Critique My First Cycle?

[jg096]

Hey guys,

Looking to start my first cycle. I'm 5'10 and about 165, been lifting seriously for probably a year and a half and I'm looking to just put as much size on as possible. I figure if I'm going to juice up I'm gonna go all out, and as such I'm considering a pretty serious stack for my first cycle.

I'm thinking about taking:
* DBOL 25 mg/day for the first 8 weeks (maybe 6?)
* Androl 50mg/day
* DECA 200 mg/day
* Test-Cyp 400 mg/week

I need something to keep the gyno away too. I've read about people taking .5 mg Arimadex every other day in order to keep the estrogen away; not sure if that's the move or nolvadex is better or what.

Also, does anyone have any experience taking accutane while on a cycle? I did a round probably about a year ago and my skin has been great since but I'm worried that the juice might make me break out pretty bad because before the accutane I was pretty prone to cystic acne. I've read about some people taking a 20 mg pill every 3 days to keep the acne at bay. With that said though I don't know if its a great idea to be combining already liver-toxic oral steroids like DBOL with Accutane which is hard on the liver as well.

Thanks for any help you guys could give. I'm looking forward to getting ****ing huge

[DanielFJimenez]

too much juice for ur first cycle, think

[jg096]

So what do you recommend? I was originally just thinking DBOL + Test but I heard that you'll never grow like you will on your first cycle and so I was thinking I would just go all out with it.

I'd like to atleast keep the DBOL+Test+ something else, whether that be Androl or DECA or whatever but like I said I'm just trying to bulk up hard here.

[davidtheman100]

First cycle should be Test only 500mg/week with an AI on cycle and using HCG 250iu 2ce a week 12-15 week cycle 15 is probably pushing it a little bit for a first

[davidtheman100]

You wanna add the compounds as slow as possible keep going with the same stuff that's true to you at smallest dose possible if you're still seeing results so you build up somewhat of a tolerance slowly instead of starting at high doses and then needed even more the next time instead you'll have a lower dose and be able to make just as good gains as someone taking a shit load because you started more conservatively plus it's better on your wallet and better for your health

[NACH3]

Yeah agree w/above, you got all the heavy hitters(besides Tren thank God) but in all honesty it's way too much gear!

Stick w/test e or c... AI hcg on cycle from the gate! You'll make plenty of gains if your diet and training are on point, on a simple test only cycle....

Where was your DA for prolactin issues if you couldn't dial in your AI(which takes time) yiur E2 and prolactin would be elevated(get pre mid post pct BW)
Pct
Clomid - 75/50/50/50 Nolva - 40/20/20/20 on 500mgs of test wkly

Edit*** rethink this.... As Marcus set you up w/great advice, as well as what/how to do things - now start reading up on these things(man I wish I joined this site when I was your age)!!!!!!!

[jg096]

What about if I go with the basic Dbol+ Test cycle... 25 mg DBOL/day and 500mg Test/week? I'd basically just follow the beginner bulk on the steroid.com website

Could you expand on the PCT? Are you saying I should be taking Clomid & Nolvadox at the same time? During or after cycle?

[blakegains]

You should read " THE YOUNG AND THE STEROIDS " before you do anything, that way you can't be mad at yourself down the road if you jack yourself up. If you're 18 your natural testosterone production should be high and will continue to be high until you're in your 30's ( maybe longer ). When I was your age I blew up like a balloon just by eating and doing push-ups, pull-ups and body weight squats. Not too mention you might actually stunt your growth and you won't get as tall or wide as you would normally.

That being said, I'm on my 1st cycle of test only based off of austinites my first cycle sticky and I'm seeing great results already. I know it's tempting to start with a bunch of compounds at first, I had the same temptation. But this shit isn't like taking supplements, if you don't do it right you will end up with a host of problems and have a horrible experience. All you have to do it read around the board to see people that jumped in head first asking for help because they have gyno and limp dick. You are going to have know idea how to control estrogen and prolactin sides or which is causing which. I'm also guessing if you're 18 that you probably don't have a enough money to fund all of this. Yes, if you're are only looking back at the gear it doesn't seem expensive but when you add Food, ancillaries, hcg, pinning supplies, blood work, supplements will cost waaaaay more than the actual gear itself. What does your meal planning consist of on a weekly basis? If your diet isn't on point your results will suffer. Are mom, dad, girlfriend etc.... Okay with you shooting needles into yourself? Don't think you will be able to hide it.... Because you probably won't be able to. Hats off to those that can.

Look man I honestly don't care what you do and I'm not trying to be a dick, but someone has to say it. Just ask yourself all of these questions before you do anything... Then read the 1st cycle sticky and all the other stickies that austinite has in the educational database. Learn how to cycle safely so you can do it for years to come. ( I suggest you wait until around 25 for the record ).

