What are the best hepatic protectors ????

[GearHeaded]

I respectfully disagree. I used to get bloods frequently and liver values would be out of range.
This last time I took small dosage of Halo for three weeks . 7 weeks later my liver values were still slightly out. Out enough for the Dr to want a repeat test. I was taking NAC and TUDCA both on and after cycle.

NOTE: I was told not to take milk thistle while cycling, it interfered with the AAS.

if you were taking one of the most liver toxic compounds out there, halo, and your liver values were only slightly out of range . then that actually proves my point that AAS is not that liver toxic.. heck just being in a calorie deficit and training hard in the gym, or one night of binge drinking, will significantly raise liver values.

95% of the AAS out there is not really posing any sort of significant liver issues . if they did, then all of us juice heads and bodybuilders over the years would be suffering from liver problems . but none of us do. heck back in the 80s guys used to pop 200mg a dbol a day. they are still around and kicking just fine with no liver issues

plenty of people who do not use AAS or never have used AAS are walking around with elevated liver enzymes


thats not to downplay the fact that abusing some liver toxic oral steroids can definitely negatively impact liver health. its just the overall idea that steroids in general are bad for your liver , just not true (some steroids are actually prescribed to help treat liver disease, like Var)

[i_SLAM_cougars]

if you were taking one of the most liver toxic compounds out there, halo, and your liver values were only slightly out of range . then that actually proves my point that AAS is not that liver toxic.. heck just being in a calorie deficit and training hard in the gym, or one night of binge drinking, will significantly raise liver values.

95% of the AAS out there is not really posing any sort of significant liver issues . if they did, then all of us juice heads and bodybuilders over the years would be suffering from liver problems . but none of us do. heck back in the 80s guys used to pop 200mg a dbol a day. they are still around and kicking just fine with no liver issues

plenty of people who do not use AAS or never have used AAS are walking around with elevated liver enzymes


thats not to downplay the fact that abusing some liver toxic oral steroids can definitely negatively impact liver health. its just the overall idea that steroids in general are bad for your liver , just not true (some steroids are actually prescribed to help treat liver disease, like Var)

I would actually like to see what the real world toxicity of steroids compares too. I’ve always known it was over hyped, but people demonize orals, and I think it’s uncalled for. I love oral. If you want IMMEDIATE results, throwing in most orals provides that. How can you not appreciate that?

and this 200mg of dbol thing... sounds like a challenge. A challenge accepted...

[GearHeaded]

I would actually like to see what the real world toxicity of steroids compares too. I’ve always known it was over hyped, but people demonize orals, and I think it’s uncalled for. I love oral. If you want IMMEDIATE results, throwing in most orals provides that. How can you not appreciate that?

and this 200mg of dbol thing... sounds like a challenge. A challenge accepted...

agree with you on the orals . especially in compound rotation and phase cycling protocols , its very easy to rotate compounds when orals are involved. its very easy to add synergy to a certain stack with orals.

heck even off cycle cruising.. when I ran a no test based cruise this summer , it was very convenient just to throw some Dbol in to get the estrogen I needed.
orals are a super useful tool imo

[i_SLAM_cougars]

agree with you on the orals . especially in compound rotation and phase cycling protocols , its very easy to rotate compounds when orals are involved. its very easy to add synergy to a certain stack with orals.

I don’t think there’s any other way to cycle. It seemed a little complicated until you broke it down for me, but I can’t really fathom running a traditional cycle now, unless I’m just bridging cycles... which still makes makes it not a traditional cycle anyway.

[charger69]

if you were taking one of the most liver toxic compounds out there, halo, and your liver values were only slightly out of range . then that actually proves my point that AAS is not that liver toxic.. heck just being in a calorie deficit and training hard in the gym, or one night of binge drinking, will significantly raise liver values.

