Atomini's all-you-need-to-know about TREN and how to use it effectively thread!

[Atomini]

Thanks for the reply. I really appreciate it. Do you think that doing something like 10 weeks on, 3 weeks off, 10 weeks on, 7 weeks off would be a fair bit safer? This would be at low to medium dosages (350-650mg). Also, should I get additional blood work and another EKG as well? I already take my BP every day at least twice (sit at 120/79 ).

Appreciate your help.

No, that would be not any safer at all, and in fact would be even more detrimental as blood plasma levels will be taking wild rollercoaster rides up and down, and a dose range of 350 - 650mg of Trenbolone is by no means a "low to medium" dosage at all. 350 - 650mg of Trenbolone is the strength equivalent of 1,750 - 3,250mg of Testosterone. Please explain to me how that is considered "low to medium". That to me sounds like "high to extreme".

Negative alterations in cholesterol require months (approximately 2 - 4 months depending on many different factors) to return to normal healthy levels, and the worse they are altered (especially from anabolic steroids such as Trenbolone), the longer your body will take to restore its proper cholesterol profiles. I had performed a Trenbolone cycle once and then took a little over a whole year off from any AAS cycles, had some bloodwork done monitoring cholesterol levels, and although my levels were in the normal range, they were still in the high end of normal!!!!!! That was a whole year after coming off a Trenbolone cycle. I was advised to make the appropriate adjustments to ensure it didn't rise out of the normal range, which it was very close to doing, and this was especially important considering I was going to start cycling again. Now, imagine what an individual's cholesterol levels are who decides to:

A. Abuse Trenbolone by either running it at excessive doses or excessive cycle lengths
B. Engages in poor nutritional habits (i.e. 'dirty bulking' or eating crap foods)
C. Does not ensure the administration of proper cardiovascular care through supplementation of cardiovascular support supplements/compounds
D. Might also possess an unknown underlying predisposition for CVD

These are serious drugs that cause serious alterations of the body's subsystems, and any way you try to slice it, if you decide to abuse these things (i.e. venturing beyond the boundaries of what would be considered moderate/responsible use), you will reap the consequences of your actions and it isn't pretty at all. Often times by the time you realize it, it's too late.

Bloodwork is ALWAYS essential and is a must-have whenever using anabolic steroids.

[Perseverance1]

No, that would be not any safer at all, and in fact would be even more detrimental as blood plasma levels will be taking wild rollercoaster rides up and down, and a dose range of 350 - 650mg of Trenbolone is by no means a "low to medium" dosage at all. 350 - 650mg of Trenbolone is the strength equivalent of 1,750 - 3,250mg of Testosterone. Please explain to me how that is considered "low to medium". That to me sounds like "high to extreme".

Negative alterations in cholesterol require months (approximately 2 - 4 months depending on many different factors) to return to normal healthy levels, and the worse they are altered (especially from anabolic steroids such as Trenbolone), the longer your body will take to restore its proper cholesterol profiles. I had performed a Trenbolone cycle once and then took a little over a whole year off from any AAS cycles, had some bloodwork done monitoring cholesterol levels, and although my levels were in the normal range, they were still in the high end of normal!!!!!! That was a whole year after coming off a Trenbolone cycle. I was advised to make the appropriate adjustments to ensure it didn't rise out of the normal range, which it was very close to doing, and this was especially important considering I was going to start cycling again. Now, imagine what an individual's cholesterol levels are who decides to:

A. Abuse Trenbolone by either running it at excessive doses or excessive cycle lengths
B. Engages in poor nutritional habits (i.e. 'dirty bulking' or eating crap foods)
C. Does not ensure the administration of proper cardiovascular care through supplementation of cardiovascular support supplements/compounds
D. Might also possess an unknown underlying predisposition for CVD

These are serious drugs that cause serious alterations of the body's subsystems, and any way you try to slice it, if you decide to abuse these things (i.e. venturing beyond the boundaries of what would be considered moderate/responsible use), you will reap the consequences of your actions and it isn't pretty at all. Often times by the time you realize it, it's too late.

Bloodwork is ALWAYS essential and is a must-have whenever using anabolic steroids.

Well I've seen people on these boards talk about doing a gram of tren so I suppose I figured that would be high and 650mg being 65% of that would be considered medium...also, Bear's running something like an 8 on 2 off protocol with a bunch of different compounds...what makes his body different than mine? All I want to do is gain whatever knowledge he has/is available so I can do a similar cycle (though about half as long) to what he's doing while not taking any more of a risk than he is.

I'm just here looking for raw data/advice on how to do what I'm going to do safely...not advice on whether I should do it or not. I do appreciate the concern though.

[Brick]

Well I've seen people on these boards talk about doing a gram of tren so I suppose I figured that would be high and 650mg being 65% of that would be considered medium...also, Bear's running something like an 8 on 2 off protocol with a bunch of different compounds...what makes his body different than mine? All I want to do is gain whatever knowledge he has/is available so I can do a similar cycle (though about half as long) to what he's doing while not taking any more of a risk than he is.

