Lowering Blood Pressure

[< <Samson> >]

I am in the midst of running a low dose Tren E Cycle and my BP seriously increased by 10+ points(Systolic). I am only running 60mg Every 3rd Day - along with 700mg of test & a little mast to spice shit up.


So far, I am on 5mg 2x of Cialis daily, 1-3 81mg aspirins per day, Hawthorn Berry 2x a day & garlic extract - I am dropping my alcohol for sure, it def couldn't be helping. Dropped my morning 12.5mg of Ephedra(still drinking a cup of coffee in the AM). I try to squeeze in one cup of oats a day along with nothing but Izekial bread as far as bread like carbs.



I just did my CDL Physical again & just like I read at home, I am right around 150/80+


Before the trenny tren I was right at 140/80 give or take a few points



I still also follow the "lowering cholesterol protocol" - Red Yeast & Niacin Daily



Anything I'm missing here? < Aside from being a "normal" person, do no juice & not weigh over 212 Lbs

[Mr.BB]

Hows your hematocrit?

[< <Samson> >]

Hows your hematocrit?

A ok - I donate every 3-4 months, have been doing 3 months flat for the last year since I am running gear constantly - My RedCross loves me, lol


RBC is great also, haven't checked the cholesterol since before I started the tren train


Forgot to add cOq10 to my supplement list

[Mr.BB]

If its not something related to H&H or e2, you probably need BP meds, something like an ACE inhibitor (angiotensin converting enzyme), if you constantly have over 150/80.

Do you have this BP at all times?

When I go to doc or donate they usually measure me higher, but I keep an android app that works as a cardio journal, where I take note of my BP daily. Sometime stress situations can elevate BP for a bit of time.

[DocToxin8]

You need to measure the BP at home,
both when you wake up and when you go to bed.
If you use stims it follows that BP might increase during the day.
Going around with 150/80 all day that's not great either, (diastolic not that bad though), but more important is to measure you don't go to sleep with that BP.
(And if it's ok first thing upon waking it probably goes down to acceptable levels during the day when you relax too)

But yeah, I think you might benefit from an ACE inhibitor. I use ramipril and I have lower BP than that most of the time (without meds).
Last time I measured I was very close to 120/80, and this was during a stressful period. I can only surmise it was the ramipril and cialis that did it.

So while I probably don't even need ramipril much of the time, I use it for the following reason: so maybe my BP is 130/75 or or something when just cruising. But I know it has gotten to 150/90 and even 160/100 during blasts before. (160/100 was with absolutely no estrogen control and on hgh and tren, these days I use an AI which lowers BP a lot)
But I can still get too high BP just on cycle, and ramipril really has so few drawbacks in me I just use it. I don't know if the side effect of increased insulin sensitivity is really noticeable for BBs using ACE inhibitors, but I have never needed more insulin. (To clarify ACE inhibitors have some "beneficial side effects" like increase insulin sensitivity, inhibit cardiac remodeling, and one I don't remember, but how well proven it is that these PPAR mediated effects are really more than just experimental results I don't know)
But I'm drifting.

Point I was trying to make, is that in my view,
BP is better kept in check, and Ang2 affecting agents have such a safety profile that id say they're life prolonging in almost every man with a BP over 120/80.

But I'm biased.
F.ex using NSAIDs and ACE inhibitors are not a good mix for your kidneys.
1 baby aspirin at 100mg per day or so, just to hinder clots (and also prevent migraine), is safe, but painkiller dosages over time, not so.

[Deal Me In]

140/80 is now considered prehypertensive and a doctor will probably put you on BP meds. As doctoxin said, there is really no drawback to being on them and they call high BP the silent killer for a reason. Make an appointment and get it taken care of. No reason not too and every reason to do it.

