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Thread: BHB (ketone salts) ?

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    BHB (ketone salts) ?

    Does anyone have an exogenous Ketone brand they like?

    Trying to find a relatively inexpensive BHB (Ketone salt) powder to get.
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

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    You need to school me on this. Girlfriend is serios about the keto diet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke View Post
    You need to school me on this. Girlfriend is serios about the keto diet.
    It’s a Ketone salt that gets you into ketosis faster. So it helps get you into it on the first week. Then if you have a cheat meal or carb up day it kicks you back into ketosis. They didn’t really have this when I was running Keto for contest preps and I would take 2-3 days to get back in it seemed like.
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

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    I get frustrated when reading on the keto diet on this forum. From my experience the only inaccurate thing being reported on here. To become ketogenic for most people takes around 4-6 weeks. For the most part, urine strips are not accurate especially if you are taking ketone salts. And they only test for bhb which isn’t the only indicator of ketosis. You will be in “ketosis” when taking ketone salts, your body however is just temporarily fooled. There actual intended use is to aid in keto flu when you are transitioning from carbs to fats. The marketing is flawed like most supplements. When i took ketone salts to get into ketosis i felt even worse than having keto flu.

    This is just my humble, well educated opinion though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clove1234 View Post
    I get frustrated when reading on the keto diet on this forum. From my experience the only inaccurate thing being reported on here. To become ketogenic for most people takes around 4-6 weeks. For the most part, urine strips are not accurate especially if you are taking ketone salts. And they only test for bhb which isn’t the only indicator of ketosis. You will be in “ketosis” when taking ketone salts, your body however is just temporarily fooled. There actual intended use is to aid in keto flu when you are transitioning from carbs to fats. The marketing is flawed like most supplements. When i took ketone salts to get into ketosis i felt even worse than having keto flu.

    This is just my humble, well educated opinion though.
    Weeks or days? I test both blood and urine and can be into Ketosis anywhere from 3-5 days. 5 is really if I’m not strict. I agree with the Ketone supplements, after reading up on them more. It’s to expensive for basically not aiding you to get through the Keto flu. Which the last few times I’ve bounced in and out actually hasn’t been a problem.
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    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

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    a completely different point then threads intent, but I'll throw it out there.

    exogenous ketones could be a tool for insulin using bodybuilders to use. why?

    well insulin "over dose" , and its accompanying coma and brain shut down and then death comes about because the brain is immediatley starved of its only fuel source, glucose. and its starved of it very very rapidly. and its in a state where it has no other fuel source to function . so the brain shuts down and you go into diabetic shock and coma.

    however, if your body was in a full state of ketosis things are different. your brain is running off ketones. its impossible to starve your brain of glucose with insulin in this state. you could take 30iu of insulin with no carbs and go hypo and your brain will never shut down, because its not glucose dependent anyways.

    when your glucose dependent , rather then keto adapted, your brain can only use glucose as fuel. you have no ability to suddenly produce ketones when you run out of glucose, it takes days, but your brain does not have days. when it runs out of glucose and has no other fuel source available then it dies.

    heres where exogenous ketones come in. IF they were always floating around the blood stream , then your brain would always have a back up source of energy and never go into diabetic low blood sugar coma.

    ^ this is all just ideas I'm floating around . I have plenty of experience with Keto diet, but zero experience with exogenous ketones. also plenty of experience with insulin .
    so this is all theoretical . only thing I know is that there was a study done on people who fasted for several weeks and were put into ketosis and then medically supervised and were administered 20iu of slin which plummeted blood sugar but had zero effects on the brain. a glucose dependent brain would of passed out or possibly even more
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    a completely different point then threads intent, but I'll throw it out there.

    exogenous ketones could be a tool for insulin using bodybuilders to use. why?

    well insulin "over dose" , and its accompanying coma and brain shut down and then death comes about because the brain is immediatley starved of its only fuel source, glucose. and its starved of it very very rapidly. and its in a state where it has no other fuel source to function . so the brain shuts down and you go into diabetic shock and coma.

    however, if your body was in a full state of ketosis things are different. your brain is running off ketones. its impossible to starve your brain of glucose with insulin in this state. you could take 30iu of insulin with no carbs and go hypo and your brain will never shut down, because its not glucose dependent anyways.

    when your glucose dependent , rather then keto adapted, your brain can only use glucose as fuel. you have no ability to suddenly produce ketones when you run out of glucose, it takes days, but your brain does not have days. when it runs out of glucose and has no other fuel source available then it dies.

    heres where exogenous ketones come in. IF they were always floating around the blood stream , then your brain would always have a back up source of energy and never go into diabetic low blood sugar coma.