I'm just here looking for raw data/advice on how to do what I'm going to do safely...not advice on whether I should do it or not. I do appreciate the concern though.

Have you read any posts by or seen any about bear? I'll give you a hint, there is a reason his name is BEAR.

Do you think his first dose was 1g or even 650mg when he started Tren? No, it was probably closer to 200-300 range.

You don't get 'huge, massive, jacked, etc without putting the work in. You need MATURE muscle to build upon before taking these huge doses!

Who looks better today? A guy who has run two test e cycles with proper AI pct and time off or Zyzz's rotting body in the ground?

It's your health, if you don't want to heed the information about health concerns then so be it

[Perseverance1]

Have you read any posts by or seen any about bear? I'll give you a hint, there is a reason his name is BEAR.

Do you think his first dose was 1g or even 650mg when he started Tren? No, it was probably closer to 200-300 range.

You don't get 'huge, massive, jacked, etc without putting the work in. You need MATURE muscle to build upon before taking these huge doses!

Who looks better today? A guy who has run two test e cycles with proper AI pct and time off or Zyzz's rotting body in the ground?

It's your health, if you don't want to heed the information about health concerns then so be it

Alright, maybe you don't understand...nothing anyone on this earth says is going to dissuade me from doing a long tren cycle. Now it's analogy time so maybe you can comprehend how useless posts like yours are.

Let's say I post on the forum that I'm going to jump out of an airplane, and I ask what would be some good precautions to take. Your answer is "omg dont jump out of a airplane you'll look like zyzz's corpse"

A helpful response would be something akin to the following "hey persev, when I jumped out of a plane I used a parachute...it was a real life saver!" or " you should take a sky diving course before jumping out of a plane" or "make sure you get your parachute professionally rolled so that it won't get tangled up when you deploy it".

Do you see the difference? People on these boards say that they want to give the very best/most helpful information out there to anyone who asks so that people don't kill themselves and make AAS users around the world look bad and yet when guys like me show up looking for info all we get is "DONT DO IT YOU'LL DIE"....I've already decided to do it. My mind is made up. Now I'm just looking for help to stay as healthy as possible while doing it.

I don't mean to sound like a prick here but honestly I don't think I could phrase it any other way and get my point across. Hope you understand.

[Atomini]

Well I've seen people on these boards talk about doing a gram of tren so I suppose I figured that would be high and 650mg being 65% of that would be considered medium...also, Bear's running something like an 8 on 2 off protocol with a bunch of different compounds...what makes his body different than mine? All I want to do is gain whatever knowledge he has/is available so I can do a similar cycle (though about half as long) to what he's doing while not taking any more of a risk than he is.

I'm just here looking for raw data/advice on how to do what I'm going to do safely...not advice on whether I should do it or not. I do appreciate the concern though.

There is no way to do what you are planning to do safely. Bear knows what he is doing and has been doing it for a very long time. He gets regular bloodwork done, monitors everything far more meticulously than anyone here, keeps all of his internal vitals in check, and he even posted this disclaimer in a previous thread in which I discussed his use with him:

I absolutely in no way condone or recommend this behavior (my behavior) I have a very specific & somewhat time sensitive goal in sight, I'm not doing this for vanity.

I usually don't post my doses on the open forum for just this reason, but I made an exception this time, & I'm starting to think it was a poor exception to make.

If ANYONE is considering this just because "Bear does it, so can I" please, PM me first, this not for the faint of heart..................literally.

Translation: "DO NOT DO WHAT I AM DOING, IT IS NOT SAFE."

You can do whatever you want. But if you ask me how to do something safely that is inherently not safe, I can't tell you to go and do it. You can do it in defiance of my reccomendations and suggestions, but it won't be safe. I can't tell you how to drive a car into a concrete wall at 90MPH safely.

[Perseverance1]

There is no way to do what you are planning to do safely. Bear knows what he is doing and has been doing it for a very long time. He gets regular bloodwork done, monitors everything far more meticulously than anyone here, keeps all of his internal vitals in check, and he even posted this disclaimer in a previous thread in which I discussed his use with him:



Translation: "DO NOT DO WHAT I AM DOING, IT IS NOT SAFE."

You can do whatever you want. But if you ask me how to do something safely that is inherently not safe, I can't tell you to go and do it. You can do it in defiance of my reccomendations and suggestions, but it won't be safe. I can't tell you how to drive a car into a concrete wall at 90MPH safely.

I completely agree with bear and would recommend the same thing. I am doing what I am doing with a specific goal in sight...also, my decision has absolutely nothing to do with bear. The ONLY reason I brought him up is because it seems pretty narrow minded and hypocritical of the board to generally accept/ignore what he does while simultaneously putting others down for wanting to do something similar (regarding cycle length). I can afford blood work/EKG/prostate checks every few weeks...I will have more than enough free time as well (unemployment until the fall term starts woohoo!)....ALL I am seeking here is the knowledge. I planned on getting as much as I could out publicly to benefit everyone and then PMing Bear with any leftover questions I had...but it would seem like you're all more interested in trying to dissuade me from doing something you don't agree with rather than help me do it as safely as possible. Fine logic you have there...