95% of the AAS out there is not really posing any sort of significant liver issues . if they did, then all of us juice heads and bodybuilders over the years would be suffering from liver problems . but none of us do. heck back in the 80s guys used to pop 200mg a dbol a day. they are still around and kicking just fine with no liver issues

plenty of people who do not use AAS or never have used AAS are walking around with elevated liver enzymes


thats not to downplay the fact that abusing some liver toxic oral steroids can definitely negatively impact liver health. its just the overall idea that steroids in general are bad for your liver , just not true (some steroids are actually prescribed to help treat liver disease, like Var)

That was slightly out after 7 weeks of discontinued use. IE. Almost 2 months of being clean and taking TUDCA and NAC and it still was out.
The previous time I had bloods at 4 weeks and they the values were terrible.
I know that HALO is one of the harshest, but still that’s a long ass time.


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[GearHeaded]

That was slightly out after 7 weeks of discontinued use. IE. Almost 2 months of being clean and taking TUDCA and NAC and it still was out.
The previous time I had bloods at 4 weeks and they the values were terrible.
I know that HALO is one of the harshest, but still that’s a long ass time.

if it was this long after the fact, this would actually lead me to believe your liver enzyme elevation was not due to the Halo at all , but something else going on.
the way liver enzyme elevation generally works is from the stress of detoxifying a hepatoxic compound while that compound is active. so for example, take 200mg of Dbol and 500mg of Tylenol and then go get blood work 6 hours later and enzyme levels are likely going to be way elevated. but wait until those things clear and get blood work done 7 days later, and enzymes levels are likely going to be just fine.

enzymes elevate during the detoxifying process. if your 7 weeks removed from using Halo, and your liver is no longer detoxifying it, then liver enzymes should be in normal range . unless your liver is dealing with something else it was detoxifying at the time of the blood work .. like alcohol, like McDonalds, like some other OTC medicine . or it could of simply been that you did not take a week off from heavy training before the blood work and the blood work showed a false positive (the blood work can't distinguish enzymes that are coming from the liver or from breaking down of muscle tissue)

being that far removed from Halo use, I doubt it was the Halo that caused the elevation in enzymes.. plenty of people that don't ever touch AAS and drink beer on the weekends or eat fast food every day or just take Tylenol for pain or other OTC meds , or script meds (like some BP meds) , are walking around with elevated liver enzymes.

again its the detoxification process itself that elevates enzymes . your body was done doing that 7 weeks prior. which is why I would venture to say that something else was causing the elevation of livers enzymes at the time of the blood work. .
now there is no doubt had you got blood work done with Halo active and in your system enzymes would likely be elevated (because the liver would actively be detoxifying it and breaking the halo down)

[i_SLAM_cougars]

You guys ever use Cheque drops? I only ask cause Gear mentioned them. I didn’t even think they existed anymore. I doubt they have any use for muscle building, but if you ever want to set a PR lift, or fight... everybody, they are (or were) the real deal. I’m pretty sure they’re the reason the term “Roid Rage” even exists.

[GearHeaded]

You guys ever use Cheque drops? I only ask cause Gear mentioned them. I didn’t even think they existed anymore. I doubt they have any use for muscle building, but if you ever want to set a PR lift, or fight... everybody, they are (or were) the real deal. I’m pretty sure they’re the reason the term “Roid Rage” even exists.

Mibolerone.. one of only a few oral 19 nors. a veterinary drug. not much use in bodybuilding imo.. aggression and agitation alongside high hepatoxicity. never something I wanted to mess with. would rather go with methyl tren over it cause its more anabolic (another oral 19 nor)

[i_SLAM_cougars]

Mibolerone.. one of only a few oral 19 nors. a veterinary drug. not much use in bodybuilding imo.. aggression and agitation alongside high hepatoxicity. never something I wanted to mess with. would rather go with methyl tren over it cause its more anabolic (another oral 19 nor)

Got another one for you. So a few years back one of my buddies scored dimethyl Tren. Is that what I think it is? Someone double alkalated it? I know the serving size was ridiculously small, which I thought sort of defeated the purpose. I thought maybe it cut down on liver toxicity because the dose was so small, but in reality after about a week he could feel his liver. So I’m guessing the double methyl makes multiplies the toxicity substantially. Any real world experience?

