Post your Cycle Theory/Hypothesis

[goose]

This is why this is a poor forum,I think it`s time for me to move.You get a newbie making a post on this complex thread,how many vets? Mods?? That have posted here?? A joke

goose4............

[goalseeker]

This is why this is a poor forum,
goose4............

Hmmm....I dont agree with that AT ALL.....

[*Narkissos*]

This is why this is a poor forum,I think it`s time for me to move.You get a newbie making a post on this complex thread,how many vets? Mods?? That have posted here?? A joke

goose4............

1. Obviously you've only been reading your own posts...as mine is on page 1.
2. Obviously you believe that this, a great thread undoubtedly, is the only thread on a forum of this size.

That being said.

3. Obviously Moderators first job must not Moderating. Gadzooks..whatever were we thinking?

My cycle hypothesis?

Here's the link:

http://forums.steroid.com/showthread.php?t=201798

It's rough...and new info has surfaced since i wrote it. I'll address it and perfect it during the coming year.

Then i'll put it into practice to determine its practicability.

[IBdmfkr]

What are some of the drug combos, dosages and durations run with the most success?

If you were to run a 12week bulk with Test would it be more beneficial to change compounds and run cycle for another 8 weeks or recover before switching compounds?

These are just a couple of questions it would be interesting to hear some of you guys results, opinions.

BD

[goose]

Sorry nark,I did not mean you.Your a top guy.

goose4..........

[BajanBastard]

That's because you're a "brotellegent" MOD Nark. Lmfao!!

[IBdmfkr]

Just because someone has the title Mod, or VET doesn't make then any more knowledgable or experienced than anybody else. We have had great feedback from a few members so far, hope to see more participate. Still wondering where Johnny, Rodge, SC, etc etc... along with others who have not yet posted?

[*Narkissos*]

Just because someone has the title Mod, or VET doesn't make then any more knowledgable or experienced than anybody else. We have had great feedback from a few members so far, hope to see more participate. Still wondering where Johnny, Rodge, SC, etc etc... along with others who have not yet posted?

You've got Big K.l.g. here... He's top notch.

He's also a conceited bastard... i should know..he's my training partner.

Really guys, Moderating a board this huge takes up the majority of our time. We try to help where we can but not as regularly as we'd like to.

~Nark

[goose]

This is one of the best threads I have seen.Did I say a mod or a vet is more knowledgable? mod`s and vet spend a decent amount of time on this forum,I just expected more of a responce from them,I`m sure they get bored with the same questions everyday.You get a fresh thread that you can learn from......but no input.....seems some love the same newbie questions all the time.This forum was in dire need of extreme intellectual discussion.
IBdmfkr-you would make a good mod.

goose4............

[SPIKE]

What are some of the drug combos, dosages and durations run with the most success?

If you were to run a 12week bulk with Test would it be more beneficial to change compounds and run cycle for another 8 weeks or recover before switching compounds?

These are just a couple of questions it would be interesting to hear some of you guys results, opinions.

BD

Well since we're the same age BD I think we can relate in some ways.

With my experience my gains seem to dwindle down after about that 12 week mark when using test as a base. In the past I have told myself that was a sign to come off. Lately I have tried something different. I'll introduce a DHT derivitive for the last 4-8 weeks and gains seem to spike right back up. I gave an example and explanation of this in my first post on this thread which was number 9. Sorry if its repetitive but some have a tendency to read that last couple of posts before maknig the decision of chiming in or taking the time to read through 107 posts. Sometimes it's easier to go to the "Sust EOD or E3D" titled thread and post a comment.

This is definitely a very informative thread. Thanks for starting it Pinn

[IBdmfkr]

Well since we're the same age BD I think we can relate in some ways.

With my experience my gains seem to dwindle down after about that 12 week mark when using test as a base. In the past I have told myself that was a sign to come off. Lately I have tried something different. I'll introduce a DHT derivitive for the last 4-8 weeks and gains seem to spike right back up. I gave an example and explanation of this in my first post on this thread which was number 9. Sorry if its repetitive but some have a tendency to read that last couple of posts before maknig the decision of chiming in or taking the time to read through 107 posts. Sometimes it's easier to go to the "Sust EOD or E3D" titled thread and post a comment.

