Keeping your gains after a cycle.

[rockinred]

So this is what this board has come to? No more advice on PCT. Steroids are temporary gains lost after you come off and Ronnie's training method is the only way to keep gains?? I remember when Ronnie first came on here and he is a great guy with a big heart and great training ideas... but come on people?

Does anyone here believe in the science behind anabolics? What about protein synthesis, increase metabolism, etc... all this has gone by the way side?

I see more people lose all the work due to going back to eating piss poor, working out with the same ol little weight, and eating the same as a 10 year old boy. Then they look at steroids like it was a big waste of time and I shake my head inside and see their ways and want to say something but just don't. PCT is not proven fact, but it definetly can help. But the gains made running anabolics are real although holding on to the muscle gains is another story. Takes discipline and hard work and diet.

There is hope friends, but there are no miracle pills. Let's keep it on track here. The idea of running Deca only is pretty silly. I see silly shit all the time.... looking back on history and saying, they did this or that without trying to learn something or improve the science is just looking for reasons to do things.

Keep hard work and pay your dues in the gym and you will continue to build on the base of your cycles. That's why we call them cycles.

[slimshady01]

So this is what this board has come to? No more advice on PCT. Steroids are temporary gains lost after you come off and Ronnie's training method is the only way to keep gains?? I remember when Ronnie first came on here and he is a great guy with a big heart and great training ideas... but come on people?

Does anyone here believe in the science behind anabolics? What about protein synthesis, increase metabolism, etc... all this has gone by the way side?

I see more people lose all the work due to going back to eating piss poor, working out with the same ol little weight, and eating the same as a 10 year old boy. Then they look at steroids like it was a big waste of time and I shake my head inside and see their ways and want to say something but just don't. PCT is not proven fact, but it definetly can help. But the gains made running anabolics are real although holding on to the muscle gains is another story. Takes discipline and hard work and diet.

There is hope friends, but there are no miracle pills. Let's keep it on track here. The idea of running Deca only is pretty silly. I see silly shit all the time.... looking back on history and saying, they did this or that without trying to learn something or improve the science is just looking for reasons to do things.

Keep hard work and pay your dues in the gym and you will continue to build on the base of your cycles. That's why we call them cycles.

If you are young and want to recover then yes do PCT, you will keep more gains doing PCT then not. And for health reasons im sure its a lot healthier doing the time on time off then staying on year round.

My buddy is 40 years old and is a genetic freak. He looks better then 90% of us here natural and on cycle he is a beast. I believe he runs just one cycle a year during the summer months to be absolutley ripped. Then come fall runs PCT and stays natural until the next summer.

IMO that is not a bad way of doing things if you are just doing it for vanity. He still looks beast in the winter but really good in the summer on cycle. If he loses some during his time off so what. Where he lives they get 6 feet of snow a month in the winter so he just bundles up, eats healthy and trains hard for preparation for the months that count.

[Exevious]

So this is what this board has come to? No more advice on PCT. Steroids are temporary gains lost after you come off and Ronnie's training method is the only way to keep gains?? I remember when Ronnie first came on here and he is a great guy with a big heart and great training ideas... but come on people?

Does anyone here believe in the science behind anabolics? What about protein synthesis, increase metabolism, etc... all this has gone by the way side?

I see more people lose all the work due to going back to eating piss poor, working out with the same ol little weight, and eating the same as a 10 year old boy. Then they look at steroids like it was a big waste of time and I shake my head inside and see their ways and want to say something but just don't. PCT is not proven fact, but it definetly can help. But the gains made running anabolics are real although holding on to the muscle gains is another story. Takes discipline and hard work and diet.

There is hope friends, but there are no miracle pills. Let's keep it on track here. The idea of running Deca only is pretty silly. I see silly shit all the time.... looking back on history and saying, they did this or that without trying to learn something or improve the science is just looking for reasons to do things.

Keep hard work and pay your dues in the gym and you will continue to build on the base of your cycles. That's why we call them cycles.