[charger69]

if it was this long after the fact, this would actually lead me to believe your liver enzyme elevation was not due to the Halo at all , but something else going on.
the way liver enzyme elevation generally works is from the stress of detoxifying a hepatoxic compound while that compound is active. so for example, take 200mg of Dbol and 500mg of Tylenol and then go get blood work 6 hours later and enzyme levels are likely going to be way elevated. but wait until those things clear and get blood work done 7 days later, and enzymes levels are likely going to be just fine.

enzymes elevate during the detoxifying process. if your 7 weeks removed from using Halo, and your liver is no longer detoxifying it, then liver enzymes should be in normal range . unless your liver is dealing with something else it was detoxifying at the time of the blood work .. like alcohol, like McDonalds, like some other OTC medicine . or it could of simply been that you did not take a week off from heavy training before the blood work and the blood work showed a false positive (the blood work can't distinguish enzymes that are coming from the liver or from breaking down of muscle tissue)

being that far removed from Halo use, I doubt it was the Halo that caused the elevation in enzymes.. plenty of people that don't ever touch AAS and drink beer on the weekends or eat fast food every day or just take Tylenol for pain or other OTC meds , or script meds (like some BP meds) , are walking around with elevated liver enzymes.

again its the detoxification process itself that elevates enzymes . your body was done doing that 7 weeks prior. which is why I would venture to say that something else was causing the elevation of livers enzymes at the time of the blood work. .
now there is no doubt had you got blood work done with Halo active and in your system enzymes would likely be elevated (because the liver would actively be detoxifying it and breaking the halo down)

I thought I had an explanation, now you have me worried.


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[gjoney_b]

I thought I had an explanation, now you have me worried.


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Next time you visit your doctor, head to Gearheaded first lol

[i_SLAM_cougars]

I thought I had an explanation, now you have me worried.


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Could just be old age...

[Family_guy]

if you were taking one of the most liver toxic compounds out there, halo, and your liver values were only slightly out of range . then that actually proves my point that AAS is not that liver toxic.. heck just being in a calorie deficit and training hard in the gym, or one night of binge drinking, will significantly raise liver values.

95% of the AAS out there is not really posing any sort of significant liver issues . if they did, then all of us juice heads and bodybuilders over the years would be suffering from liver problems . but none of us do. heck back in the 80s guys used to pop 200mg a dbol a day. they are still around and kicking just fine with no liver issues

plenty of people who do not use AAS or never have used AAS are walking around with elevated liver enzymes


thats not to downplay the fact that abusing some liver toxic oral steroids can definitely negatively impact liver health. its just the overall idea that steroids in general are bad for your liver , just not true (some steroids are actually prescribed to help treat liver disease, like Var)

I think the thing people never realize is that liver damage is caused by chronic stress to the liver. The liver is extremely resilient. It can bounce back from an acute stress relatively easily. The chronic damage from taking something liver toxic is what causes scarring(cirrhosis!). Alcoholics don’t die after drinking heavily for 12 weeks(average cycle length) they die from decades of drinking too much without giving their liver a chance to heal.

[GearHeaded]

I think the thing people never realize is that liver damage is caused by chronic stress to the liver. The liver is extremely resilient. It can bounce back from an acute stress relatively easily. The chronic damage from taking something liver toxic is what causes scarring(cirrhosis!). Alcoholics don’t die after drinking heavily for 12 weeks(average cycle length) they die from decades of drinking too much without giving their liver a chance to heal.

exactly .

when liver enzymes elevate the liver is just doing its JOB . its the job of the liver to detoxify our bodies. its going to get beat up some from life, but thats its job.

its like playing football and having a football helmet. the helmet might get banged up some in the process, but thats its job, its protecting your head.. the football player does not need to go out of his way to protect his helmet per se.
now you don't want to purposely take a sledge hammer to it , but you don't need to baby it either