Test cycle, when does use cross the line to abuse?

[Lunk1]

Just let me step in here and remind everyone that there is no discussion of rec drug talk here.

Now, AAS abuse.... If a person knows that AAS is, or will more than likely cause harm to themselves or their loved ones, this is abuse. for instance, my wife loves me. she loves me when i cycle too. Even on 1,200mgs test EW. Why? Cause i'm still stpete. Now, enter 500-600mgs tren. All of a sudden, my wife hates me. Why? Cause my diet gets all out of whack, i sweat like a whore in church at night, but mostly, cause it turns stpete into "mean stpete." So, if i choose to use it i call that abuse and reckless cause i know what's going to happen but choose to do so anyway. Selfish. And for what? To lift an extra few lbs. just to satisfy my ego? Only time i can try to justify it is for a comp. but those are gone after next year anyway.

That's my take on it anyway. I just used tren as an example, it could actually be a number of compounds.

Keep in mind Pete we all know the risks associated with AAS use even if everything is done right. Like enlargement of the heart for example, yet we shake our heads at that and choose to continue to use a very high dose of test that far exceeds the amount neccessary to function properly as a man. Thus taking risks just for vanity sake! To me this is the very definition of addictive and abusive behavior. I want to point out again I'm not casting stones at anyone who chooses this lifestyle but keeping things in true perspective is important to me. I am abusing performanve enhancement drugs to get bigger, faster, stronger and yet we all preach how ppl can reach their goals natty with proper diet and training. But I'm choosing to illegally use higher doses of AAS than any Doc would prescribe to gain an personal advantage. Sounds like abuse...

[boxingfan30]

I know you guys are having a nice little debate here which is fine and interesting. I should have been a bit more specific in my question, as it is a rather broad range. Obviously, what is abuse to some is not to others. For instance, I have multiple bulging discs, a torn disc, and a crack in my spine. I have refused and will continue to refuse ANY opiate pain killer, or even narcotic... though sometimes it gets so bad I will take a muscle relaxor. Most of the time however, it's just standard OTC pain killers, which IMO work just as well just without the high feeling that I guess helps to relax the body at the same time? I'm not sure. With that said let me ask this differently.

Person 1 has my same issues and symptoms and takes the pill only as needed which would be use (IMO)
Person 2 takes them as also prescribed but on a regular basis as to feel more level and feel less pain all of the time, this is still use.
Person 3 takes them, but this person starts to take 2 every 4 hours, but knows they they can take 2 of them every 4 hours if the pain is severe enough. They TELL themselves it is, though in reality the single dose does indeed work just fine ... abuse on the way to addiction.

A little different from using AAS I agree. However, if I decide to use test, but I want to start at 250 mg's per week because of less possibility of aggression when I know I have this problem at times (without knowing if it is a hormonal issue). For me, I would consider this responsible.

Later I decide that I like the effects and any negative sides are manageable, I decide to take 500 mg's to see how it goes. At that point to me, I am playing with fire IF I am getting my desired results and if my bloodwork shows everything is normal, i'm not putting myself in danger at 250 mg's. However, I don't consider the 500 mg's to be abuse at that point UNLESS I take it and though i'm more aggressive I don't care about the others I may be affecting around me.

So IMO if one is taking 500, 750, or however much some guys here or in general take it's not abuse until you hit that point of doing it regardless of the fact that it's affecting you that could affect others... possibility of death, or severe medical issues, just being to aggressive and making yourself more prone to dangerous violent acts, etc.

I know that the law states that the use of it without a prescrip is indeed illegal. IMO it's stupid to make it that way BUT for the 18 year olds out there, every single of them would be on it and 90% be irresponsible with it. I just think that certain things have shown more promise than just popping an opiate every time something hurts. Use some test for a while and thicken those bones up... maybe it will help and maybe not. It might help likely somewhat when it came to the possibility of injury are least, what good does the opiate do instead of just mask the pain for a few hours? What help has it done in the long term?