Oatmeal69's 4th Cycle TEST-E / TREN-A Diary / Log

[ironbeck]

How goes the cycle man......Is your gear legit? did you get it from a site, personal source, or did u brew your own?

[oatmeal69]

Yes, See post 35.
've gained about 5 pounds, but am actually seeing more of my abs than I have in years. I'm starting to believe in GBrice's theory - That for most guys "re-comp" is almost impossible, but for skinny-fat ecto's like myself it actually makes the most sense.

[oatmeal69]

How goes the cycle man......Is your gear legit? did you get it from a site, personal source, or did u brew your own?

Yes, it kicked in full force last week. I got it from a site based on a recommendation.

[oatmeal69]

So, I'm almost 1/2 way through, here are some pix from this morning.

[oatmeal69]

Sigh...
Looking at my pix, I think about how much I've trained and learned over the years, and how little I really have to show for it. How simple it is for other people to make huge exponential gains I can only dream about with a quarter of the work, diet and dedication I put in. Being an ectomorph skinny-fat runt really sucks!
But, I can also say that I'm 15 pounds heavier and probably leaner as well over what I was 8 years ago when I started getting serious. I'm about 30 pounds heavier, and just as lean as I was when I graduated high school 25 years ago (I was 135 # then). Guess I'll just keep lifting.

[< <Samson> >]

Don't get depressed, I'm not far off. I feel the same way quite a bit. Seeing guys looking straight jacked and they're almost a decade younger.

Genetics are a total bitch, but this is what we have to work with - I guess.

I feel half decent now, I think I'm where a natural hardly working out guy should be. The fvcking difference is, I kill myself at the gym and my diet consists of shit that hardly resembles food. I just can't afford to live off fish and quality meats.


Life huh, it's the same for everything else. Seeing some douchepyle driving around in a brand new Benz, while I'm barely able to pay for my bills isn't much different.



My 2 Cents, carry on. . . . .



In your Avi you look pretty solid BTW.

[oatmeal69]

Don't get depressed, I'm not far off. I feel the same way quite a bit. Seeing guys looking straight jacked and they're almost a decade younger.

Yeah, I'm told that many guys - even the ones who are legitimately jacked get moody about their physique. When I put it into further perspective, I'm in the best shape of my life, and compared to society at large, I'm a fitness model.

Genetics are a total bitch, but this is what we have to work with - I guess.

Yep, and that's the rub. It's why I turned to AAS in the first place. Even with AAS, I still have to adjust my expectations for my genetics.

I feel half decent now, I think I'm where a natural hardly working out guy should be. The fvcking difference is, I kill myself at the gym and my diet consists of shit that hardly resembles food. I just can't afford to live off fish and quality meats.

I know, GBrice and I have had that conversation - I don't need perfection or hulk body, I just want to LOOK like I work out. I will say though, I've become really creative and economical with my diet. I don't know how you are with spicy food, but I posted a green chili recipe that's almost zero fat. I also eat regular chili made with high grade ground turkey. If you haven't checked out SlimmerMe's pancakes/waffles, try those too, they totally keep me sane.
I've foregone fish for chicken - Fish is great, but it's too expensive, and chicken breasts are packed with protein with low fat penalty too. Use Stubb's, that stuff is magic!

Life huh, it's the same for everything else. Seeing some douchepyle driving around in a brand new Benz, while I'm barely able to pay for my bills isn't much different.

Join the club. I'm as broke now as I was in my early 20's. I've almost given up looking for gainful employment, I think I'm going to enroll in EMT school soon.

In your Avi you look pretty solid BTW.

Thanks. That was the end of my last cycle 1 year ago. I think I'm actually a tad leaner now, and I seem to have kept the muscle. I have 5 weeks left on this cycle, let's hope for some new lean growth.

[< <Samson> >]

I actually have more cash now then ever before. But, I have a kid and get to take care of 2 more. My gf has no job and I need to find creative ways to generate cash. It's hard as fvck, no joke.

