    http://www.fas.org/sgp/crs/misc/RL33265.pdf
    I never said that the Bush administration would touch it. Is it your stance that what Pelosi did was a good thing for America?

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    ^^Never said it was a good thing, but if you look at the facts of the matter and not the propaganda it’s nowhere near as damaging as its being made out to be. Hyping "she may have committed a felony" when the law is crystal clear is worse IMO. I’m sure the Pelosi and Co (including the Rep’s) went over there with good intentions (clouded as they may be) but those slinging mud are doing so just to cause trouble and are fully aware of it.

    If this administration was genuinely concerned about the Pelosi & Co trip affecting international policy why didn’t President Bush call them back?

    If President Bush was so concerned about the budget he is planning to veto why didn’t he call them back from vacation to work on another draft?

    “He has the power to call Congress back from vacation, but instead he ridiculed them for leaving then set off on his own Thurs-Sun Easter vacation.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews

  39. #39
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    4,740
    Quote Originally Posted by TAPPER
    ^^Never said it was a good thing, but if you look at the facts of the matter and not the propaganda it’s nowhere near as damaging as its being made out to be. Hyping "she may have committed a felony" when the law is crystal clear is worse IMO. I’m sure the Pelosi and Co (including the Rep’s) went over there with good intentions (clouded as they may be) but those slinging mud are doing so just to cause trouble and are fully aware of it.

    If this administration was genuinely concerned about the Pelosi & Co trip affecting international policy why didn’t President Bush call them back?

    If President Bush was so concerned about the budget he is planning to veto why didn’t he call them back from vacation to work on another draft?

    “He has the power to call Congress back from vacation, but instead he ridiculed them for leaving then set off on his own Thurs-Sun Easter vacation.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...l?hpid=topnews
    Political posturing on both sides.

  40. #40
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Posts
    136
    ^^agreed, but Bush was ultimately in control of this situation and should have acted like a real leader. If he called them back the whole Pelosi issue would never have happened, nobody would look like an a$$ for taking a vacation while we are at war, and they (including the President) could have sat in a room and worked together until there was a signed budget. His approval ratings would have started to rise again and our country would have made honest progress. Instead he did what everyone else did and went on vacation. He was a “C” student and we are getting the same level of performance as a President.

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