It sounds like to me you think you are the only one who should be allowed to defend your country or beliefs.Originally Posted by terraj
Knowledgeable Member
It sounds like to me you think you are the only one who should be allowed to defend your country or beliefs.
Anabolic Member
Guys, I'm not going to blast terraj. I respect him and his opinions. he has every right to express them as any of us.
Knowledgeable Member
I agree. I hope no one is asking you to via PM, that's just chicken. I am only doing the same as terraj. I agree to disagree. We all have our points and our reasons. Japans current situation has very little or nothing to do with my opinion, I have though the same for many years due to seeing how the US is dammed if you do and dammed if you dont and how in debt we are. Like it was said, how can we keep giving what we dont have?
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In Terraj's defense, the US is seemingly a willing patsey. We allow much of it to happen.
Knowledgeable Member
I agree 100%, we have been willing or should I say the government, the obscene rich but I dont think the general public has except for the fact of being blindly believing the people in charge are looking out for our best interest.
Knowledgeable Member
It's not my counrty.
I'm just here to help you guys see....
Last edited by terraj; 03-13-2011 at 03:56 AM.
Anabolic Member
I thought you'd have a rebuttal. I know your interest in this, so I'll leave it alone.
I will say that my exposure to the Japanese, and the asians, is more than brief and more than casual.
I will admit, on a social level, the Japanese can be very charming and pleasant.
Regarding the Chip, Terraj. You may be right. But it wasn't there a few years ago. It grew only after having been involved heavily with the Japanese over several years, and with many personal experiences with not only myself, by my western associates as well. I lived in Korea and worked with the Koreans, and came away with a different perspective.
Although I will say the Koreans were involved in technology and intellectual property theft also. Same as the Chinese. Chinese maybe even more so, I'm not sure.
Knowledgeable Member
It's hard to rebut personal experinces man, sorry you had such a hard time with their culture, it can be brutal and I know it is so different from our respective cultures. I would never work for a Japanese company, however everybody who works for me in Japan is Japanese and I have made many great relationships from doing business here, but I have also been fvcked over big time on parternships with Japanese...such is life.
Anabolic Member
it was brutal.
I will say in your case, having japanese subordinates is different than being a subordinate of a Japanese executive. My japanese members that worked for me thought I was great... took em to football games, took time to teach them many things, over to the house.....
Knowledgeable Member
Pros: It's the right thing to do. It show's solidarity throughout the human race to contribute and support another country in plight. Japan is also the third largest economic power by GDP and purchasing power. As the 4th largest exporter in the world and the 5th largest inporter in the world, from an economic point of view it makes sense to get them back on track again. For them personally, prehaps they should rethink about using nuclear power stations to power their country and consider alternative sustainable energy for the future. It works for places like France because they are not near any fault lines, but this earthquake is like the perfect storm. Not only did a tsunami ensue which hit everything around it in the pacific region, but the added threat of nuclear reactors going off is grave. Nuclear fall out could reach American shores from Japan in less than 10 days.
Cons: Huge amounts of financial aid is going to be required to get Japan on track again, aid that no one can really afford to give right now. But it's not some 3rd World country, saying "fvck Japan" is going to make the global economy worse. Can you imagine if the EU decided "yeah fvck Greece and Ireland, why should we care?".
The world cannot afford to not bail out Japan, and paradoxically we cannot afford to bail out Japan either. This couldn't have come at a worse time and it quite literally is a "Perfect Storm". Tough times are ahead.
Last edited by Flagg; 03-13-2011 at 06:55 AM.
Anabolic Member
At what point do we put ourselves, our families, our neighbors, our communities, and the USA ahead of others for a change?
Knowledgeable Member
I understand if you are against helping Japan get back on it's feet. But you are also against humanitarian emergency assistance ?
Anabolic Member
the world acts a certain way because the american people have trained them to believe that we will come to the rescue with our dollars....
... remember! subsidize what you want.