But, that is a fact. I'm also in best shape I have ever been in. And I'm older. . . .

Also that is such a fact, compare me to the general male population and I am Mr. Olympia.


Just gotta be happy with the cards we get handed, I suppose.

One of my friends is going through a tough time with some shit right now and all he ever says is some day he wishes he gets to my shape. . . First time he said it, I was like "huh" really? WTF?

He's coming down from 300 pounds, down to the low 220's now.

[oatmeal69]

Will be upping my dose of Tren-A to 438 mG/wk. from 350 Mg/wk. for the duration of my cycle, starting tomorrow. Sides thus far are greatly reduced over my last cycle at similar (350 Mg/wk) doses. Following Atomini's advice of less test and let the tren do the work. Also, shorter length cycles.

[< <Samson> >]

I'd like to up my dose just bit, maybe just to like 500mg even on the tren.

But, I don't have any more on hand. Specially since these vials are underfilled like mother fvcker.

[oatmeal69]

I've gained about 8 pounds since starting. I don't feel much if any of that is in fat either. I'm considering using the last two weeks of my cycle as a cut-phase. I would be hoping to retain muscle while I reduced calories and upped the cardio a bit. I have very little success in keeping muscle while I cut naturally.

[OnTheSauce]

cutting naturally sucks. Do it with juice

[oatmeal69]

Never tried it, but I've read it will preserve your muscle while you cut. Is it really amazing or just kinda helps?
If you look at my pics on beginning this cycle you'll see why I'm interested. I can't seem to keep ANY muscle on me while I cut.

[ChiveOn]

I'm starting a similar cycle in a month. Bit higher dosin with mast and T3. But I've been following your thread to see what I should expect with my first go at tren.
Cutting naturally sucks, I'm at 12% bf trying to get to 10 before I start, but I feel like I look flat and less defined because of the calorie deficit. So I'm looking forward to cutting with the AAS

[oatmeal69]

Yeah, I felt flat as a pancake when I started. I lose so much muscle when cutting naturally, I'm wondering if I ought to do it now, while on cycle.
If I were you I would start just with tren and test. the efficacy of tren cannot be overstated, it is hands down the most powerful AAS. I wouldn't add mast or anything else into the mix yet. Read Atomini's thread, I think you'll agree.

[oatmeal69]

Noticed just a touch of acne on my chest. WOndering if I ought to start with Tamox in addition to my Anastrozole protocol. I'm worried that if I start taking Tamox now, if it will still be effective for PCT since I'd essentially be doing my PCT protocol now.

[oatmeal69]

3 weeks to go.

[oatmeal69]

Wish I knew how to take better pictures. For some reason I can't capture any shadows or cuts on my frame. My pix make me look a lot flatter and smoother than what I see in real life. Maybe try shooting some outside?

[< <Samson> >]

How's the Tren? How much r u on now?

[oatmeal69]

Still 125mL E3D. Everything is running great, sides are minimal - night sweats and some aggression, but that's it. There REALLY is something to using Test as a maintenance and letting the Tren do all the work. Practically scaring myself at my strength gains. Just wish I could put on more mass to show for it. I am slowly losing fat too.
I know all of it won't last, but I'm really going to try to keep my intensity dialed up through PCT.

[ma_fighter]

Wish I knew how to take better pictures. For some reason I can't capture any shadows or cuts on my frame. My pix make me look a lot flatter and smoother than what I see in real life. Maybe try shooting some outside?

Its all in the lighting mate!
If you're standing almost directly underneath a lightbulb, you'll get nice hard shadows under your pecs and abs, and any other protruding parts.

You alwasy want the light to come from some kind of angle, be it the top or the side, but never from directly in front, cause that'll just eliminate all the shadows, and flatten you out

[oatmeal69]

... never from directly in front, cause that'll just eliminate all the shadows, and flatten you out

That's exactly what I'm doing... There are 5 bulbs over my mirror directly in front, and two off to the side.

