Has anyone had an ulcer?

[diabolicsoul]

Been having stomach pain for 6+ months. Too much caffeine and anti-inflammatory.

Got tested to see if i had this stomach bacteria that causes ulcers. I don't have it.

Anyone have any good tips to speed up healing time, promote healing, etc?

The doctor gave me proton pump inhibitors. Said it reduces the amount of acid your stomach makes. Those don't help.

Anyways my plan starting tomorrow is to:

Cut out all caffeine, alcohol, fried foods, or anything that will cause me pain.

For the first week, I'm going to take a ton of tums, and other stomach medicine. my PPI's that I take daily anyways.

B12 shots for energy, and take other vitamins. Lots of vitamin A.

I'm going to buy raw red cabbage, apple cider vinegar, aloe juice. As they are suppose to help.



Any other tips or remedies that you can share? Or good ways to increase energy, since I will most likely be pretty tired from no caffeine.

[lovbyts]

1/2 tsp or more baking soda with water or juice.

[Times Roman]

prilosec

[diabolicsoul]

Picking up some baking soda now and other things I will look into prilosec for sure.

[AD]

i would avoid all sorts of citrus juice and sour food.

[Times Roman]

i would avoid all sorts of citrus juice and sour food.

there are actually those out there thhat would recommend vinegar under these circumstances.....

[AD]

there are actually those out there thhat would recommend vinegar under these circumstances.....

ya, its something i couldn't figure out, to fight an acid problem with more acid. but i feel it aggravates my pain. so i always stay away from juices if my stomach is not perfectly well.

[Times Roman]

ya, its something i couldn't figure out, to fight an acid problem with more acid. but i feel it aggravates my pain. so i always stay away from juices if my stomach is not perfectly well.

I don't understand it either, but i've tried it, and it didn't make it any worse........

[MuscleInk]

We're you diagnosed with an ulcer? What are your symptoms. Are you sure it's not acid reflux or a hiatal hernia?

Prilosec is a PPI (proton pump inhibitor). The class of PPIs are generally more effective than H2 antagonists although I generally recommend H2 antagonists before PPIs - the latter causes a terrible rebound in acid reflux activity unless the drug is titrated down when coming off. Do NOT stop PPIs abruptly!!!!!

When are your symptoms most severe?

MuscleInk

[AD]

I don't understand it either, but i've tried it, and it didn't make it any worse........

my stomach wall is probably weaker than yours

[lovbyts]

there are actually those out there thhat would recommend vinegar under these circumstances.....

That was going to be my next suggestion. It's a big Asian remedy and I have tried it many times. It works but not as good or as quick as the backing soda.

Most of the time stomach issues are due to not enough acid, not really to much so you need something such as the vinegar to get things working right again.

[AD]

We're you diagnosed with an ulcer? What are your symptoms. Are you sure it's not acid reflux or a hiatal hernia?

Prilosec is a PPI (proton pump inhibitor). The class of PPIs are generally more effective than H2 antagonists although I generally recommend H2 antagonists before PPIs - the latter causes a terrible rebound in acid reflux activity unless the drug is titrated down when coming off. Do NOT stop PPIs abruptly!!!!!

When are your symptoms most severe?

MuscleInk

on bad days, i have taken both ranitidine and omeprazole together!

Ink, can you help us explain how acidic food/drinks might help with a gastric problem?

[MuscleInk]

on bad days, i have taken both ranitidine and omeprazole together!

Ink, can you help us explain how acidic food/drinks might help with a gastric problem?

Wow, that's hard core AD.

I'll go in to more detail if anyone wishes, but for simplicity, acid reflux is most commonly brought on by high fat diets which sit in the stomach longer or a disruption to the health of the stomach flora. In many cases, increasing the acidity can facilitate a break down of fatty foods, reducing the total time for digestion and minimizing reflux.