[< <Samson> >]

Fuckd part is that before the juice it was 120-130/70


When I am off the tren it stays in the high 130's / high 70's




Me going to my MD never comes out in my favor - Last time I went, soooo - how long have you been on steroids? Ummmm, never - wtf - Ahhh, I see. . . . I try to go only when it's an emergency or it's something that I can not get done or answered on my own.





I can get script meds all day on my own. How would I dose the Altace? I have no clue on this so far - I have just been using non script type remedies.

[AR's King Silabolin]

Diett?...sodium/potassium ratio. Enough water?

Looked into selery?

NOs lower bp.

Even better. Beetlejuice.

James Tiny West suggests 12 g arginine before workouts to lower bp.

Plenty of stuff u could do.

[DocToxin8]

They have lowered the criteria for when they prescribe BP meds,
so it shouldn't be hard to get.
When using ramipril for instance you'd start with 2,5mg 1x daily to assess tolerance. (In weird instances people get some strange reactions, id read up on that so you know, but you really shouldn't get any sides, if you do then quit)
Fairly quickly one can jump up to 10mg a day.
One can probably just jump up to 5mg daily to begin with,
stay on that for a week, see if it's enough to reduce BP,
If not go up to 10mg the next week.
(No additional benefit after 10mg ED)

With this medication chances of overdosing and lowering BP too much is very unlikely, so while it's ofcourse something you should do with you doctor,
then yeah. Come to think of it, when I got it prescribed it was just "here's a box of 100 5mgs, start at 2,5mg and go from there" and really no supervision after that.

But read up on it, there are some interactions (notably NSAIDs), and some alterations in the secretion of salt. (Less K+, potassium is secreted, compared to Na+, and some diuretics should also not be used)

As I've said, the only side effect I've heard about that seems to actually happen is dry cough in some (usually elderly). But that can be enough of a nuisance to switch to Ang2 antagonists.
Only "problem" with stuff like ramipril is that it's pretty mild.
It can't lower your BP tremendously. But it should be enough.
This "problem" also makes it quite safe to use however.

[Sh0tsf1red]

I've heard getting on a regular blood donation schedule helps but i would look for more info on that, just something i remember reading...

[< <Samson> >]

Well, we'll see where I get to on my own. I did read up on it, sides sound similar to Metformin - which I did not do well at all.

It seems to b steadily dropping from day to day. I am in the low 140's consistently now. But, still it's a bit higher than I'd like.

I guess it's time to cut the BS a bit & focus on my long term health instead. Pushing damn near 215 pounds can't b helping either coming from 175 in 5 years.

[Grappler13]

I am in the midst of running a low dose Tren E Cycle and my BP seriously increased by 10+ points(Systolic). I am only running 60mg Every 3rd Day - along with 700mg of test & a little mast to spice shit up.


So far, I am on 5mg 2x of Cialis daily, 1-3 81mg aspirins per day, Hawthorn Berry 2x a day & garlic extract - I am dropping my alcohol for sure, it def couldn't be helping. Dropped my morning 12.5mg of Ephedra(still drinking a cup of coffee in the AM). I try to squeeze in one cup of oats a day along with nothing but Izekial bread as far as bread like carbs.



I just did my CDL Physical again & just like I read at home, I am right around 150/80+


Before the trenny tren I was right at 140/80 give or take a few points



I still also follow the "lowering cholesterol protocol" - Red Yeast & Niacin Daily



Anything I'm missing here? < Aside from being a "normal" person, do no juice & not weigh over 212 Lbs

I need a stickie for this: blend 5 stalks of celery with 12 ounces of water in your blender until it's a slurry and drink it. It works. It works not because it's witchcraft but because the insoluble fiber cleans your lower intestines and colon and makes your body more efficient but the celery also contains phthalates which smooth the blood vessels. Try it; it can't hurt. If your hematocrit is high and your face is all red and you still feel puffy, donate blood.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[charger69]

You have heard alot of advice. I am going to offer something additional' but you have to work for it.
Forget about the meds, you can do this naturally. I was the same situation . Almost 140/80+ and 230 pounds. I went on a strict diet and cardio 2 x per day. Got down to 165 lbs and 118/70 in nine months. It was my first bodybuilding competition and all natural.
All of this because the Dr. Threatened me that I had two options..... Do it naturally by increasing my exercise or take a pilll everyday the rest of my life. My point is, with all my respect to the vets, try to do it naturally. You can do it.
IMO the bp is often overlooked when taking AAS. People have no sides.. Start by looking at BP.