Anabolic Member
wtf are you talking about.i will die knowing ive saved lifes and taken lifes live with that. live with that im as hard as at it gets in side.ive went into homes after we lit them up and seen pictures of jesus hanging on the wall live with that and the bodys of children in the house.MONEY MEANS ABSOLUTELY NOTHING>
Anabolic Member
I admire that and respect that. That is your personal choice. You can do anything you want with your personal finances and your personal time. The American Red Cross is an excellent vehicle for this.... and I'm sure that as a person of conviction, you've probably already donated heavily out of YOUR pocket for the people of Japan.
The issue is not with YOUR personal finances. The issue is with MY personal finances, and collectively, everybody's personal finances.
Here is an excerpt from something I sent someone else on this subject:
"This issue seems to be in a blind spot for most people. Of course at an emotional level we all want to help. At an individual level, people are reluctant to pry open their personal wallets and donate. Why should it be any different for our government? Somehow, when the government spends it, it doesn't really seem real. It's "other people's money".
I have an idea. To make this very real for people, I propose we do away with employers withholding payroll taxes, and let the citizens cut the check themselves out of their own personal accounts every year. Say I make $100k. My check i would have to write would be $35k. NOW it becomes very very real. NOW people feel the pain of government spending. NOW people get pissed if their government acts irresponsibly with thier tax dollars."
Anabolic Member
i dont care if people donate or not . just dont bash it.karma is a bit--. not that any bad karma is coming anyones way .but you know were im going.i just feel for the people. they are generally kind hearted hard working people who value family.(just think about it everytime you see these people there taking a family photo)..lollol
Anabolic Member
There are limits to everything.
Somehow, we are so arrogant to think we are so rich and powerful that we can help anyone/everyone.
As I mentioned above, I think that if we put our ego in check and thought with our wallets, we'd realize that instead of handouts, there should be some kind of a return to the american people. I am not trying to be Xenophobic here, just trying to get people to understand that the current mechanism is this
USA Borrows money and has to repay it, and it turn...
USA provides relief in a variety of forms, beneficiary does not have to pay it back
I totally get the emotional desire to help.
Nobody wants to look at the financial side of this and figure out how we pay for this besides borrowing more money.
Here's how our current financial and fiscal policies currently work in the USA
When times are prosperous, tax cuts and increased spending
When times are dire, tax cuts and increased spending
Terraj, I have absolutely no problem with Humanitarian emergency assistance on a personal level. individuals can do as they please. Churches can do as they please. But my effective tax rate on everything is about 50% of everything I make. When governments decide for me what to do with MY MONEY, then yes, I take this very personally. What happens when my effective rate goes to 60%... or 70%? What then? are we still the white knight savior to the world?
It is my belief that it is NOT a proper role of government to take my money and give it away to other nations. We have been hypnotised into thinking this is all ok since most of us have disposable income at the end of the month. But when you start adding up ALL the money they take from you, involuntarily, it is disturbing.
There will always be a crusaide for the government to throw money at. When do we start crusaiding to save ourselves?
Retired MONITOR
How ironic, here is times roman saying america should not get involved with aid in another country as there are local problems that america need to focus on. Coming from the man that jumped ship to be in Afganistan to earn more money. America spends billions more being involved in Iraq and Afganistan than it does sending aid to natural disaster zones. So times roman thinks its ok to spend billions being in other countries, losing good men to IED's, I guess he thinks as long as companies and rich people can make money it's ok. While donating choppers to help abandoned people out of floods is a bad thing. My view of you times roman has changed.
Oh just to back up what has been said, America flat out refused other countries help during Katrina, I guess the politicians were too pround and it would have been seen as weak to accept help.
Knowledgeable Member
It's a fvcking appalling state of affairs that America goes to war, simply so Colt can make money, Generals and Captains of Industry can make money, all the while allied soliders and Iraqi civilians are getting blown to bits as a consequence.
That there is a real fvcking disaster. Only that disaster makes certain people rich.