MuscleInk

[diabolicsoul]

there are actually those out there thhat would recommend vinegar under these circumstances.....

Yes, I've read that too. I was hesitant at first. I decided to apple cider vinegar, and it did actually help. But, workload increased and so did the caffeine... so i didn't feel it working anymore.

We're you diagnosed with an ulcer? What are your symptoms. Are you sure it's not acid reflux or a hiatal hernia?

Prilosec is a PPI (proton pump inhibitor). The class of PPIs are generally more effective than H2 antagonists although I generally recommend H2 antagonists before PPIs - the latter causes a terrible rebound in acid reflux activity unless the drug is titrated down when coming off. Do NOT stop PPIs abruptly!!!!!

When are your symptoms most severe?

MuscleInk

All the doctor said was that I either have an ulcer or damaged stomach lining. Symptoms were: A burning pain in my stomach region, no heartburn, worsens when I consume alcohol,caffeine. Diarrhea ( not anymore), Felt like I was going to vomit ( not anymore), bad gas (not anymore). So now it's just the stomach pain. I live in a small town and he knows my family, and he said that my family has had a history of weak stomachs..

And I had a blood test done to see if I have that bacteria in my system, and I was good. I forget the name of my PPI, but it's really common. I think I read one of your posts about the horrible rebound awhile ago lol... H2 antagonists - zantac? I was doing a protocol of zantac before I went to the doctor. 2 in the morning and 2 at night both on an empty stomach. Didn't really do much. I was also taking tums.

Usually It feels fine in the morning. In the after noon it starts to come, and is kind of constant through out the day. Or it comes immediately or worsens when I consume caffeine/alcohol/anti inflammatorys.

I'm thinking it's just really bad damage to my stomach/intestinal lining, and not an ulcer. The pain doesn't keep me up, or wake me up. Food doesn't really help or make it worse. No blood or vomiting, like some people report.

My treatment plan that will start tomorrow is:

-no caffeine, no alcohol, no anti inflammatory, anything that will make it worse.
- 1 cup of red cabbage before every meal. <--- Read that its suppose to help.
- lots of fruit and veggies, stay away from fried foods.
- daily use of my PPI, I'm going to throw in some zantac, and bismo.
- lots of vitamin A, fish oil, probiotics,
-cayenne pepper capsules 3x daily, apple cider vinegar 3x daily. I will give the baking soda a try. aloe juice 3x daily.
- lots of herbal peppermint tea.

[lovbyts]

Dont jump on everything all at once, you may shock your system and you dont want to stop all the acid or you will have more problems.

Dont eat a BUNCH of fruit. Again don't over do it.
I would start out 1x a day with the apple cider vinegar (I do 1 pill a day) and the Aloe.

Speaking of cayenne pepper (never taken the capsules) if you ever get a sore throat try to gargle with it. I do this all the time since I found it a couple of years ago and every time it works GREAT, better than anything I have found. I will make pain scale of 0-10, an 8 sore throat down to a 4 or below in seconds.

[Sgt. Hartman]

on bad days, i have taken both ranitidine and omeprazole together!

Ink, can you help us explain how acidic food/drinks might help with a gastric problem?

Have you tried aciphex (rabeprazole)? I have chronic gastritis and its an absolute miracle for me.

[diabolicsoul]

I was kind of thinking it was over kill when I was writing it all out lol. I will probably start out slow. The main set back is just the caffeine, and sometimes alcohol on the weekend. Once when I cut those out I should feel 10x better.

When I was a kid, If i was sick with a sore throat. My mom would make me drink of cayenne pepper, lemon juice, and water. It's horrible, but it works. Never tried to gargle with it though, will keep that in mind.

Edit: Is it possible to be immune to tums/zantac, etc? Things like Tylenol, aspirin, etc don't have an affect for me. And My ex GF said that her body was immune to some pain killers.

Just because I never have had any relief taking tums/zantac/PPIs, but I just took them because I didn't want it to get worse.