When I calculated the costs for a simple test only cycle I figured it to be around 2300. You can do it for about 300 less but I like to use BCAA's. I like to eat good, with plenty of fresh food on hand so you can round down some if your diet is more plain. Just think about all of these things buddy, not trying to bash you.... Just trying to get you to think. I met a guy on vacation a while back, he was a pretty big guy and looked a little fat like a power builder but was solid. I found at after getting to know him that he used to play college football. Later when we were at the pool and he took his shirt off he exposed what were probably a solid size C or D cup set of man tits. This was'nt just from fat as the rest of his body wasn't really that fat. I felt horrible for him.....but my curiosity made me ask him how he got the tits. ( after I got to know him ) he explained that he used AAS without knowing what he was doing while he was playing football. He didn't have the money for surgery but was planning on it as soon as possible. He was probably in his late twenties or early thirties.
Just imagine, when he was your age.... He was saying " oh it won't happen to me " .
Use your head and good luck

[JesusFisio21]

I think that 8 - 6 week for dbol for the first cycle is excessive. 4 - 5 weeks monday - friday is fine.

[marcus300]

At 18yrs old you don't want to be shutting down your natural test, this will be a big mistake. Look into your diet and training for further gains imho

[marcus300]

There isn't an exact age were we all stop developing and growing because this is determined by our genes and DNA, we are all genetically programmed individually and we inherit our genes from our parents. To give an exact age we stop growing would be incorrect because everyone's genetic blueprint is different.The main development of our bodies is up to the age of 21yrs of age but this can vary between individuals. There are parts of our bodies what carry on developing and adjusting slowly up until the age of 25yrs old, an example of this is the brain. The Endocrine system is a part of the brain what is very complex and keeps our bodies in a homeostasis state. Our testosterone levels start raising and roughly peak around 25yrs old and then start to slowly decline, so even though some of us may have stopped growing at the age of 21yrs old, others may still be developing up until the age of 25yrs old.

I have recently spoken to my Endo regarding this matter and he tells me that the HPTA is very sensitive and as many pathways how it regulates the human body, he states steroids disrupt the normal balance of hormones in the body which can cause reversible and irreversible changes at any age but risks are far more if you administrate exogenous androgens during development, this will put you in a very unnatural environment at a crucial time and your hormones should be treated with care especially in the early stages of maturity. The adverse effects can be erratic behaviour of the HPTA and potentially therapy when your older.

I did ask him what age he would think would be the safest as far as risk to damages and he said many endocrinologist suggest full maturation is reached by 25 years of age and this would also give the HPTA time to be established with your natural hormone balance and patterns. I personally feel 24-25yrs old would also be ideal starting point to get bloodwrok drawn to see exact what your natural levels are before starting any kind of cycles and waiting till you have reach your testosterone peak would be a good starting point, for me there is to much evidence over the forums and what I've seen personally over the last 25yrs I've been bodybuilding. Obviously it isn't going to be all 19- 21yr old bodybuilders who suffer side effects what are irreversible but I am edging on the side of caution what age I advice to the newbies.
Marcus

[marcus300]

TRAINING
You need a few years of hard training under your belt before even considering taking any kind of anabolic support, people who jump on a cycle to soon without having some quality years under their belt usually results in injuries, it takes time to develop your connective tissue, tendons and nervous system to heavy overload training. Slowly getting your own system use to these kinds of extreme's will only help in muscle growth later on when you do decide to start taking AAS.

Build a solid foundation for muscle tissue to grow and maintaining and development will be far greater than without it. Many younger guys will start cycling before they have reached their genetic potential which is crazy when a good solid diet and training program will be far beneficial and productive to muscle building.

Workouts should be mainly focused on basic movements with a priority of over loading the muscle each and ever time you train, increasing your strength and ability to lift in proper form will help with building the foundation for future development


DIET
A lot of younger bodybuilders don't know how to eat. Researching and understanding how your own body responds will help you get to your natural limit, the right food at the right time and a full understanding of proteins,carbs, and fats will only help you succeed in achieving your natural goals. Keeping a diet diary will also help you understand the importance of macro, nutrients, calories and should help you see in which areas you could be going wrong in adding lean muscle tissue.

No matter how much anabolic support you have it will be worthless without proper nutrition, food will help build and maintain your valued muscle weather its natural, cycling or in PCT. Adjusting your food intake and consuming muscle building foods coupled with a solid training program will help you achieve your natural limit and foundation before you start AAS use.

This area is a huge problem with the younger guys and I can't express enough how important diet/food is when first starting out, post and pre training nutrition are very important and understanding how to load and feed the body will help push growth and create a very natural anabolic environment.