No wonder I look better @ the gym, there are those white metal-halide lamps way overhead.

[ma_fighter]

You create depth with shadows, and dark parts.
Same thing when youre drawing/painting, but you have to play around with the lighting instead of colors when taking pictures

[oatmeal69]

2 weeks till end. I guess I just SUCK at taking pictures. This is the best I can get.

[oatmeal69]

I also HATE that I'm about to go off cycle and basically lose the tiny little gains I've made. I like to fool myself and say I can keep up the training and diet... But without AAS, my body isn't designed to keep it.

[< <Samson> >]

I also HATE that I'm about to go off cycle and basically lose the tiny little gains I've made. I like to fool myself and say I can keep up the training and diet... But without AAS, my body isn't designed to keep it.

This is my current exact thought.

I really don't want to stay on for life(TRT or whatever else we want to call it).

But, I am ready for a crash landing. I don't want to see these hard as hell to get gains slip away.


Yet there are positives to coming off. This damn acne should clear up and the QD shots are getting old quick.


Good luck man, we all need it.

[oatmeal69]

I'm not gonna give up though. I'm pretty much going to just keep doing what I'm doing. Same diet, same workout and try to keep my gains, while slowly shedding more fat. I know I'll lose some, but I ain't giving up!

[bringndaheat]

Bump

[oatmeal69]

Today is my last injection of both Test and Tren. Got some better pix @ the gym on Friday.

[oatmeal69]

This cycle has been a total success according to my original goals, which was a re-comp. I had leaned up just prior to the cycle by dropping 18 pounds. I feel I've dropped even more BF while regaining 10 pounds of LBM.

My guess is that I'm somewhere between 12% - 14% BF

I'm disappointed with my chest, especially since I tried to bring my most intense game face to those workouts. Every chest workout left me sore and tired for days after. I believe it's a genetics limitation at this point. Still not happy with my biceps either, but they did at least grow. I don't feel my chest changed much at all.

I'm deathly afraid of what I'm going to lose for the next 3 months through PCT, etc. I plan to continue training as I have been on this cycle, and my diet will change very little. I will monitor calories and may increase a bit as long as I don't see too much fat coming back.

I will keep up with this log as I do PCT, etc. Hopefully, pending blood work after PCT, I can get back on cycle in September some time.

[oatmeal69]

I'm in week two of PCT. Thus far, I've managed to keep much of where I was at the end of cycle. I don't feel as "pumped" all the time, I've lost a couple pounds and a little bit of size. My body composition doesn't seem to have changed though. I'm still about where I was in terms of lean-ess and muscularity. My strength seems to be staying as well. I lost a little on my bench yesterday, but other lifts seem steady. My intensity has dropped somewhat.
From about a week after the end of my cycle until a couple days into PCT, I experienced some fairly significant emotional surge. I felt like crying sometimes, and very angry and anxious others. I can say I'm in an extremely difficult time personally, and that contributed a lot, I'm sure. Still, I think no testosterone, and a likely E2 imbalance contributed immensely. I feel I'm doing better on that front now that I'm fully into PCT.

I have increased my calories a bit, mostly in the form of an extra cheat-meal here and there, but for the most part am sticking pretty close to my diet. I'd rather keep or add a little fat than lose the muscle I've worked for.

[oatmeal69]

I've lost about 8-10 pounds since my cycle ended, I'm now at about 164#
My appetite is also diminished, but I am trying to maintain about what I was eating on cycle.
I don't feel like I'm losing strength, but do have a little less drive in the gym. I haven't noticed any real size loss or change in the mirror, leading me to believe that whatever I'm losing, must be coming off muscles and fat equally. Could it just be water?

[< <Samson> >]

Keep at it bro

It is a struggle for all of us, but it sure does come easier to some than others.


I see guys with 8 packs looking straight sfhredded and ask, WTF do you eat? I see how you train - Well, I just eat mostly clean but I still slack.

