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Thread: Article: Billionaires Dumping Stocks bc of looming economic meltdown

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    Yes... I said it... Go look up what I said and you'll def understand why.... Oh and go look up REITs (real estate investment trusts)

    Since my comment was dumb lol. Its a no brainer why more millionaires are made from real estate i will also say its a debate that will never end. Personally I dont feel the average person makes it big in stocks/bonds without insider info. Is it safe, maybe. Will stocks/bonds make the average folks wealthy doutful.

    http://www.forbes.com/2005/05/27/cx_sc_0527home.html


    http://www.investopedia.com/articles...#axzz2N7fv4gWa


    http://www.calstatecompanies.com/Art...0%20Investment
    Last edited by t-dogg; 03-10-2013 at 01:25 AM.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleInk View Post
    Wow, great rebuttal!!! It almost hurt my brain reading it! Lol

    I'm still digesting it. I don't think you and I are far apart on this. This conversation could get very interesting!
    Lol I seriously talk about this stuff everyday at work you have no idea the hours I've spent thinking about this. I've even weighed out the pros and cons to numerous scenarios. Everything's a domino effect... The best upside with the lowest downside risk from what I looked at was inflation risk... It plays a factor in all the other risks, like interest rate risk, market risk...etc. there's obviously other factors but when you have one element as the same factor in each scenario you look at... That's obviously the problem that you need to address but no one wants to tackle it head on they want to use round about ways to so called stimulate the economy... These people need to put their pockets and traditionalist thinking aside and confront this head on... Otherwise it'll just get worse

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by t-dogg View Post
    The next time you use google to validate your point make it relevant...
    the first article is dated 2005 before the real estate bubble bursted
    the second is 2009 when the first stimulus was released to first time home buyers
    the third is a company trying to persuade you to buy their real estate so it's an advertisement not a basis for a debate my friend. I'm not trying to be mean or rude by any means but you need to research this b.c post one was bad but this one took the cake

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    The next time you use google to validate your point make it relevant...
    the first article is dated 2005 before the real estate bubble bursted
    the second is 2009 when the first stimulus was released to first time home buyers
    the third is a company trying to persuade you to buy their real estate so it's an advertisement not a basis for a debate my friend. I'm not trying to be mean or rude by any means but you need to research this b.c post one was bad but this one took the cake


    Actually I did this for a point lol. Its the same over the years was my point. Also I only pulled from a few pages. I can post alot more if needed, its not a hard look up.


    Again what I posted holds weight, because if it didnt why is the rich pulling out and investing else where?

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    Since dates seem to be important. This goes more into why they are turning to real estate now in this market.


    http://www.millionairecorner.com/art...tate-investing

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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleInk View Post
    Wow, great rebuttal!!! It almost hurt my brain reading it! Lol

    I'm still digesting it. I don't think you and I are far apart on this. This conversation could get very interesting!
    Quote Originally Posted by t-dogg View Post
    Actually I did this for a point lol. Its the same over the years was my point. Also I only pulled from a few pages. I can post alot more if needed, its not a hard look up.


    Again what I posted holds weight, because if it didnt why is the rich pulling out and investing else where?
    you have no idea what's going on half of the worlds billionaires have their money managed by a major firm who is in fact investing in equities primarily.. They are diversifying their portfolios because emerging market equities have much better growth and dividend potential than large cap stocks... As for developed non is markets they seem to be following suit as what is stocks did last year... It makes perfect sense to reposition there. I have yet to see anyone portfolios get rebalanced to be weighted in REITs or mortgage bonds ... Institutions are pulling out of the bond market left and right and look at what I posted previously. The fixed income market and the equity market are completely different.

    Your post doesn't hold weight.. It's not current information. If one of the, was from this quarter or last quarter I would have taken it into consideration but b.t. Tax law change, qe3 and the pop of an economic bubble... None of what you posted holds weight. I'm sorry to say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    you have no idea what's going on half of the worlds billionaires have their money managed by a major firm who is in fact investing in equities primarily.. They are diversifying their portfolios because emerging market equities have much better growth and dividend potential than large cap stocks... As for developed non is markets they seem to be following suit as what is stocks did last year... It makes perfect sense to reposition there. I have yet to see anyone portfolios get rebalanced to be weighted in REITs or mortgage bonds ... Institutions are pulling out of the bond market left and right and look at what I posted previously. The fixed income market and the equity market are completely different.