[lovbyts]

I was kind of thinking it was over kill when I was writing it all out lol. I will probably start out slow. The main set back is just the caffeine, and sometimes alcohol on the weekend. Once when I cut those out I should feel 10x better.

When I was a kid, If i was sick with a sore throat. My mom would make me drink of cayenne pepper, lemon juice, and water. It's horrible, but it works. Never tried to gargle with it though, will keep that in mind.

Edit: Is it possible to be immune to tums/zantac, etc? Things like Tylenol, aspirin, etc don't have an affect for me. And My ex GF said that her body was immune to some pain killers.

Just because I never have had any relief taking tums/zantac/PPIs, but I just took them because I didn't want it to get worse.

Yeah just gargle, dont drink it. When you gargle with it you don't taste anything or very little. Yes it helps to get some down the throat also but I just put a little in some chicken noodle soup and it's not bad that way.

Save the lemon and honey for tea but the cayenne pepper in warm water gargle is just amazing.

It probably just means it's not to much acid that is causing the problem but I am the same way. Tums or most any antacid have never done anything for me. Only thing that has helped is the baking soda. I'm the same way with Aspirin/Tylenol also. They are worthless to me. I use Vicodin and from what I can tell it's the same as people who take Tylenol when it works. I get no buzz or euphoric feeling like some do though.

[MuscleInk]

Have you tried aciphex (rabeprazole)? I have chronic gastritis and its an absolute miracle for me.

Aciphex is very effective. A few members here achieve comfort with Nexium.

Ranitidine is hit or miss. I was getting by with 1 Zantac (ranitidine) daily, then that stopped being effective and I added famotidine (pepcid) to the mix and that helped for a bit.

I've switched to Prilosec this week and its been helping but I've ordered a barium swallow so I can check for a hiatal hernia.

H2 antagonists are generally mild and seem to work well for acute dyspepsia, acid reflux, or heart burn. There are many options:
- Axid
- Pepcid
- Tagamet
- Zantac

PPIs
- Dexilant
- Aciphex
- Nexium
- Prevacid
- Prilosec
- Protonix
- Zegerid

MuscleInk

[AD]

Have you tried aciphex (rabeprazole)? I have chronic gastritis and its an absolute miracle for me.

No i haven't. Will look into it. Thank mate

[optionsdude]

I had peptic ulcers in the past I take protonix 40mg in the morning. I used to have to take a pepcid ac before bed too but cutting out carbs after 5pm helped tremendously especially cutting out beer. I sure do miss a cold beer after work sometimes though,but it's just not worth waking up in the middle of the night choking on that beer and gasping for air. The gastro dr said the ulcers were def caused by years of anti-inflammatory use from my 2 knee surgeries.

[Java Man]

Why didn't you get a upper GI series like ink mentioned he was getting? With my doc that was the next step after the blood test. Nothing was found and it revealed whether I had any esophageal damage from years of reflux, which was also negative. Then he knew if he was treating an ulcer, stomach cancer, Barrett's, or just plain old reflux. Ended up just reflex no extraneous damage so I got omeprazole (prilosec) but the OTC 20mg wasn't enough so I now take 40mg XR. Haven't had a flareup since.

I would request a barium swallow (same thing as upper.gi series) next. It talks volumes about whats going on in there.

[lovbyts]

I had peptic ulcers in the past I take protonix 40mg in the morning. I used to have to take a pepcid ac before bed too but cutting out carbs after 5pm helped tremendously especially cutting out beer. I sure do miss a cold beer after work sometimes though,but it's just not worth waking up in the middle of the night choking on that beer and gasping for air. The gastro dr said the ulcers were def caused by years of anti-inflammatory use from my 2 knee surgeries.

That's interesting. I have taken anti inflamitory for years due to back issues. A couple of years ago they changed me over to a different one that is supposed to be more mild on the stomach but it was worse for me. I didnt have issues before, only after.