Retired MONITOR
Times roman on Japan-Fvck Japan, they can look after themselves.
Times roman on Afganistan and iraq-Lets get involved and spend billions, america-fvck yeah!
Knowledgeable Member
I must be illiterate because I have read through this thread 3x now and I cant see anywhere that Times Roman said fvck Japan in any way. Maybe you can point me to the proper post and quote it for me. Maybe it's next to the post where you say you only have sex with male 4 legged animals?
Maybe you should read his post in whole and not assume that you know what he is really thinking even though he says nothing of the sort in any of his post. As a matter of fact I didnt see where anyone said fvck Japan or any of it's people. I only read where people had op-pinons on if we can afford to help them financially or continue to try to police the whole world.
Now if you would consider editing your post to something that is more accurate I would very much like to do the same with this post.
Retired MONITOR
Its called paraphrasing, he said American government should not get involved in helping Japan. Sure after he back peddled after hearing other opinions he said aid should only be sent on a personal level. They dont need money as much as choppers and medics in the area. He kept his cards close to his chest until he knew he might have some back up. Did you not read my previous post???
Knowledgeable Member
I totally disagree. You are reading more into it than what is there I'm sure. You are not having an open mind at all or allowing anyone else to have an opinion without becoming emotionally attached to the subject and being quick to judge without reading all or knowing all the facts.
Do you generally think this of Times Roman or are you letting your emotions take place of logic? Do you notice that not even Terraj is having an issue with what Times Roman having his opinion so why are you?
Yes I read your other post, I also though WTF about that one because again you are judging someone you dont know, you dont know the facts and you are condemning him because of his decision on how to make a living and feed his family? If I, Times Roman or anyone decide we think you are a traitor or??? because of your job choice are you going to quite?
Instead of spouting a bunch of crap how about using some facts and explain what is wrong with him being in Afghanistan as a contractor? What should he be doing instead? Is this what you are doing? You would turn down the same opportunity if it was offered to you as him even though it may be 4x what you currently make because you are above the need of money? Please explain.
Again, Please show me where he says this, where the quote is? It was right next to you loving male pigs, right? I can paraphrase all day long how you like to suck on pigs curly little weenies but how accurate would that be? I'm going over the top here to try to make you see that you are also going over the top and out of line. I hope you get it so we can both edit this crap out.
Last edited by lovbyts; 03-13-2011 at 09:47 PM.
Retired MONITOR
When was I ever going over the top and out of line? My original post was simply pointing out the irony of TR being against aid being sent to Japan and working in Afganistan, private company or not. If you don't see the irony in that, especially with the cost of Afganistan vs the cost of aid, you are clearly less intelligent than I gave you credit for.
Retired MONITOR
If he doesnt like how US gov spend money then he has options as do all of you. You live in a democracy, and your foreign policy is supposed to be a reflection of your people. That may not always be true.
Did times roman not say he does not agree with sending aid?- thats what I meant about him saying "fvck japan, they can look after themselves" as that was his reasoning.
Anabolic Member
its bad taste to talk like this .there are people from all over on here and i respect everybody until its broken.it gives us a bad name .everybody out there already thinks we try to run the world.because we do put our nose in everything.personaly im sick of us spreading our selves thin in these middle eastern countries risking our younger brothers lives . but ive seen it first hand and with out us over there ,there would have been alot more repercutions all over the world.
Retired MONITOR
Can you see the irony? He disagrees with sending help by the means of search and rescue crews, yet he is happy to go work in Afganistan where th US is spending billions, and allied troops are being lost every day.