This is definitely a very informative thread. Thanks for starting it Pinn

This is something I have done in the past and had great results with also. Seems to hit the receptors differently and keep gains from hindering. I also noticed at week 10-12 there was not much more progression.

[*Narkissos*]

Keep it on topic guys

[topvega]

Bump....

[marcus300]

bump....

[NYC BIG MIKE]

Funny thing is , this very topic was in my mind as I was working out last night in the gym with one of my favorite training partners. Thought I'd bring up a perspective that we both agreed on. Sometimes at the end of a cycle, when you have alot of drugs running simultaneously, you end up with leftovers. I never throw anything out. Here's the interesting part, some of my best cycles have been a potpouri of "leftovers" with no rhyme or reason. Just trying to clear out the shoebox I keep it in. 5 vials of this, an amp of that, so on and so forth. We used to call it a "cleaning out the medicine cabinet cycle", we did it more when we were younger and had less money so we had to be creative when it counted. Just thought I'd share that. I'll go back to my cave now.

[Pinnacle]

Mike-

I have a question for you now that you're out of your cave.

You stated earlier in the thread you'd come off cycle for around a month,and jump right back on.

Did you see decent gains when running cycles that close in succession?

I'm having problems doing this(shitty gains when ran too close together),so I'm looking for insight.


~Pinnacle~

[NYC BIG MIKE]

Mike-

I have a question for you now that you're out of your cave.

You stated earlier in the thread you'd come off cycle for around a month,and jump right back on.

Did you see decent gains when running cycles that close in succession?

I'm having problems doing this(shitty gains when ran too close together),so I'm looking for insight.


~Pinnacle~

This is where the old school mentality comes into play. I never even heard of deca dick until I came here, go figure. In the old days you'd do a classic decca cycle for like 12 weeks with a dbol kickstart and an anavar kick finish. Mind you I always ran HCG (thanks Dr. L) and ran basic pct (mostly nolva back then) and a month later do a heavy test only approach. Remember, we didn't have the breakthrough knowledge you guys have now, we believed in receptor saturation and that's the main reason we switched up so drastically, we thought we were fooling the receptors when in actuality it turns out the drug switch itself was the key.

[Booz]

must say this is a very interestin and informative read!

[marcus300]

bump

[NYC BIG MIKE]

Marcus, you found it!!!!!!!!!!!

[marcus300]

Marcus, you found it!!!!!!!!!!!

YEH found it
this thread should be kept right up there,
its the most intresting one ive seen in a long while, even the first timers and advance bodybuilders can learn from this, experience is the key!!

[Pinnacle]

Ok guys...I'm about to start a very high dose(160 mcgs) LR3 IGF-1 cycle.
Right now I'm cruising on low dose Test/Deca/HGH.I'm going to run the IGF cycle 30 days,and then go right into a mini Test suspension cycle(6 weeks) with another strong androgen as well.My thought/logic behind this is the IGF at this dose will create some decent hyperplasma and by following it up quickly with an anabolic cycle,this will sprurt growth to the newly created muscle cells/tissue.
With that said.Here's how I thought of running the dose protocol.

60 mcgs AM
HGH 4 iu's 2pm
100 mcgs PWO

Seem logical to you?Or would you split the dose into ample amounts 3 x during the day?

~Pinnacle~

[Mesomorphyl]

Ok guys...I'm about to start a very high dose(160 mcgs) LR3 IGF-1 cycle.

~Pinnacle~

Let us know if you get headaches with that dose. I have heard over 100mcg you start running the risk of massive headaches, so keep us in the know.

[Pinnacle]

Let us know if you get headaches with that dose. I have heard over 100mcg you start running the risk of massive headaches, so keep us in the know.

I've already ran 120 mcgs.No headaches.I'm willing to speculate that those ppl weren't taking in sufficient amounts of carbs.

I've started my 160 mcg run today.

Also,I'm trying Mike's suggestion with the HGH.


