When you SHOULDN'T use AAS imho....

[football3355]

i dunno bro,i dont think a pro BB is the best example. Most reasonable users arent gonna go past 2grams a week of gear. Pros easily double that, plus gh and slin. A pros body is so far away from normal homeastasis that their bodys are just dying to get back down to a normal weight. Building a body on 4 grams a week of gear plus gh and slin, thered just be no way to maintain it. I think for the more "sane" users keeping most of the gains is doable. jmo

sorry for posting WAY late but this is true. I look at the gains lost more as weight and tone. That is practical homeostasis and will happen with age as well....being that high over your genetic limit will cause a quick drop in mass. but for strength i think it is different, strength is harder to loose than weight is. I mean i remember when i broke my wrist a few years back, i lost a bit of weight (10-15 lbs) felt skinny but wasnt and i still lifted just as much on back squat when i healed 2 months later without any lifting and frequent eating and high protein. Over years and years this might be more pronounced, but overall, weight is the more fluctuating element in life after roid use. Also, when i had a first cycle 5 months ago (been clean for 2..personal reasons) i have kept almost all strength gains, while tone and mass is on the decline. I benched at a friends house a week ago and i felt a little bit less strong than i did after my PCT, this shows me strength, for ME, is hard to loose and is mostly muscle memory. Hopefully this means me running Halo will give me those "100lb increase in bench in 4weeks" results and keep around 75 quite well.

[C-heavyweight]

Most teens learn a few topics from books, mags, and forums. Then they misinterprit the knowledge recived and do a cycle. NOt really knowing that everything varies from person to person and how to accumulate for that. I think that if you don't read that post 5x and are not able to generate info. that is parallel to the topics depth.....then you don't need to do a cycle..............Great post though man!

[trenerefic85]

Seriously this whole thread is bullshit I started young and my dick is so huge.

[FutureRoider]

I passed all the rules except the first one am 21.

been training for 4 years and am pretty good because lots of peeps think am on steroid sometimes although am natural.

But this is still an option for me next year, waiting till 25 seems too long lol.

[Legolas]

Excelent thread

[gunslinger2]

I agree with everything except the part about training for at least two years. I think that should be more like 5-7 years.

[Big Digger]

Great thread! I'm not even ready for fat burners yet, much less gear. It's great to have all this information in one spot.

[Twin]

very good thread.

[dj erk15]

Good post

[tox2501]

Thanks! Good checklist for what I need to cover before I consider starting a cycle.

[k.soul]

thanx DB

this is the best info & advice by far for a noob like me and others.thanx heaps.

[muskulazio]

Really great post bro, definitely need to reach all those steps before thinking bout goin on a cycle.

[seattleironpumper]

I am not a no - it -all but i am 40 and thow i have only done a couple of cycles through my life I think the two year weight lifting before a cycle is a bit much, I know pleanty of guys that started a cycle after a month or two of hard lifting and got awesome gains.

[longhorn814]

I am not a no - it -all but i am 40 and thow i have only done a couple of cycles through my life I think the two year weight lifting before a cycle is a bit much, I know pleanty of guys that started a cycle after a month or two and got awesome gains.

you can easily make gains early on in your training even with a mediocore diet..they wouldve probably gotten those same gains even without steroids..you need to develop a foundation before using AAS or youre gonna put yourself at risk of getting hurt..one to 2 months is WAY too short of a time to being AAS use

[seattleironpumper]

Agree, I do believe that the longer u have been working out on a consistant basis the better the gear will be for u, and I also agree with your statment on danger there (long)

you can easily make gains early on in your training even with a mediocore diet..they wouldve probably gotten those same gains even without steroids..you need to develop a foundation before using AAS or youre gonna put yourself at risk of getting hurt..one to 2 months is WAY too short of a time to being AAS use

[cordawg]

I am not a no - it -all but i am 40 and thow i have only done a couple of cycles through my life I think the two year weight lifting before a cycle is a bit much, I know pleanty of guys that started a cycle after a month or two of hard lifting and got awesome gains.