I agree 100%. Like we tell the under 25 crowd..... eat right, eat right, eat right.... and bust your ass in the gym. YOu gotta do this during pct and after.
How do you think the natty guys get large?? there are plenty that eat right and bust thier ass.... The discipline has to be maintained during cycle, durning pct, and after cycle... it just the after cycle depression phucks alot of guys up... from what I can figure out anyway

[Far from massive]

I think one thing a lot of people forget is that very few people are at their true genetic potential, this requires a huge commitment to training and diet and years and years of work. My feelings based on what I have seen in the past 38 yrs both in my own experience and from observing those around me who lift for looks and power is that steroids are rarely used solely as a physiologic aid to help one surpass true natural limitations. The reason I feel this is important is because if you are someone who is in their late 20s- 40s and has been lifting semiseriously for a few years and goes ahead and does a cycle the sudden gains and feeling of wellbeing almost always result in an increased desire to gain or lift more, now these days with all the information at hand its easy to turn this into real knowlege and improve ones diet, workouts and sleep patterns by doing this it is very easy to keep at least half of the muscle gains seen on a short cycle (bloat is another story). Now back in the old days it was very easy to wind up coming off and without all the information on diet, PCT, and training the thing you were likely to do was to go back on way too soon to try to keep up the gains.

So the point I am trying to make is for the casual lifter its easy to keep gains seen during a cycle, now is it really keeping the gains if you alter your training and diet because of an increased desire for growth? Well I guess to be fair its not but still the point remains that many who start down this path and implement proper training and PCT, time off etc. will indeed see greater growth than their natural constituents, whether this is physiological or psychological is splitting hairs the point is that gains through cycling are often seen compared to those who do not cycle. So although there are certainly risks there are certainly gains to be seen also.

Ohh also to touch briefly on another point, gyno, lack of erections, and all these other problems that I constantly hear about these days rarely happened back in the old days and also they rarely happen to people from my age group who are now doing steroids 40s-50s. Its my feeling that there is a connection between a sedintary lifestyle or todays kids average diet or both that is causing so many problems from AAS usage but this is a topic for another thread ;-)

[dec11]

I think one thing a lot of people forget is that very few people are at their true genetic potential, this requires a huge commitment to training and diet and years and years of work. My feelings based on what I have seen in the past 38 yrs both in my own experience and from observing those around me who lift for looks and power is that steroids are rarely used solely as a physiologic aid to help one surpass true natural limitations. The reason I feel this is important is because if you are someone who is in their late 20s- 40s and has been lifting semiseriously for a few years and goes ahead and does a cycle the sudden gains and feeling of wellbeing almost always result in an increased desire to gain or lift more, now these days with all the information at hand its easy to turn this into real knowlege and improve ones diet, workouts and sleep patterns by doing this it is very easy to keep at least half of the muscle gains seen on a short cycle (bloat is another story). Now back in the old days it was very easy to wind up coming off and without all the information on diet, PCT, and training the thing you were likely to do was to go back on way too soon to try to keep up the gains.

So the point I am trying to make is for the casual lifter its easy to keep gains seen during a cycle, now is it really keeping the gains if you alter your training and diet because of an increased desire for growth? Well I guess to be fair its not but still the point remains that many who start down this path and implement proper training and PCT, time off etc. will indeed see greater growth than their natural constituents, whether this is physiological or psychological is splitting hairs the point is that gains through cycling are often seen compared to those who do not cycle. So although there are certainly risks there are certainly gains to be seen also.

Ohh also to touch briefly on another point, gyno, lack of erections, and all these other problems that I constantly hear about these days rarely happened back in the old days and also they rarely happen to people from my age group who are now doing steroids 40s-50s. Its my feeling that there is a connection between a sedintary lifestyle or todays kids average diet or both that is causing so many problems from AAS usage but this is a topic for another thread ;-)

correct, i started AAS with a 16yrs natural powerlifting base and never got much higher than 200lbs and if i came off my trt i know id drop from 220lbs back down to that 200lbs, its happened before.