[Couchlock]

Bump, good advice

[< <Samson> >]

Umm, I have zero interest in being 165 - again

I worked hard to get where I am - and would like to keep it this way(actually working on getting bigger atm). I am 215 & about 12% bf

sooooo


Naturally and I don't really go in the same sentence

[< <Samson> >]

I need a stickie for this: blend 5 stalks of celery with 12 ounces of water in your blender until it's a slurry and drink it. It works. It works not because it's witchcraft but because the insoluble fiber cleans your lower intestines and colon and makes your body more efficient but the celery also contains phthalates which smooth the blood vessels. Try it; it can't hurt. If your hematocrit is high and your face is all red and you still feel puffy, donate blood.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Currently looking into this & beet juice(that was also mentioned above)


I think I will be starting my own lowering BP experiment here in the next day or so.


So far this is what I got:

Dark Chocolate

Celery Mix Drink

Beet Juice

Hawthorn Berry Extract(which u already take)

Cialis 5mg 2x daily

81mg Asprin(2-3x a day, I suppose)

Along with - red yeast rice daily

[Couchlock]

Currently looking into this & beet juice(that was also mentioned above)

I think I will be starting my own lowering BP experiment here in the next day or so.

So far this is what I got:

Dark Chocolate

Celery Mix Drink

Beet Juice

Hawthorn Berry Extract(which u already take)

Cialis 5mg 2x daily

81mg Asprin(2-3x a day, I suppose)

Along with - red yeast rice daily

I use undutched coco powder (5g) 2 celery sticks, 2 tablespoons apple cider vinegar, and 1/4 tsp cayenne pepper morning wake up shake

[< <Samson> >]

Question - which I suppose I can create my own answer to, but still

What about using sildenafil to drop BP? The half life is 4 hours, which would equal 3x a day dosing.

I am just brainstorming different ideas. . . . .On 25mg now, hour & a half into dosing resting BP is right under 130/75


But, from what I figure - it's just not stable enough for daily use.

[DocToxin8]

Well, we'll see where I get to on my own. I did read up on it, sides sound similar to Metformin - which I did not do well at all.

It seems to b steadily dropping from day to day. I am in the low 140's consistently now. But, still it's a bit higher than I'd like.

I guess it's time to cut the BS a bit & focus on my long term health instead. Pushing damn near 215 pounds can't b helping either coming from 175 in 5 years.

As other have said, doing it natural can be tried.
Never tried the celery stick thing,
but just manipulating your salt intake (high in Kalium and magnesium, lower in natrium) can accomplish much.

As for the sides of ramipril compared to metformin, don't think so,
I've heard the metformin sides (had a GF who used it), was mostly GI distress.
And often so bad you must quit the medication.
I've yet to hear about anyone needing to quit ramipril.
Had a friend who wasn't good a going to the doctor,
he knew that he had hypertension when using gear, and he used gear the time,
but he usually didn't have a script for ramipril so he could suddenly go a month or two without. Then he'd complain me about the hypertension and I'd give him a months supply (at 5mg) until he came to his doctor. Which he never did, just asked for more once he'd be empty for a week.
Point is,
irresponsible as he was, he jumped back and forth 5mg ramipril daily and I asked him if he noticed any side effects, being one month and of the other.
None that he could see.

So look into it, it is a generally we'll tolerated compound.
I know some prefer Ang2 antagonists and say they don't have the "dry cough" side effect that some gets. But ACE inhibitors have been (if not is) first line treatment for moderate hypertension.