    Your post doesn't hold weight.. It's not current information. If one of the, was from this quarter or last quarter I would have taken it into consideration but b.t. Tax law change, qe3 and the pop of an economic bubble... None of what you posted holds weight. I'm sorry to say.



    read above Dated 4months ago.

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    Quote Originally Posted by t-dogg View Post
    Since dates seem to be important. This goes more into why they are turning to real estate now in this market.


    http://www.millionairecorner.com/art...tate-investing
    thats 18 months old out dated

    http://www.kiplinger.com/article/inv...-for-2013.html

    this is cuurent it's from this quarter. Using reliable sources like Bloomberg, and Reuters is a good start.
    Im telling you I know what in talking about. I do this everyday for a living

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    Quote Originally Posted by t-dogg View Post
    read above Dated 4months ago.
    Sorry I just saw that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    Sorry I just saw that.


    Its all good.



    Is bonds in a long run better IDK anymore. Was it before. yes I feel. I just like real estate for my tastes. I like knowing in 20-30 years I still have it and its renting out.


    Its sad in this market that close friends of mine that are working for top companies are saying its a scary time for bonds, stocks. No real control UNLESS you are in the loop and/or richer then rich lol. Most now are agreeing with real estate.
    Last edited by t-dogg; 03-10-2013 at 01:53 AM.

  11. #51
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    Look up blackrock pimco, jp Morgan, Goldman Sachs.... Take a look at their current 2013 outlooks

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    Quote Originally Posted by Armykid93 View Post
    You guys hurt my brain lol i'm just glad I know how to budget and I get a steady paycheck. I'm gonna start a savings very soon for retirement. Something that collects interest, not sure what to do though.
    Ditto. Want to go get drunk and pee on things?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Armykid93 View Post
    You guys hurt my brain lol i'm just glad I know how to budget and I get a steady paycheck. I'm gonna start a savings very soon for retirement. Something that collects interest, not sure what to do though.
    Invest

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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    Invest
    I pay a guy to invest for me. I am really dumb when it comes to this stuff. I have an IRA and 401K but really don't understand them. I just pray the guy I am using isn't related to Bernard Madoff.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DSM4Life View Post
    I pay a guy to invest for me. I am really dumb when it comes to this stuff. I have an IRA and 401K but really don't understand them. I just pray the guy I am using isn't related to Bernard Madoff.
    Lol...you're in a very common scenario. It's good to have someone to help you. I always try to make investments simple when I talk people... I draw pictures a lot.... It's def helps people understand what's happening so much better

  16. #56
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    I got into stocks finally in the beginning of 1997. I had MOST of my eggs in one basket. I watched my $7000 investment go up to $250,000. Due to a unrelated stock manipulation scam I had the good luck (sarcasm) of getting caught up in I hit a margin call and didnt get to do as planned on taking 50% of my profit when I wanted to and watched my $250,000 dwindle down to under $3000

    Long story short I just have unbelievable bad luck and timing when it comes to some of this stock stuff. I have had a good track record when it comes to my 401K though of just setting the stocks/mutual funds and NOT touching it. My last 2 year average has been 7.5% and my 5yr+ is a little better than that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lovbyts View Post
    I got into stocks finally in the beginning of 1997. I had MOST of my eggs in one basket. I watched my $7000 investment go up to $250,000. Due to a unrelated stock manipulation scam I had the good luck (sarcasm) of getting caught up in I hit a margin call and didnt get to do as planned on taking 50% of my profit when I wanted to and watched my $250,000 dwindle down to under $3000

    Long story short I just have unbelievable bad luck and timing when it comes to some of this stock stuff. I have had a good track record when it comes to my 401K though of just setting the stocks/mutual funds and NOT touching it. My last 2 year average has been 7.5% and my 5yr+ is a little better than that.
    I invest in mf best way to go... Portfolio managers get paid to watch and trade you're money... It's all about diversification...