~Pinnacle~

[NYC BIG MIKE]

If it were me, I'd split the GH up too, I know guys that run GH only on workout days to save dosage and $$. So for example if you workout M/W/F do a:

60mcg IGF/4 IU GH am
100mcg IGF/4 IU GH PWO

[Pinnacle]

If it were me, I'd split the GH up too, I know guys that run GH only on workout days to save dosage and $$. So for example if you workout M/W/F do a:

60mcg IGF/4 IU GH am
100mcg IGF/4 IU GH PWO

I'm a believer in the 3 day split myself.

I see the point in regards to the HGH.I know guys that run it like that also.I usually run 9-10 iu's ED.I don't see the need for the higher dose when running IGF at this level.I could be wrong,and I'm very open minded,so I'll consider upping the HGH dose.

You don't think it's a good idea to run the IGF every day?Or are you suggesting an alternative to saving cash.Bear in mind,I have enough IGF to run 160 mcgs every day. I like the idea of cutting back on the HGH though,since it is a pricy suppliment.


~Pinnacle~

[NYC BIG MIKE]

That was a workout day dosage. I should have been more clear. On off days stay with IGF1. Yes it was to save $$ for the peeps who cant afford GH in abundance. The guys I know bring preloaded syringes right to the gym and hit it right before they take their pwo shake.

[Pinnacle]

That was a workout day dosage. I should have been more clear. On off days stay with IGF1. Yes it was to save $$ for the peeps who cant afford GH in abundance. The guys I know bring preloaded syringes right to the gym and hit it right before they take their pwo shake.

Ok,I agree!I've ran IGF many times before(last at 120 mcgs),and it's best to run it ever day.I shoot PWO in the gym shitter myself.
I'm thinking of switching up HGH protocol though.I've been on for years straight,so I think it's time to give my pituitary a chance to recoup,if it can.So 3 days a week seems appe****g to me.

~Pinnacle~

[NYC BIG MIKE]

Ok,I agree!I've ran IGF many times before(last at 120 mcgs),and it's best to run it ever day.I shoot PWO in the gym shitter myself.
I'm thinking of switching up HGH protocol though.I've been on for years straight,so I think it's time to give my pituitary a chance to recoup,if it can.So 3 days a week seems appe****g to me.

~Pinnacle~

That's the whole idea, let your system recoup. I did it for 6 months last year, same weekly dosage but over a 3 day split. Took 3 IU am/ 3 IU noon/3 IU pwo pm. I didn't lose a thing, matter of fact as I get older I am now planning on reverting back to it full time. If you are on 9 IU daily, split 3x as stated, it's better working with the half life and all. We have about 10 spikes a day in GH, so a split compliments this.

[IBdmfkr]

bump, lets keep this goin. Good stuff.

[I_Want_Abs]

bump

[anabolicbruce]

In regards to HGH, it seems that if you take supraphysiological doses ed, your serum IGF-1 will decrease. I have seen this with not only my own bloodwork, but with others as well.

do you guys find that higher doses at fewer days/week is more effective? I want to keep my IGF around 400-500ng.

[NYC BIG MIKE]

In regards to HGH, it seems that if you take supraphysiological doses ed, your serum IGF-1 will decrease. I have seen this with not only my own bloodwork, but with others as well.

do you guys find that higher doses at fewer days/week is more effective? I want to keep my IGF around 400-500ng.

This is something a few friends of mine I and I tried at the gym. We are all on GH pretty much year long and wanted to give our system a break and a chance to rebound. Two guys that I normally work out with are doing it now, they are like 5 months into it and they have the same findings I had last year. Like I told Pinn, try GH usage on lifting days only (am/pm/pwo) and let your own system recoup on the other days. We theorized that we were saturating our bodies on lifting days and letting mother nature do her thing on the other days. So in retrospect, it gives your body the needed days off, is easier on the wallet and allows you to shoot heavier dosages on the days you need it. Everyone who has tried it that I know has liked it.

[IBdmfkr]

Wowsers!!! lol Keep us posted! BigMike, your theory sounds good, wondering if I should try it on my next go in a couple months. SO if you were going to take 6IU 5on2off, with your way would you take 8IU on workout days only, or stick with 6? Thx.