[Java Man]

That's interesting. I have taken anti inflamitory for years due to back issues. A couple of years ago they changed me over to a different one that is supposed to be more mild on the stomach but it was worse for me. I didnt have issues before, only after.

Same here! I ate ibuprofen 800s for back pain and headaches caused by inflammation in my neck. Ruined my stomach. Naproxen is allegedly easier on the guts, probably because it lasts 12 hrs and stronger mg for mg so you end taking less, and less frequently. Just give us all vicodin docs!

[kitstreasure]

Okay, I didn't read the whole thread, but I didn't notice anyone addressing the "Why does vinegar help?" questions, so let me handle that. One of the leading causes of your classic heartburn symptoms is a pH balance in the stomach that is too high (too base/alkaline). By ingesting a SMALL amount of acid (1tsp to 1Tbsp), you're bringing down the pH of the stomach fluids just enough to ease the pain. Lye is a common alkaline substance (ph of 13 usually) and it will burn you every bit as badly as muriatic acid.

Now, if you're eating things high in calcium, such as tums, that will actually cause the alkalizing effect and will cause quite the rebound of stomach acid production which often results in a worsening of symptoms. If this is what's happening a little bit of vinegar or mustard will help with this. This is also the remedy if it happens after you've had a large intake of water. (Prevent this problem by adding ~1tsp of lemon juice per 16ozs of water you drink directly to the water itself.)

If on the other hand, you're having heartburn after ingesting high acid foods then the proper thing to use would be the baking soda and water, a piece of bread, or 4ish ounces of milk.

A common prophylactic treatment option that an Italian grandma taught me is to use 1/8tsp of cinnamon in your tomato sauces and such. (I promise you can't taste it.) When you're not the one cooking, simply take 1 capsule (500mg) of cinnamon as you have your appetizer or the first couple bites of your meal.

The key to controlling heartburn (and most gastric issues), with your diet isn't the elimination of foods so much as the balancing of foods. Avoid starches with a lot of fat, etc.

HTH
-Treasure.

[AD]

very nice write-up treasure! detailed and yet easy to understand.

one question... would it still be the case, if the patient is suffering from a simple gastric ulcer without reflux?

[kitstreasure]

very nice write-up treasure! detailed and yet easy to understand.

one question... would it still be the case, if the patient is suffering from a simple gastric ulcer without reflux?

Yes, AD. The treatment options I suggested are all what's known as symptomatic, meaning that they are based on symptoms not the underlying syndrome. Whether you have reflux or basic heartburn you'll have the same issues going on so these alleviates the symptoms. It's like if you've dislocated your shoulder or you've sprained it, either way, it's going to be ice, NSAIDs, and a sling. This is the same idea.

[kitstreasure]

I think I read one of your posts about the horrible rebound awhile ago lol... H2 antagonists - zantac? I was doing a protocol of zantac before I went to the doctor. 2 in the morning and 2 at night both on an empty stomach. Didn't really do much. I was also taking tums.

My treatment plan that will start tomorrow is:

-no caffeine, no alcohol, no anti inflammatory, anything that will make it worse.
- 1 cup of red cabbage before every meal. <--- Read that its suppose to help.
- lots of fruit and veggies, stay away from fried foods.
- daily use of my PPI, I'm going to throw in some zantac, and bismo.
- lots of vitamin A, fish oil, probiotics,
-cayenne pepper capsules 3x daily, apple cider vinegar 3x daily. I will give the baking soda a try. aloe juice 3x daily.
- lots of herbal peppermint tea.

Okay, first, please read my post about vinegar and other homeopathic stomach treatments. That will also explain the reason why your zantac protocol wasn't as effective as it should have been.

Second: Caffeine isn't usually the issue creating stomach pain, but rather the vehicle you receive it in (coffee, teas, and sodas while they carry quite a bit of acid actually dilute your own stomach acids and can cause an over production in a rebound like response.)