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    I invest in mf best way to go... Portfolio managers get paid to watch and trade you're money... It's all about diversification...
    Yup and that's why I have my 401K set up the way it is and I'm a firm believe of if it ain't broke don't fix it.
    I have no idea about my Ira. I set it up 2 years ago and forgot about it. Last I looked about 1yr ago I know it had gone up; not sure how much but I'm still not going to bother it.

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    More fear mongering....

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    I hope you're right!

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    Quote Originally Posted by lovbyts View Post
    Yup and that's why I have my 401K set up the way it is and I'm a firm believe of if it ain't broke don't fix it.
    I have no idea about my Ira. I set it up 2 years ago and forgot about it. Last I looked about 1yr ago I know it had gone up; not sure how much but I'm still not going to bother it.
    I pmed you

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    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    Insider trading is not allowed... You're not suppose to have advantage over others I the market place as it could effect the outcomes as to what the price of the security becomes... Watch the men who made America... And awesome documentary and you'll learn where a lot of regulations including employment regulations came from
    I think everyone knows its not allowed but you do not think it happens and often? Half of my friends work on wall street and the stories I hear are outrageous.

    Going out to dinners in other countries with a posit it note on the bill about blah blah.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rwy View Post
    I think everyone knows its not allowed but you do not think it happens and often? Half of my friends work on wall street and the stories I hear are outrageous.

    Going out to dinners in other countries with a posit it note on the bill about blah blah.
    i said you're not suppose to I never said it doesn't happen...I'm not ignorant

  24. #64
    When paying someone to manage your money you can fall victim to churn and burn from a broker who charges commission and fees. It's not as common as it used to be but still I would trust no one else with my money. An as for real estate there's no way to hedge your investment. You must be diversified. My 401k is doing great but not enough choices,we have a self managed option but you can't even sell covered calls against a position. And its the only way to get into cash, if you stick with the main plan its an index or bond fund. And yes I trade options,bit in a separate account. Mostly covered calls on dividend stocks,weeklies if the premium is good enough. I do not gamble or try to hit home runs buying out of the money calls or puts. I got my ass handed to me for about 12 grand on a google earnings play. I had just learned about trading options and had 6 back to back wins not a good way to start. So I decided the only way to get a big win is to bet big. I was greedy and stupid and learned an important lesson. I'm not a broker or financial advisor and please don't take anything I said as financial advice.

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicDoc View Post
    http://www.moneynews.com/MKTNews/bil...source=taboola

    Definitely worth the 5 min read. Also most importantly, watch the video at the end.
    I was hoping we could get some more opinions on this article. I'm really concerned if what they're saying is true. I guess I'm somewhat hoping more ppl comment saying that they think it's all BS for whatever reason.

    What bothers me most about this article is that in the video the analyst says that he thinks we need increased consumer spending to get out of this recession but it's articles like this that directly scare ppl into saving and away from spending.

  26. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicDoc

    I was hoping we could get some more opinions on this article. I'm really concerned if what they're saying is true. I guess I'm somewhat hoping more ppl comment saying that they think it's all BS for whatever reason.

    What bothers me most about this article is that in the video the analyst says that he thinks we need increased consumer spending to get out of this recession but it's articles like this that directly scare ppl into saving and away from spending.
    I started investing in gold and silver in 2009. I will be moving more into gold. Market is always cyclical but I think we are going to see lower lowers and less higher highs in the years coming bc US can't get debt under control and can tax it's way out of spending. My .02