[NYC BIG MIKE]

Wowsers!!! lol Keep us posted! BigMike, your theory sounds good, wondering if I should try it on my next go in a couple months. SO if you were going to take 6IU 5on2off, with your way would you take 8IU on workout days only, or stick with 6? Thx.

6 IU's @ 5 days = 30 IU's . Using that dosage, let's say you work out M/W/F, now you have 30 IU's for those 3 days which would give you basically a 3 IU am/3 IU pm/ 3 IU pwo to play with. Or if you lift 4 days, 30 IU's over 4 days is about 7 IU's a day so on workout days do 2 IU's am/ 2 IU's pm/ 3 IU's pwo. Can you dig it?

[marcus300]

As requested Paul Borresen's shock receptor blasting,

These cycles are only for the advanced bodybuilder who as reached his genetic potential and under no circumstances should this method be used unless you have trained and used gear for numerous years and your body is finding it harder to get a response to grow new muscle mass with the standard cycling.
I would also like to state that this type of cycling doesn't work for everyone, which is probably the normal when we are using chemicals in the body, there are no set rules!!
Paul's method is used at a top pro level and is and does have a place in modern bodybuilding, it has built huge men, Dorian/Dillett were big fans of this type of cycling/training.

The duration of these cycles is between 3-6 wks and there are many different methods and its worked out for the individual who knows his own body ie- knows which compounds work best for him and mixtures, a typical example of a 21 day stack would be using fast acting compounds of between 500mg-1000mg of main test per day, which is similar what some people use in a week, the body is hit hard for 3 weeks and 3 weeks off then repeat, Paul states you shock your receptors and body into growth before any bad side effects appear,

A typical 6 week cycle would be hit slightly different, you would use more longer acting compounds only 2 at a time, so for 2 wks you would use up to a 1gram a day of the main test the switch it for the next 2 wks and switch to another for the last 2 wks(which would normally be a fast acting test), there are variations to this methord and it all depends on the individual and history and experience of using chemicals when designing cycles.
This is a example of a cycle Paul designed for my individual needs-
500mg SUS ED for 10 days
500mg Primo/deca ED for 10 days
500mg Prop/winny ED for 10 days
i was also running HGH while i was on this cycle at 8ius ED
I know alot of you will be thinking deca???? but this was designed for me and at this time i was running deca at a low dose because of the training and to help my joint pain,
i ran this for 30 days and then had 5 weeks off and i repeated a similar cycle using different compounds, i kept all the gains and even produced more while i was in the off period,

Now its not just designing a cycle to make this theory work, there are many other factors to consider and implement to get the most from this blasting, example if your on a 3wk shock cycle you would increase the intensity of the training to a level what you can only physically be maintain for about 3-4 weeks, an example of this would be- warm up fully- max weight 6-8reps +forced-then drop set to failure- then dropset failure- then dropset to failure, this type of training and cycling needs to fuelled with the correct diet which means its a 24hr lifestyle, all this coupled with enough rest,will and does force your body beyond its normal range of growth, after the 3 wks your body is screaming to recover so a maintaining training program is needed and at this stage your body actually still builds muscle mass to compenstate,

The body can gain large tissue gains for short periods of time but it cant keep maintaining this for weeks on end, it is possible to gain a 1lb a day for 3 wks but it cant for weeks on end, this is nature and we can learn from it,if your advanced enough and you know how to combat the side effects this is amazing way to push yourself past any sticking point, if you have the right enviroment for the body it will have rapid fast growth can be obtained by this method,
Any thoughts or commets?

[Pinnacle]

[quote=marcus300]any thoughts?
[quote]

Like I stated above,I just started an IGF cycle.Now how much hyperplasma will occur at that dose?I have no idea,but I'm certain it will be minimal.
BUT,what I'm going to do is running a very high dose(2.5g')suspension cycle as sooon as this cycle is complete.My thought is that the anabolics will grow the new cells created by whatever amount of hyperplasma that will occur during the IGF cycle.
I like Pauls theory on the mini burst type cycle.I just don't agree with the long ester drugs he suggests in his approach.My thinking is that it would be much better to use esterless gear for the quick,high dose cycle.I might be off on his logic?