[jg096]

You are going to have know idea how to control estrogen and prolactin sides or which is causing which. I'm also guessing if you're 18 that you probably don't have a enough money to fund all of this. Yes, if you're are only looking back at the gear it doesn't seem expensive but when you add Food, ancillaries, hcg, pinning supplies, blood work, supplements will cost waaaaay more than the actual gear itself. What does your meal planning consist of on a weekly basis? If your diet isn't on point your results will suffer. Are mom, dad, girlfriend etc.... Okay with you shooting needles into yourself? Don't think you will be able to hide it.... Because you probably won't be able to. Hats off to those that can.

Look man I honestly don't care what you do and I'm not trying to be a dick, but someone has to say it. Just ask yourself all of these questions before you do anything... Then read the 1st cycle sticky and all the other stickies that austinite has in the educational database. Learn how to cycle safely so you can do it for years to come. ( I suggest you wait until around 25 for the record ).

I'm not at all offended by what you're saying, I appreciate the response even if it isn't exactly what I was looking for here. I'm just so tired of this plateau that I've been sitting at man, I feel like I haven't gained any size recently and my lifts have been staying pretty constant; I realize that if I monitor my diet more and trained harder I could probably make some kind of gains but I just really am tired of being where I'm at. With that said though I do realize that steroids are not the magic shortcut to getting big and if, or more like when, I do decide to juice I would pay very close attention to my diet and training.

Money isn't really an issue, i have the money to spend right now from my job and I'm willing to spend whatever it is on the cycle.

With that said, do you really think a proper DBOL + test cycle would mess me up that bad? I got my natural test levels checked a few months back and if i remember correctly they were at like 750, not sure what free test was at. I plan on seeing a doctor and monitoring my blood throughout the entire cycle to make sure I'm not doing too much damage.

If I understand correctly though proper pct with nolvadex and maybe some hcg will keep the gyno away and get my natural test levels pretty much back to normal

As far as knowing the difference between estrogen and prolactin related side effects you're probably right honestly, but I'm hoping the doctor I see will be able to help me out with that.

[Avi3510]

It sounds like you have a lot to learn. The articles suggested are a must. Especially my first cycle by austinite. And in my opinion, you no doubt have a lot more natural potential that you can tap into. Maybe start a new thread in the training section with your routine and macros and see what people have to say. A lot of times when people plateau they try and do more when sometimes the answer is less volume to let your cns recover. Or maybe switching things up. Your young and light. Be patient my friend, it's a marathon not a sprint, unless you wanna get burned out. I've spent the last year reading and reading and reading on this site and I am so thankful I have. I would suggest the same to anyone interested in gearing up.

[Joco71]

At 5'10 and 165lbs you have alot of room to grow naturally. If your smart you will listen to the advice that has been given.

[diragz]

I know you hear it a lot from these guys but theyre spot on mate. Dial in your diet and nutrition first to get the most out of the cycle. The only real reason to add compounds is to continue to progress and i gaurentee youll be happy with just 500mg of test on your first cycle.

[blakegains]

You're are not grasping any of the concepts that everyone is trying to relay to you my man. It sounds like you are going to have to learn the hard way. If you have hit a plateau then you have to look at your diet and training, NOT AAS! If you can't make gains naturally then you will have a hard time with AAS. If you don't have money concerns then hire a trainer if you are that desperate. Most people don't have Money for trainers, so they go to the Marcus diaries thread to learn new techniques. If you have hit a plateau then you aren't training hard enough or its time for you to switch you routine and training type.
I know you probably won't do it but post your daily meal plan in the diet and nutrition section and the pros on here will help you figure out what your are doing wrong and right.
Spend some money on some good quality supplements, go to a nutrition corner if you have one and get your supplements in check too.
You will be Happier with your results in the long run if you go the route we are all telling you. Everyone here is very supportive and will help you as much as you want and in the BEST way possible.

[jg096]

I've been slacking for the last few weeks honestly; but usually i try to stick to about 3k calories a day with a 50% carb 30% protein 20% fat macro breakdown. As far as supplements I use whey, creatine, and L-argenine.

I usually train 4-5 days a week for about 60-90 minutes. I used to stick exclusively to a 3 day cycle of back bis x chest tris shoulders x legs, but recently I've been focusing on hitting like one muscle or sometimes two and just trying to work it as hard as I can. My workouts are usually 5x5 of as much weight as I can handle, but recently my diet has just been off and my lifts are way down because of it.

I'm not stupid and I definitely realize i'm not at my genetic peak, I'm just super dissatisfied with where i'm at honestly. Like I'm not small but I'm so far from where I want to be; and I just feel like, especially recently, the progress has been really slow. Again, I know it takes time and admittedly I realize I'm kinda looking for shortcuts here but I'm just not satisfied with where I'm at currently.

I was just trying to weigh the pros and cons of doing a cycle, and after I did some research it kinda seemed to me that with proper PCT and blood monitoring that I wouldn't have much to worry about in terms of my health or my natural test levels afterwords. Admittedly I was considering way too much juice at first , but what about a cycle of straight test or test + dbol?