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    Quote Originally Posted by optionsdude View Post
    When paying someone to manage your money you can fall victim to churn and burn from a broker who charges commission and fees. It's not as common as it used to be but still I would trust no one else with my money. An as for real estate there's no way to hedge your investment. You must be diversified. My 401k is doing great but not enough choices,we have a self managed option but you can't even sell covered calls against a position. And its the only way to get into cash, if you stick with the main plan its an index or bond fund. And yes I trade options,bit in a separate account. Mostly covered calls on dividend stocks,weeklies if the premium is good enough. I do not gamble or try to hit home runs buying out of the money calls or puts. I got my ass handed to me for about 12 grand on a google earnings play. I had just learned about trading options and had 6 back to back wins not a good way to start. So I decided the only way to get a big win is to bet big. I was greedy and stupid and learned an important lesson. I'm not a broker or financial advisor and please don't take anything I said as financial advice.
    I differ... It's super hard to churn at major firms... Everything an investment rep does is reviewed and questioned. Are there advisors that want the most commission sure. Are there those that care about people yes. I know, I will always put anyone's best interest at heart and not my paycheck. I value people and their lives. Helping someone's dream come true and them coming back to you showing you appreciation is the best feeling in the world to me, my sense of self worth goes up because its evident I am an asset to their lives, our interaction enhanced their overall well being.

    Options trading as much as I know a lot about it and read about it, I haven't grown a set to take the dive. I know the strategies and the calculations you can use to figure out your break-even and what not, i just know id watch that and get addicted to it and probably not do my work jk... im not too keen on taking on that type of risk its a go big or go home mentality i don't have. i work so hard that i want good steady long term returns. I love love love equities, for me that is...

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    Quote Originally Posted by AnabolicDoc View Post
    I was hoping we could get some more opinions on this article. I'm really concerned if what they're saying is true. I guess I'm somewhat hoping more ppl comment saying that they think it's all BS for whatever reason.

    What bothers me most about this article is that in the video the analyst says that he thinks we need increased consumer spending to get out of this recession but it's articles like this that directly scare ppl into saving and away from spending.
    to be frank, I'd disregard that article, I follow major asset managers ideologies... Why b.c they hire the best of the best fund managers. They have the most dollars in their portfolios and implementing the wrong strategies would cause a huge decrease in their pay... I'm interested in what those people have to say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlyGymRat View Post
    I started investing in gold and silver in 2009. I will be moving more into gold. Market is always cyclical but I think we are going to see lower lowers and less higher highs in the years coming bc US can't get debt under control and can tax it's way out of spending. My .02
    I personally believe commodities should only be compliments in a portfolio... Actually I had this discussion an hour ago with the big wigs at my company and they made a great point to me. Rates were higher than(recession and post recession) they are now and have since gone down, gold has gone up and keeps going up...even though its a new trend, that proves its not cyclical and is based on other factors like supply and demand and rates are artificially held down, so when the govt decides not to do that anymore and people need more cash on hand to spend, where is it comming from? A demand for cash is needed, where are they going to take from... Hence what will happen to gold then?

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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlyGymRat View Post
    I started investing in gold and silver in 2009. I will be moving more into gold. Market is always cyclical but I think we are going to see lower lowers and less higher highs in the years coming bc US can't get debt under control and can tax it's way out of spending. My .02
    Just hope they dont do like they did in 1933 and make another executive order Prohibited the hoarding of gold coins, gold bullion, and gold certificates. It was illegal to have over $100 in gold. Yes they really took gold away from the owners because the government decided they needed/wanted it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by lovbyts

    Just hope they dont do like they did in 1933 and make another executive order Prohibited the hoarding of gold coins, gold bullion, and gold certificates. It was illegal to have over $100 in gold. Yes they really took gold away from the owners because the government decided they needed/wanted it.
    I didn't know this was done. Wow

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    Quote Originally Posted by GirlyGymRat View Post
    I didn't know this was done. Wow
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_6102
    Executive Order 6102 is an Executive Order signed on April 5, 1933, by U.S. President Franklin D. Roosevelt "forbidding the Hoarding of Gold Coin, Gold Bullion, and Gold Certificates within the continental United States". The order criminalized the possession of monetary gold by any individual, partnership, association or corporation.

    Never underestimate what the government can/will do to keep civilians weak and distracted in the time of uprising.
    Last edited by lovbyts; 03-12-2013 at 05:33 AM.