Third: The things in red can help, but if used improperly or too much can and will make the situation worse. In the three things I highlighted, you have acid, spice and dilution of your stomach acids going on.

[AD]

forgive me for taking up so much time on this topic. i still don't quite appreciate how acid can be used to fight an acid problem.

the way i understand it, for peptic ulcer disease, its usually caused by either hyperacidity or disruption of the gastric protective lining, or both. http://www.hopkins-gi.org/GDL_Diseas...0-71B95E3B7FA9

GERD is caused by weakness of the lower esophageal spinchter, aggravated by abnormal motility of esophagus. http://www.hopkins-gi.org/GDL_Diseas...8-53077FCC9A0F

and the dietary recommendations they gave for gerd:

Medical Therapy

Lifestyle Changes
Medical treatment of GERD usually begins with dietary and life-style modifications. Reflux is exacerbated by foods that increase gastric acidity (caffeinated beverages and decaffeinated coffee), decrease lower esophageal sphincter pressure (fatty foods, chocolate, peppermint, spearmint), affect esophageal peristalsis (coffee, alcohol, and acidic liquids) or slow gastric emptying (fatty foods). Further, reflux is worse after large meals, which cause increased gastric pressure. Smoking affects esophageal motor function and increases air swallowing which results in frequent belching (often unrecognized) due to the need to vent the distended stomach.

treasure, earlier in the thread Ink also agreed and explained how acidic food might help with GERD by speeding up gastric emptying. but it seems to differ slightly from the textbook explanation. i am assuming both of you incorporated some of your experience in practice into this.

[AD]

and i believe OP may be mainly suffering from a gastric erosion/ulcer problem. not so much a reflux/heartburn.

[kitstreasure]

AD, you are correct, I've incorporated knowledge gained from my patients with the textbook information, but I am also a GERD and ulcer sufferer (yes, both) due to other medical issues I have. Most of my patients are pregnant women, so they have an even more sensitive stomach than you can imagine.

Okay, let's see if I can put these in other terms that you may understand better.... First, you have to understand that sometimes a small dose of what is already creating a problem can cause the body to self-correct (acid to treat an acid problem; hcg to treat infertility). In fact, let's use hcg as an example. Hcg is the hormone a woman's body produces when she's pregnant that causes all the pregnancy changes, produces the placenta, etc. Hcg is a mechanism in the body that causes the body to process a pregnancy. (Yes, this is massively over-simplified, but bear with me....) Now, in women who are infertile doses of hcg will cause the body to produce (and in some cases over-produce) ovum (eggs). So while common sense would say "10,000iu of hcg would stop my period because my body will think I'm pregnant," you would actually be wrong and you would be making the female in question hyper-fertile.

So basically, by introducing a small amount of acid to the stomach you are signaling the acid production system that you already have plenty, while not adding enough for the additional acid you're adding to worsen the situation. It's like balancing weak muscles in the body: you have back issues so while you are careful with which back exercises you do, you work those muscles more than the average person would and you also work the abs to help support the back....

(I'll re-read this after I've gotten some sleep to make sure it doesn't sound as idiotic as I feel right now.)

[kitstreasure]

and i believe OP may be mainly suffering from a gastric erosion/ulcer problem. not so much a reflux/heartburn.

Again, because the treatments I'm recommending treat the symptoms in an immediate way rather than the underlying cause, just about everything with this symptomology will get the same suggestions. Your head hurts: take tylenol; your foot hurts: take tylenol; your tooth hurts: take tylenol.... Same concept.

[lovbyts]

Again, because the treatments I'm recommending treat the symptoms in an immediate way rather than the underlying cause, just about everything with this symptomology will get the same suggestions. Your head hurts: take tylenol; your foot hurts: take tylenol; your tooth hurts: take tylenol.... Same concept.

^^^ agreed.