Revised summer cycle

[boardhead]

Ok gentleman, after much debate i am thinking of starting the following cycle in a few weeks: I know its a strange mix of compounds, i just want to make sure there will be no adverse effects:

stats: 6'1, 215 lbs as of today, lifting 8 yrs, bf 15% and dropping. Here's what i am thinking....

weeks 1-10 Test E 300mg/week
Weeks 1-3 DBOL 20mg/day
Weeks 4-10 VAR 50mg/day
Liquidex .25 eod if needed.
Milk thistle

weeks 13-17 PCT. clomid, liquidex, test drive, creatine, clen

never done DBOL or VAR before. i was thinking that the dbol would kickstart the cycle and i would cut up with the VAR. running low dose of test the entire way. Comments are welcomed..

[boardhead]

i've been doing some serious diet research and i think i have crossed all my T's and dotted the I's. looking to add 10 lbs LBM. eating 2700-3000 clean calories spread out in 6 meals daily with 1 hr cardio 4 times a week in the am.

[boardhead]

come on guys - does ANYONE have any input on this cycle? is ok to run teh dbol the first 3 weeks then switch to anavar the last 7? that's 10 weeks on orals...advice would be great. i hve access to other subs and can switch it up. i'm going for strength on this cycle.

[gymrat 1313]

Im currently running a similar cycle. I would up the test for sure, im running 500mg test E/week 1-10, anavar weeks 5-12 50mg/daily. Im on week 7, 3 weeks into the anavar and my results are ridiculous, but also have been on a perfect diet and doing cardio 4-5 times per week.. I personally wouldnot run orals for 10 weeks straight thats a lot of stress on your liver and I dont think u need the dbol to kickstart the cycle...

[boardhead]

thx. sounds like the VAR is kicking in. i havent run VAR yet but heard good things. i have the dbol so i wanted to just use what i had..but dont want to hurt the liver anymore. i cant get anymore test right now and in the past 300mg worked well. im' sure 500 would be even better. my thoughts were the dbol would kickstart it and then the var would shred the weight down a little...i could be wrong. What are your stats?

[AlphaMaleDawg]

Are you trying to bulk or cut? you seem to be contradicting yourself.

If it is a cutting cycle, I would just run var straight for 10 weeks and drop the dbol

[JasonT]

A prop/var cycle would accomplish what you are trying to do without the added liver stress....not sure what you have already though

[boardhead]

i'm looking to get my strength back. i had a back injury 6 months ago and i'm ready start getting stronger. (i've been lifting straight through and rehab) but my strength has weakended significantly. so really i'm doing it for strenght. Got the diet plan down for a cutter. i have test/dbol/var/clen/liquidex. i agree on the contradicting aspect. i think everyone kind of wants to cut/bulk at the same time but i'm aware it doenst work that way..

ok. so here is the final.

test e 300mg/wk 1-10
var 50/mg/day 3-10
clen wk 8-13
PCT wk 12-15 clomid/liquidex/clen

3000 clean calories/day with 4 - 1 hr cardio sess in the am. lift in the pm

[Neevor]

I actually run win for the last 6 weeks of my bulking cycles because of its beneficial effects on aromatization so I understand why you run Var (their both DHT and they have similar effects although as I recall Win has been shown to increase AR binding efficiencey and Var doesnt. On the other hand Win is way more hepatoxic). This sounds like a light bulking cycle. You'll probably get 10 to 15 lbs out of it but with the var it will be a lot easier to keep the gains. Id run the dbol a little longer.

I've run win for 12 weeks before with no issues. A lot of guys say you shouldnt but I also dont drink when I'm on a cycle and I take milk thistle and it seems to be okay. I'm also not the only person I've heard of doing this and being just fine. With Var I wouldnt even worry about it. I've heard of people back in the day running that shit for 6 months at low doses.

In any case I'm assuming this is a light bulking cycle because you have Dbol and Test E on there. If its a either a cutting diet or a lean mass diet Id drop the Dbol and change to test prop. The cycle is just a little contradictory like Alpha said. I'd either bump up your dosage of Test E to 500 and eat like a horse or I'd change over to Test Prop and drop the Dbol and diet down. A lean mass cycle is very hard to do because you need to zig zag your diet daily so that you are putting on muscle and dropping fat at the same time keeping your metabolism high. Thats actually something I do between cycles but I don't think its worth it when you've got gear. Either bulk up or diet down hard. The Test will keep you from loosing muscle

Your side effects should really be nothing. Every time I've run a DHT with a bulking cycle I've had no gyno issues at even higher dosages than what you are talking about. You'll probably get a little increase in blood pressure from increased red bloodcell production but again, with the antiaromatizing effects of the DHT you wont see much water retention so your bp wont go up that much.