  33. #73
    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    I differ... It's super hard to churn at major firms... Everything an investment rep does is reviewed and questioned. Are there advisors that want the most commission sure. Are there those that care about people yes. I know, I will always put anyone's best interest at heart and not my paycheck. I value people and their lives. Helping someone's dream come true and them coming back to you showing you appreciation is the best feeling in the world to me, my sense of self worth goes up because its evident I am an asset to their lives, our interaction enhanced their overall well being.

    Options trading as much as I know a lot about it and read about it, I haven't grown a set to take the dive. I know the strategies and the calculations you can use to figure out your break-even and what not, i just know id watch that and get addicted to it and probably not do my work jk... im not too keen on taking on that type of risk its a go big or go home mentality i don't have. i work so hard that i want good steady long term returns. I love love love equities, for me that is...
    I know churn and burn used to exist at a major that my friend used to deliver to. He became good friends with a bunch of people there they even had a computer for him to use while he was on his lunch break. He said at the end of the quarter they would start dancing around singing churn and burn. It's still a major firm and that was when I decided I would learn on my own. I was all about fundamentals at first. And then one night I was looking through the archived shows on think or swim and there was this guy David Elliott aka First Wave. He got me started on technicals and chart patterns,indicators,moving averages,fibo retracements. All of that kind of stuff it became analysis paralysis after a while. I run simple candlestick charts with 2 moving averages 20 sma and 50 sma. I also use person pivots on some charts or looking for weekly pin prices. I'm glad you like what you do I love helping people as well and was going to take the broker series tests and then someone told me you can't trade once you become a broker. That's the fun part especially trading the /ES an /YM futures it really rattles my nerves and I'm sure it's not good for anyones bloodpressure. But man is it exciting. When I first started trading futures I tried to force trades which doesn't work and got lucky on a few market drops but always got nervous and left the trade too soon. I have finally gained the discipline to look at the futures and not trade just watch for a good setup or trend day,then I might participate. Selling calls against a position you own is a good way to make your own dividend especially if there are weeklies available. Collecting 20-30 cents per share each week adds up fast.

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    Quote Originally Posted by optionsdude View Post
    I know churn and burn used to exist at a major that my friend used to deliver to. He became good friends with a bunch of people there they even had a computer for him to use while he was on his lunch break. He said at the end of the quarter they would start dancing around singing churn and burn. It's still a major firm and that was when I decided I would learn on my own. I was all about fundamentals at first. And then one night I was looking through the archived shows on think or swim and there was this guy David Elliott aka First Wave. He got me started on technicals and chart patterns,indicators,moving averages,fibo retracements. All of that kind of stuff it became analysis paralysis after a while. I run simple candlestick charts with 2 moving averages 20 sma and 50 sma. I also use person pivots on some charts or looking for weekly pin prices. I'm glad you like what you do I love helping people as well and was going to take the broker series tests and then someone told me you can't trade once you become a broker. That's the fun part especially trading the /ES an /YM futures it really rattles my nerves and I'm sure it's not good for anyones bloodpressure. But man is it exciting. When I first started trading futures I tried to force trades which doesn't work and got lucky on a few market drops but always got nervous and left the trade too soon. I have finally gained the discipline to look at the futures and not trade just watch for a good setup or trend day,then I might participate. Selling calls against a position you own is a good way to make your own dividend especially if there are weeklies available. Collecting 20-30 cents per share each week adds up fast.
    yeah but if the stock hits the target price.... And the buyer executes the contrat so much for that anticipated premium... It be a sad day to give up a quality stock for a bargain and lose a nice dividend yield all together.... The more risk the more reward.... I'm okay with moderate risk and I'm young and I could take on much more but I choose not to. I don't gamble my money or my clients.

    You have to think as an investment rep your handling millions of dollars a day... Imagine trading your own dollars through out the day esp options... You could potentially put other people's money at risk as well as advise them to do things do to emotional attachment you have to a position. I love helping people. It makes me happy to see people feel confident about money considering investments is not the most interesting topic for most.