If you manage to do it naturally all the bettter,
but you probably have to do it both naturally and medicated.



As you can see here ACE inhibitors affect more than just BP, but also fibrinolysys, that can be altered in hypertension
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubme...604482/related

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubme...214151/related


T and AT2 receptor (type 2, autorceotors

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubme...ngiotensin%202

[Red Bastard]

I'm on an ACE (ramipril), and a calcium channel blocker.
Brought me from 160/100, to an average of 135/75.
Recently started juicing. Beet celery apple cucumber. Adding carrots and lemon, for the flavor. Ginger is recommended, but I've yet to try it.
Gotta say, this mild skeptic is impressed. My lowest readings are always after a juice. 129/68, is frequently my reading then...

[< <Samson> >]

No Ace inhibitor as of yet

But, I am running the rest of this holistic crap. Lol - it def works & works quite well

Been, a almost a week now - beet juice in the AM blended with celery. A tad of gross & bitter dark chocolate once or twice a day. Along with my usual 5mg x2 of Cialis per day + a few 81mg aspirins, hawthorn berry, Red Yeast Rice & Niacin. . . I am sitting at a BP of right around 140/80 - this is still while running this evil Tren Enan

Best recorded is about an 45 mins to an hour after my juice cocktail at about 135+/70+

Not too bad IMO so far

Next I will be adding Arginine at about 3-6 grams a day

[< <Samson> >]

I'm on an ACE (ramipril).

Any notable sides from it all? Also, what dose are you taking?

[MToption2]

Other blood pressure/lipid improving supplements:

Astaxanthin: Click "See All 4 Studies" under the Human Effect Matrix section
https://examine.com/supplements/astaxanthin/

Sulforaphane: Cheap broccoli sprout extract, take with mustard seed extract for myrosinase (enzyme needed to bioactivate sulforaphane)
https://examine.com/supplements/sulforaphane/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4692095/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4637098/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3405367/

[< <Samson> >]

Other blood pressure/lipid improving supplements:

Astaxanthin: Click "See All 4 Studies" under the Human Effect Matrix section
https://examine.com/supplements/astaxanthin/

Sulforaphane: Cheap broccoli sprout extract, take with mustard seed extract for myrosinase (enzyme needed to bioactivate sulforaphane)
https://examine.com/supplements/sulforaphane/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4692095/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4637098/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3405367/

I will def look into these

[MToption2]

I will def look into these

More on Broccoli Sprout powder:
Pretty weak in this study imo
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4060758/
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/art...0758/table/T1/
--
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21559038
--

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...32QEVO3GI&th=1

I emailed Bulksupplements for confirmation whether their powder was really derived from sprouts or mature broccoli. They replied back saying they'll have to contact their supplier. Waiting on that.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...A2PAEHJHEG7BSZ

Mustard is a good source for the much needed myrosinase enzyme to convert the precursor glucoraphanin into the isothiocynate sulforaphane. Once broccoli has matured, the amount of glucoraphanin is 100x less than when sprouted earlier. And once broccoli is cooked, myrosinase is destroyed. Double whamy. It's not crazy to assume broccoli powder has gone through some sort of adverse processing.

Update: Bulksupplements informed me that they are using mature broccoli. That is unfortunate.

[NACH3]

Question - which I suppose I can create my own answer to, but still

What about using sildenafil to drop BP? The half life is 4 hours, which would equal 3x a day dosing.

I am just brainstorming different ideas. . . . .On 25mg now, hour & a half into dosing resting BP is right under 130/75


But, from what I figure - it's just not stable enough for daily use.

We take all the same supps for BP the holistic way but in Tren I realized I need to run either ramipril or altace as well... both are very tolerable And as safe as they come... I've been reading up on these BP meds like ed now ordered some and waiting!

Should be fine just make sure they don't cross with any prescription meds(opiates which I know your not on but benzos is another)...