~Pinnacle~

[marcus300]

[QUOTE=Pinnacle][quote=marcus300]any thoughts?

I like Pauls theory on the mini burst type cycle.I just don't agree with the long ester drugs he suggests in his approach.My thinking is that it would be much better to use esterless gear for the quick,high dose cycle.I might be off on his logic?

~Pinnacle~

ive tried both theorys infact a few more aswell, i did get huge gains on the fast acting cycles instead of the longer acting ones, but both are very impressive

[MASTER]

As requested Paul Borresen's shock receptor blasting,

These cycles are only for the advanced bodybuilder who as reached his genetic potential and under no circumstances should this method be used unless you have trained and used gear for numerous years and your body is finding it harder to get a response to grow new muscle mass with the standard cycling.
I would also like to state that this type of cycling doesn't work for everyone, which is probably the normal when we are using chemicals in the body, there are no set rules!!
Paul's method is used at a top pro level and is and does have a place in modern bodybuilding, it has built huge men, Dorian/Dillett were big fans of this type of cycling/training.

The duration of these cycles is between 3-6 wks and there are many different methods and its worked out for the individual who knows his own body ie- knows which compounds work best for him and mixtures, a typical example of a 21 day stack would be using fast acting compounds of between 500mg-1000mg of main test per day, which is similar what some people use in a week, the body is hit hard for 3 weeks and 3 weeks off then repeat, Paul states you shock your receptors and body into growth before any bad side effects appear,

A typical 6 week cycle would be hit slightly different, you would use more longer acting compounds only 2 at a time, so for 2 wks you would use up to a 1gram a day of the main test the switch it for the next 2 wks and switch to another for the last 2 wks(which would normally be a fast acting test), there are variations to this methord and it all depends on the individual and history and experience of using chemicals when designing cycles.
This is a example of a cycle Paul designed for my individual needs-
500mg SUS ED for 10 days
500mg Primo/deca ED for 10 days
500mg Prop/winny ED for 10 days
i was also running HGH while i was on this cycle at 8ius ED
I know alot of you will be thinking deca???? but this was designed for me and at this time i was running deca at a low dose because of the training and to help my joint pain,
i ran this for 30 days and then had 5 weeks off and i repeated a similar cycle using different compounds, i kept all the gains and even produced more while i was in the off period,

Now its not just designing a cycle to make this theory work, there are many other factors to consider and implement to get the most from this blasting, example if your on a 3wk shock cycle you would increase the intensity of the training to a level what you can only physically be maintain for about 3-4 weeks, an example of this would be- warm up fully- max weight 6-8reps +forced-then drop set to failure- then dropset failure- then dropset to failure, this type of training and cycling needs to fuelled with the correct diet which means its a 24hr lifestyle, all this coupled with enough rest,will and does force your body beyond its normal range of growth, after the 3 wks your body is screaming to recover so a maintaining training program is needed and at this stage your body actually still builds muscle mass to compenstate,

The body can gain large tissue gains for short periods of time but it cant keep maintaining this for weeks on end, it is possible to gain a 1lb a day for 3 wks but it cant for weeks on end, this is nature and we can learn from it,if your advanced enough and you know how to combat the side effects this is amazing way to push yourself past any sticking point, if you have the right enviroment for the body it will have rapid fast growth can be obtained by this method,
Any thoughts or commets?

A friend of mine swears by a similar method of cycling to this, he only uses short or non estered injectables for it. He will do a high dose of suspension or prop (3g+) for three weeks then take 5 weeks off and repeats. He only does two of these cycle in a row, then hell go on a standard 24 weeker.

[marcus300]

A friend of mine swears by a similar method of cycling to this, he only uses short or non estered injectables for it. He will do a high dose of suspension or prop (3g+) for three weeks then take 5 weeks off and repeats. He only does two of these cycle in a row, then hell go on a standard 24 weeker.

JamesC,
how does your friend respond to this type of cycling? how long has he been training and using gear?