  35. #75
    You just keep rolling the options out to the next week, If it goes up you can roll up as long as your collecting a premium your bringing down your cost basis. It is very rarely that a contract gets exercised before expiration. I would never do this with someone else's money and you can always use some premium to buy a put if things get over extended. Also you have to have a business plan and stick to your rules. Collecting premium minimizes your risk,it might limit your gains in some instances but that's ok the objective has been met,making money on the trade.
    OP sorry to hijack your thread but honestly I wouldn't worry about a financial collapse for a while. The ball is rolling good right now the transports are going through the roof. This is a good sign of the growth cycle starting all over.

    Quote Originally Posted by ElectraMaddox View Post
    yeah but if the stock hits the target price.... And the buyer executes the contrat so much for that anticipated premium... It be a sad day to give up a quality stock for a bargain and lose a nice dividend yield all together.... The more risk the more reward.... I'm okay with moderate risk and I'm young and I could take on much more but I choose not to. I don't gamble my money or my clients.

    You have to think as an investment rep your handling millions of dollars a day... Imagine trading your own dollars through out the day esp options... You could potentially put other people's money at risk as well as advise them to do things do to emotional attachment you have to a position. I love helping people. It makes me happy to see people feel confident about money considering investments is not the most interesting topic for most.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DSM4Life View Post

    Ditto. Want to go get drunk and pee on things?
    Only if you like captain Morgan as much as I do

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    Quote Originally Posted by optionsdude View Post
    You just keep rolling the options out to the next week, If it goes up you can roll up as long as your collecting a premium your bringing down your cost basis. It is very rarely that a contract gets exercised before expiration. I would never do this with someone else's money and you can always use some premium to buy a put if things get over extended. Also you have to have a business plan and stick to your rules. Collecting premium minimizes your risk,it might limit your gains in some instances but that's ok the objective has been met,making money on the trade.
    OP sorry to hijack your thread but honestly I wouldn't worry about a financial collapse for a while. The ball is rolling good right now the transports are going through the roof. This is a good sign of the growth cycle starting all over.
    You made an excellent point and that's a great strategy but you have to stay on top of the contracts

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    I read these articles on a weekly basis on yahoo finance. Not to discredit the authors article, but I don't let these articles influence my trading strategies. I tend to stick with blue chip stocks that are at their low end of their cyclical valuation, have strong dividends, and strong earnings. I basically follow Buffets strategy, "be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful." Another interesting thing I found was that Buffet's portfolio was grossly disproportionately invested in financial services and consumables. It would make sense that he pulled out and diversified into something else. If he divested that much of his portfolio, he must have a shitload of cash on hand. I'd be interested to see how he reinvested it. That is the untold side of the story that could be just as revealing.

    I was lucky enough to begin investing around 08-09 right when the market was taking an enormous shit. Net everything, my portfolio is up 35% (on some other positions I sold off, I made more than a 100% return). I think it's important to avoid knee-jerk reactions, be patient, do your homework, and realize it is a marathon rather than a sprint (unless you're daytrading with a fatass bank roll). Whatever scenario you anticipate, keep the portfolio diversified!!

  39. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by dnomac View Post
    i read these articles on a weekly basis on yahoo finance. Not to discredit the authors article, but i don't let these articles influence my trading strategies. I tend to stick with blue chip stocks that are at their low end of their cyclical valuation, have strong dividends, and strong earnings. I basically follow buffets strategy, "be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful." another interesting thing i found was that buffet's portfolio was grossly disproportionately invested in financial services and consumables. It would make sense that he pulled out and diversified into something else. If he divested that much of his portfolio, he must have a shitload of cash on hand. I'd be interested to see how he reinvested it. That is the untold side of the story that could be just as revealing.

    I was lucky enough to begin investing around 08-09 right when the market was taking an enormous shit. Net everything, my portfolio is up 35% (on some other positions i sold off, i made more than a 100% return). I think it's important to avoid knee-jerk reactions, be patient, do your homework, and realize it is a marathon rather than a sprint (unless you're daytrading with a fatass bank roll). Whatever scenario you anticipate, keep the portfolio diversified!!
    x2!!

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