Fvcking fvck that shit, for me to look like I do now took a shit ton of discipline and work. . . . Genetics<Can't beat em'


But, I'm still happy where my body is settling at(well, for the most part).

[Back In Black]

Where do you think your bf is at right now Oatmeal?

[oatmeal69]

Keep at it bro

It is a struggle for all of us, but it sure does come easier to some than others. I see guys with 8 packs looking straight sfhredded and ask, WTF do you eat? I see how you train - Well, I just eat mostly clean but I still slack. Fvcking fvck that shit, for me to look like I do now took a shit ton of discipline and work. . . . Genetics<Can't beat em' But, I'm still happy where my body is settling at(well, for the most part).

Definitely. I wanna be ripped up too, but not lose any muscle! Prior to now, I always used PCT and it's loss of appetite as a time to lean up. This is the first PCT where I've not tried to lean out after my cycle. (Not like I have a ton of experience, this was only cycle 4)
I've been reading on PCT. It's much harder to build muscle than to drop fat. So, I'm okay with not being super ripped for the next couple months in order to preserve as much muscle as I can. I might think about a lean - up before a future cycle this Fall, but that is a ways off, and I'm having a lot of changes in life, so I don't even know if I'll be able to make it happen. For now, my best bet is to work at keeping what I have, and then staying trim after PCT.

Right now, eating enough is the hardest thing, and that's rarely been a problem in my life.

[oatmeal69]

Where do you think your bf is at right now Oatmeal?

Using that pic that goes around the site really helps, but it's still really hard to narrow it to a single digit. I'm gonna say 12-13%. (?) But to be more precise, I'm somewhere between 10 and 15% LOL
My Avatar was taken about a month ago, I'm about 8 pounds lighter now. what do you think?

[< <Samson> >]

My formula for cycle to pct to post pct is: Cycle, run PCT(4 weeks usually depending on cycle), come off PCT for 6 weeks, after these 6 weeks have at it. Lose some weight and lean up for your next cycle.

Seems to have worked for me. Since I started taking bicycle rides(over a year and a half total), I have gained 20+ pounds of LBM. As I progress it seems harder and harder, just like with everything else our body tends to plateau wherever it chooses.


So this brings mr back to the question of how big can I get and still keep it post PCT. there is just no way to find out until you do it.

200+ pounds is damn decent in my opinion, but it is 100% diet dependent. If I don't eat, I will shrink very fast, I know it.

Either way, looks like the cycle did you some good man. The tren does seem to poses some serious results.

I will be running another one of these for next summer. Now, I'm thinking at a slightly lower dose but much stricter diet. The addition of mast seems to have helped a bit also.

[oatmeal69]

My formula for cycle to pct to post pct is: Cycle, run PCT(4 weeks usually depending on cycle), come off PCT for 6 weeks, after these 6 weeks have at it. Lose some weight and lean up for your next cycle.

I'm going with the standard Cycle + PCT = time off. Either way, both methods are pretty close. Bloodwork is the only way to know. I will get one after PCT, or maybe a bit longer. I'm cheap though, I didn't do one post cycle or pre cycle this time.

So this brings mr back to the question of how big can I get and still keep it post PCT. there is just no way to find out until you do it. 200+ pounds is damn decent in my opinion, but it is 100% diet dependent. If I don't eat, I will shrink very fast, I know it.

Yeah, I think it's a rollercoaster. You may keep much of your strength and actual muscle fiber, but you lose the swell, and the anabolic pump.

Either way, looks like the cycle did you some good man. The tren does seem to poses some serious results.

Thanks. Tren is way more effective than Test alone.

[Java Man]

Interesting read. I always enjoy reading other peoples experiences. Thanks, Oatmeal!

[< <Samson> >]

Agreed for sure on all


The pump is gone, just the way it is. Even on TrT type dosage you feel nothing like running real juice.