[Couchlock]

Celery, veggie juice, cayenne pepper, apple cider vinegar, lemon juice, un-dutched coco smoothy in AM

[< <Samson> >]

Celery, veggie juice, cayenne pepper, apple cider vinegar, lemon juice, un-dutched coco smoothy in AM

Those are amazing numbers sir!

[< <Samson> >]

Should be fine just make sure they don't cross with any prescription meds(opiates which I know your not on but benzos is another)...

Hmmm, I use Xanax for sleep - sometimes

Didn't see any opiate interaction yet < edit, I meant Benzodiazepine

[ScotchGuard02]

Celery, veggie juice, cayenne pepper, apple cider vinegar, lemon juice, un-dutched coco smoothy in AM

Hey, posting your mother's BP numbers don't count. LOL

These numbers are through out the day or after you take your juice cocktail?

[< <Samson> >]

Shit, checked mine a good 5x today. After my juice cocktail I am sitting at like 150/90 - fvcking stressed to shit. . . Funny on how much stress has a direct effect on it.

[Mr.BB]

Shit, checked mine a good 5x today. After my juice cocktail I am sitting at like 150/90 - fvcking stressed to shit. . . Funny on how much stress has a direct effect on it.

Yes. Stress affects BP quite a lot.

At the end of the day, although the juices and plants are great for you, if your BP average is that 150/90 you should get a doctor prescribe you BP meds.

If you only get that high BP with stress, when you get home it lowers to around 130/80, you probably dont need it.

How much is it when you wake up in the morning?

[MToption2]

Shit, checked mine a good 5x today. After my juice cocktail I am sitting at like 150/90 - fvcking stressed to shit. . . Funny on how much stress has a direct effect on it.

I don't know if you are including these...

Spirulina: https://examine.com/supplements/Spirulina/

Fish Oil: https://examine.com/supplements/Fish+Oil/

Magnesium: https://examine.com/supplements/Magnesium/

Olive Leaf Extract: https://examine.com/supplements/Olive+leaf+extract/

How much is it when you wake up in the morning?

I second this. What is it shortly after cup of coffee? Or are you drinking your BP veg shake along with it?

[< <Samson> >]

I will check it right after I get up tomorrow. Right now I check it an hour after getting up & running through my day's paperwork(stress x10).

[NACH3]

Hmmm, I use Xanax for sleep - sometimes

Didn't see any opiate interaction yet

They have me On old school klonipin due to seizures I've gotten but I know it was directly related to the amount of adderral I was prescribed - dropped that and so did my numbers... Tren is usually harsh on my BP more than any other compound - especially Ace!
Mmmmm

[< <Samson> >]

I am finally off all meds(drugs), no stims & no downers - aside from .5mg Xanax for sleep if I have anxiety

I'm on tren E - this is the shit that's doing this to my BP. Before I got on, my BP was damn near 10 points lower across the board. I'm almost done with the Tren E - but, damn the results are solid.

[TRA]

Hit you with a pm. How's the bp doing?

[Couchlock]

Hey, posting your mother's BP numbers don't count. LOL

These numbers are through out the day or after you take your juice cocktail?

Throughout the day, usually by 7pm I have easily 800-950mg of caffeine in me, plus a few mg of Higenamine in me as well

[NACH3]

I am finally off all meds(drugs), no stims & no downers - aside from .5mg Xanax for sleep if I have anxiety

[I][B]I'm on tren E - this is the shit that's doing this to my BP. Before I got on, my BP was damn near 10 points lower across the board. I'm almost done with the Tren E - but, damn the results are [B]solid.

I definitely hear that! Truly an amazing compound lol...

I too, am off everything except the damn clonezapam and that's due to how long I've been on it and what happens now if I try and stop it it can throw me right into a seizure - but mine was a solid 165/75 b4 this lil blast

[Lemonada8]

wow looks like lotta good info was given ( w/ a quick scan ) good job guys