I on the other hand have very little experience with aas so far. A cycle and a half under my belt and as much reading as I can do here is about it. But I trained for three years before touching aas. A buddy of mine dove into aas late in his second month of proper training. He had awesome gains, 20 pounds of lean mass. But because he only had 2 months experience training, his diet was off, and when he came off cycle, kind of fell out of training. The end result, he lost all 20 pounds. Its best to train for a longer period of time IMO because then your more prone to keep up with training after cycle as it is already a regular part of your life.

On another note its best to know your body and your limits very well first too. Even after training for 3 years before juicing, I suppose I didnt know my body and its reactions to being on and being off. A month after my first cycle I was doing my lateral raises with the weight I had been using at the very peak of my cycle aaaaand... Shoulder injury, put me out of training for an entire month, made work uncomfortable, and still from time to time the pain comes back for a day or so. Even with years of training, you still have alot to learn about your body, especially once aas are added to the equation.

So this being said IMO, **ATLEAST** one year of religiously training and tweaking your diet is needed before pinning for the first time

[seattleironpumper]

Longhorn, I am origanally from tejas love them longhorns hate them sooners

[longhorn814]

yeah ive yet to find anything good come from Oklahoma!! haha

[Chitown Raider]

Nice post

[Drummerboy]

Your natural gains will likely hit a plateau, dictated by your genetics. Some ppl say thats about 20lbs above your normal BMI, however, i think higher can be held. If your diet and training are spotless and consistant, you can hold a lot of lean mass after cycle, or put it on naturally over many years. Genetics play a big role. IMO, you can still look great carrying about 20-30lbs over your BMI lean. I use aas to pack it on fast... then try to hold it for the longest i can with diet and training.

Its risky to jump on cycle as soon as you train... can get injured easily. Gotta be careful thats all. Solid foundations can get around that.... however it can be done, just that ppl push too hard and pull something. Noobs especially should not get the impression that doing this should come easy... knowledge and discipline really help ppl put on gains without injury and keep em' for as long as they can.

~DB~

[rager]

Everyone on earth is guilty of atleast one of those requiremnets. I guess no one is ready than

[CRUISECONTROL]

Good post!!! I agree this should be a sticky

[Drummerboy]

Everyone on earth is guilty of atleast one of those requiremnets. I guess no one is ready than

They are guidelines to get the most out of your cycle and training, i thought that was easily understood. since you dont understand ill explain : You can get less gains if you like by not tweaking your habbits. You can train bad and eat sh1t, get fat and lose all your hard work, or get gains fast without injury, get off a cycle, keep enough to be happy and love it. Its a choice, im just sharing things that ive learned over the years to help a newer guy get the most out of his training and cycle. These simple ideas are not news to many vets... i felt like summing it up in a quick thread... and... your welcome

[aer_vlad]

**edit**

[Overhaulz]

I think they should make it so you must read through this entire thread and be quizzed before you can even view the rest of the forums.

Great post!!!

[Drummerboy]

^^^ yea, you can keep enough to look great, but genetics and good practices are a big part of it...

[BuffBuffalo]

This is a very good set of standards IMO. I was also told 21 and up was okay but who really can say for sure. Every person is different.

[Drummerboy]

thnx for the positive feedback... glad its helping some ppl

[Drummerboy]

bump

[Drummerboy]

....

[BONE.CRUSHER]

hey bro

thats a good post im going to keep it bumped

[Drummerboy]

bump

[Lach01]

Great post wish i had this when i first started would have weight a lot longer than i did. Agree with everyone else who mention it should be sticky

[Drummerboy]

sticky's are hard to come by tho!

[Big]

sticky's are hard to come by tho!

Not that hard, sticky it is. Excellent post.

[Jeff1]

That was good bro.

[Drummerboy]

thnx again

[Drummerboy]

bump

[AthleticEngineering]

Good stuff. The overtraining is a rough one.

[shifty_git]

Bump - so very true.