Good luck and let us know what you decide to do!

[boardhead]

Neevor thanks for the good advice. i'm going to increase the test e and complete the following:

Test E 500mg/wk 1-10 mon-thurs shots
Var 50 mg/day wk 1-10
Clen pyramid wk 8-13
PCT - clomid/ldex/creatine 12-14

clean diet with little fat and 250g protein daily split up over 6 meals to kick in my metabolism. cardio 4 times/week 1 hour in am. (swim, run, bike, surf)

i'll save the dbol for a later cycle and also add in milk thistle the entire run.

[Neevor]

Lol, that should be okay. I'd still rather run Test Prop for a cutter but you'll do fine with Enth.

As far as the clen goes, I'd run it through the whole cycle at 60mgs a day taken before your morning cardio (except your first couple days, ease into it with 20mcgs. Then after an hour if you dont feel like a leaf in a huricane then pop another 20mcgs. Trust me, you dose yourself too much the first time and you'll never make that mistake again). Every three weeks take 50 to 100mgs of benedryl to upgrade your beta 2 receptors. I've done the pyramid before two and I feel like I get more if I do it every week thru the whole cycle. I wouldnt run clen without your juice if you have the option. You may as well get it all taken care of in 10 weeks. That way you can lean on your cycle to prevent catabolism during your morning work out before you've eaten.

A couple more things... dont stop taking creatine while your on your cycle. Your body still needs that stuff. You should be taking a pre workout supplement like NO Explode or Super Pump 250 as well (these have creatine in them so problem solved). Those seem to be the two favorites on this forum from what I can tell. (I favor the later personally)

Do your cardio before you eat and you'll burn about twice as much fat. Make sure you drink Casein protein (30 to 60 grams) right before you go to bed. The Optimal nutrition brand has Ltryptophan in it which helps me sleep too. Its especially nice with the clen because clen tends to give me insomnia. If you get cramps at night its because you arent drinking enough water so make sure you drink pleanty. Same with headaches.

Also, if you're interested, A Scientific Approach To Bodybuilding really helped me get some good ideas when it came to supplements and work outs. Way better than anything else I've read. Arnolds Encyclopedia of Bodybuilding is pretty great too.

Hope all that helps

[Neevor]

Damn it, I just saw your proposed caloric intake. 3000 is probably a little high. My maintenance caloric intake is around 3700 to 3900 cals a day and I'm just a couple inches taller and a few lbs heavier than you so I'm guessing yours is a little lower. Remember that for every 500 calories less than your maintenance that you take in in a day you lose one lb a week. So if I wanted to lose 2lbs a week I would eat between 2700 and 2900 cals a day. If I do that and run clen I usually loose 3lbs a week so I'm guessing clen ramps my metabolism up by 500 extra cals a day. Figure out what you're maintenence intake is and then drop a 1000 off per day. Also, eat a nice big cheat meal every 5 to 7 days (I personally either go with like a 100 dollars worth of sushi or a pot of whole wheat pasta and sausage, nothing like pizza or fast food) and that will help keep your metabolism up while you are dieting.

[gymrat 1313]

thx. sounds like the VAR is kicking in. i havent run VAR yet but heard good things. i have the dbol so i wanted to just use what i had..but dont want to hurt the liver anymore. i cant get anymore test right now and in the past 300mg worked well. im' sure 500 would be even better. my thoughts were the dbol would kickstart it and then the var would shred the weight down a little...i could be wrong. What are your stats?

Im 5'10 202 lbs 7% bf..strength increases have been ridiculous and ive been shedding the fat i have left very quickly.. with the correct diet and cardio routine you should be more than happy with a test/var cycle.

[Neevor]

nice work gymrat

[boardhead]

good info peeps. so run the clen right through the cycle. i made the mistake of drinking too much clen one time and it wasnt fun at all. i'll look into the protein you mentioned. starting in one week hoooooooorrrrahhh

[hardgainer1]

increase everything by 2 weeks IMO

[boardhead]

i can extend by 2 weeks but i'd be dropping the doses of each compound by 16%. would that help stretching it out an extra 2 weeks?

[Neevor]

i can extend by 2 weeks but i'd be dropping the doses of each compound by 16%. would that help stretching it out an extra 2 weeks?

hmm... its not gonna hurt to drop the dosage of the test at all. 400 a week is still just fine. I wouldnt drop the dosage of the var or the clen. If you have to take a break on the var in the middle. I personally would run it a week longer than the test so run the test for 12 weeks at 400. Run the var for the first 5 weeks, then 3 weeks off. Then five more weeks. The clen I would run at no less than 60mcgs a day. Probably easier to just start it when you start the cycle and if it runs out before the end then it runs out.

Good to go!