Thanks anyway.

[The Bear 79]

I completely agree with bear and would recommend the same thing. I am doing what I am doing with a specific goal in sight...also, my decision has absolutely nothing to do with bear. The ONLY reason I brought him up is because it seems pretty narrow minded and hypocritical of the board to generally accept/ignore what he does while simultaneously putting others down for wanting to do something similar (regarding cycle length). I can afford blood work/EKG/prostate checks every few weeks...I will have more than enough free time as well (unemployment until the fall term starts woohoo!)....ALL I am seeking here is the knowledge. I planned on getting as much as I could out publicly to benefit everyone and then PMing Bear with any leftover questions I had...but it would seem like you're all more interested in trying to dissuade me from doing something you don't agree with rather than help me do it as safely as possible. Fine logic you have there...

Thanks anyway.

Alright, so many bases to cover here. I can understand how you would view me as a hypocrite, but you should understand that even though I try to detour people from doing what myself am doing, I have the best of intentions at heart & mind, I'm not just being some hypocritical ass hat. I cycle the way I do because I intend to compete against big, bad, beastly mother fvckers that are shooting for my prize my decision had nothing to do with vanity. You mentioned getting heart monitor & blood pressure monitor once a week.........I do it every hour on the hour............yes......this shit is that serious, I get blood work every 60 - 90 days. in order to keep a close eye on cholesterol, Tren jacks that shit through the roof, and I get extensive prostate exams every 120 days. Also, at these doses, left ventricular hypertrophy is a big concern, I have yet to find a way to combat that other than not cycling. There are so many undue risks associated with doses this big, the reward has to be astronomical to balance it, & vanity is nowhere near heavy enough to counter balance the risk brother. I can go on & on with documented studies & dangers but I think you get my point.

Antomini is the fvcking man when it comes to this shit man, he won't steer you wrong.

And nobody here is trying to "hold you down", just trying to identify a legitimate justification or otherwise steer you towards a safer cycle.

[Perseverance1]

Alright, so many bases to cover here. I can understand how you would view me as a hypocrite, but you should understand that even though I try to detour people from doing what myself am doing, I have the best of intentions at heart & mind, I'm not just being some hypocritical ass hat. I cycle the way I do because I intend to compete against big, bad, beastly mother fvckers that are shooting for my prize my decision had nothing to do with vanity. You mentioned getting heart monitor & blood pressure monitor once a week.........I do it every hour on the hour............yes......this shit is that serious, I get blood work every 60 - 90 days. in order to keep a close eye on cholesterol, Tren jacks that shit through the roof, and I get extensive prostate exams every 120 days. Also, at these doses, left ventricular hypertrophy is a big concern, I have yet to find a way to combat that other than not cycling. There are so many undue risks associated with doses this big, the reward has to be astronomical to balance it, & vanity is nowhere near heavy enough to counter balance the risk brother. I can go on & on with documented studies & dangers but I think you get my point.

Antomini is the fvcking man when it comes to this shit man, he won't steer you wrong.

And nobody here is trying to "hold you down", just trying to identify a legitimate justification or otherwise steer you towards a safer cycle.

I appreciate you weighing in on here Bear and I was hoping you would...one thing I'd like to clear up is that I wasn't calling you a hypocrit...I was calling the guys who can simultaneously pat you on the back (or turn a blind eye) while telling me I'm retarded.

I'll get bloodwork every 60 days, I already have a BP monitor I use a few times a day but I can up it to every hour, and I'll start getting my prostate checked every 120 days. I'll probably be PMing you with questions on how you control any/all potential sides and if there's anything else specific I should look for so hopefully you have a little spare time you don't mind using towards educating me a bit. I'm a pretty big numbers junkie so I'll be tracking all possible stats/sides etc. and loving every minute of it.


One thing I don't get though is how everyone here likes to decide what is and isn't "worth the risk" for each individual. I mean, you're about to be the strongest man alive...and everyone here seems to believe that your goal completely validates the means you are using to achieve that goal...I honestly have no intention of becoming the strongest man alive, nor would I ever strive for that. I would never under any circumstance take the risks you are taking to be the strongest man alive.

With that being said...let's say I'm willing to take those same risks so that I can look super cute in my pink Abercrombie T-Shirt my mom bought me at a garage sale (NOT why I'm doing it...just using extremes to prove a point lol). Isn't this a personal decision? Who is anyone else to say what I should or shouldn't risk for goal X. Sure, maybe I could reach my goal of filling out the shirt without gear while you can't...but let's add a timetable to that...maybe I only have 3 months to fill out my cute T-Shirt....I think you see where I'm going with this.

All I'm really trying to say is maybe some members should reevaluate the reasons why they give or withhold information. My main reason for being here is I enjoy breathing, and would like to continue to do so...but on the other side of the coin I've always loved pushing things to the limits and genuinely enjoy taking risks.

Cheers guys and thanks again Bear for the info.

[The Bear 79]

And by the way.........I don't put people down when they want to do what I do..........I merely ask "why"..........