Retired MONITOR
Budget for the war In Iraq and Afganistan 2010 $37billion, toatal military budget 2010 $680billion,
Aid to japan-The aircraft carrier Ronald Reagan in the Western Pacific was ordered to the island nation. Other ships began making preparations to assist, including the Essex, a large-deck amphibious vessel equipped with helicopters. Two thousand Marines in Malaysia were ordered to be ready to move to Japan
All the aid being sent is already from the region, mainly things that are already being paid for to just be there anyway, and the types of things that are needed-rescue crews, medics, choppers. So don't go saying "we should spend money on health care, university, roads and debt rather than foreign aid. When in reality billions more is being spent on wars, money that could solve alot of americas current problems. The reason the wars go ahead are because the people that make personal gain from them are the rich and powerful people/companies that fund elections. That is why the US doesn't have a demoracy, I'm sure the intelligent people would rather have schools, healthcare, infrastructure and commonwealth rather than the current distibution of wealth.
Anabolic Member
I really don't know where to jump in at. The thread is all over the place.
I'm not sure why the need for me to defend myself here, but I'll take a stab at it....Regarding Afghanistan. I didn't create this environment. I came over here to help a friend solve a problem. I was very reluctant to come, but the money was good, so I said goodbye to my woman and children and made the trip. This was not a political decision on my part. It was simply an opportunity that presented itself to me. I am not responsible for what is happening here, the billions of dollars that are being wasted either. My project is renewable energy and energy efficiency. Solar street lights, electrifying clinics so women don't have to give birth by candle light at night. That sort of thing.
There is more than one vehicle for providing aid to Japan. I fully support helping Japan. But not at a governmental level with my tax dollars. If you spent the who knows how many hours it would take to read all these related threads, you'd see I've already asked Terraj to send me a link and I'll send $50 to help. If that's not enough, I'll send $100. I believe, as is my right to do so, that assistance should be on a voluntary level. How many of you are willing to crack open your dusty wallets and help? I'm guessing very few are really willing to do more than spout your mouth here, and keep your wallets in your pockets.
Here's the problem. People treat tax dollars as if it is "other peoples money". Other peoples money does NOT have the same value compared to your own money.
Here's a mental exercise to illustrate my point.
Suppose we prohibited employers from withholding payroll taxes, and instead, YOU had to write the IRS a check for your entire tax liablilty at the end of the year. Say you make $50k.... this would mean you would have to take your pen and check book out on April 15th and write a check for $17,500 dollars. Now this becomes YOUR money, and you feel the pain, you feel the anguish of paying real money for real taxes. Now the government wants to send $1billion in aid to Liberia. Assume 300m people, avg household is 4, so 75m households would have to come up with an additional $15. Not much you say. I agree. But now the same goes for Pakistan, but this time, it's 50b. Now you have to cut a check for $750 per household. But wait a minute! Suppose you can't afford this, or don't want to pay? In fact, we have a whole laundrey list of similar situations, so much so that you cannot realistically afford to pay for any of it. Can't afford to pay this? No problem says Obama... I'll just go borrow the money from my Chineese buddies, and your children can pay it back next generation.
For most of us... it really doesn't mean too much if we personally don't have to cut the checks out of our personal funds. BUT... if we did have to cut checks out of our personal funds, a sort of pay as you go type deal, then I guarantee you our whole perspective on what we spend real money on would change profoundly.
Now, for all you out there that are serious about helping Japan, please join me. Reach in your back pocket, pull your wallet out, and dig deep. These people need help. If we all contact Terraj and ask his opinion on how he felt the best way to help, collectively, we can make a difference.
Take some responsibility people. If you want something done, be proud, stand on your own two feet, and do it yourself!
Last edited by Times Roman; 03-14-2011 at 12:30 AM.
"3 stars and a sun"
let's just help each other in times like this....
Anabolic Member
the bottom line is were all individuals with our own opinions.And its ok to express them,even if there not on the same level.JUST have respect and a heart for the situation over there .someone has lost there children/mom/dad/brother/sister and so on. man i couldnt deal with that.and thank god we dont.
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Great debate...keep it clean.
Disclaimer-BG is presenting fictitious opinions and does in no way encourage nor condone the use of any illegal substances.
The information discussed is strictly for entertainment purposes only.
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