    ^ this is all just ideas I'm floating around . I have plenty of experience with Keto diet, but zero experience with exogenous ketones. also plenty of experience with insulin .
    so this is all theoretical . only thing I know is that there was a study done on people who fasted for several weeks and were put into ketosis and then medically supervised and were administered 20iu of slin which plummeted blood sugar but had zero effects on the brain. a glucose dependent brain would of passed out or possibly even more
    Really interesting

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    Quote Originally Posted by Obspowerstroke View Post
    Really interesting
    I have a tendency to nerd out on some of this stuff


    when I did HVAC, I nerded out on how to replace a 5million btu boiler with three twinned together smaller boilers staged , with an awesome controls package on how to stage these boilers based on outside are temp and building demand while also having a loop that took care of building hot water set at 120 degrees.

    I'm a nerd and bad ass all in one. you need to take your stock haybusa motorcycle and make it run low 8s in the quarter mile I'm your man (and I'll drive it for you too).

    and being I'm talking about myself it should be obvious that I had 5 days in a row workout out two a days and training and tonight I'm hitting that bourbon
    Last edited by GearHeaded; 12-28-2017 at 11:44 PM.
    MuscleScience and almostgone like this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    a completely different point then threads intent, but I'll throw it out there.

    exogenous ketones could be a tool for insulin using bodybuilders to use. why?

    well insulin "over dose" , and its accompanying coma and brain shut down and then death comes about because the brain is immediatley starved of its only fuel source, glucose. and its starved of it very very rapidly. and its in a state where it has no other fuel source to function . so the brain shuts down and you go into diabetic shock and coma.

    however, if your body was in a full state of ketosis things are different. your brain is running off ketones. its impossible to starve your brain of glucose with insulin in this state. you could take 30iu of insulin with no carbs and go hypo and your brain will never shut down, because its not glucose dependent anyways.

    when your glucose dependent , rather then keto adapted, your brain can only use glucose as fuel. you have no ability to suddenly produce ketones when you run out of glucose, it takes days, but your brain does not have days. when it runs out of glucose and has no other fuel source available then it dies.

    heres where exogenous ketones come in. IF they were always floating around the blood stream , then your brain would always have a back up source of energy and never go into diabetic low blood sugar coma.

    ^ this is all just ideas I'm floating around . I have plenty of experience with Keto diet, but zero experience with exogenous ketones. also plenty of experience with insulin .
    so this is all theoretical . only thing I know is that there was a study done on people who fasted for several weeks and were put into ketosis and then medically supervised and were administered 20iu of slin which plummeted blood sugar but had zero effects on the brain. a glucose dependent brain would of passed out or possibly even more
    Never thought of it that way, but that sounds like it could work. However if you’re using Slin you are also probdbly taking on tons of carbs. I wonder how long the brain will keep all the enzymes in an upregulated State after carbs are reintroduced back a Keto adapted body.
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

    "Juice slow, train smart, it's a long journey."
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    "In a world full of pussies, being a redneck is not a bad thing."
    OB

    Body building is a way of life..........but can not get in the way of your life.
    BG

    No Source Check Please, I don't know of any.


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    Quote Originally Posted by MuscleScience View Post
    However if you’re using Slin you are also probdbly taking on tons of carbs. .
    no its not how it works its how its generally preached to be safe I guess , but for a lot of guys they can run slin without over doing the carbs. its all about dialing it in ..

    this is an advanced protocol and I don't recommend it to anyone other then the advanced. but I'm not one to hold back BS and will openly say I've helped on this very forum an advanced person, (and am helping multiple guys) someone that is metabolizing the insulin and carbs very very well .
    they are on a diet and carbs are restricted , yet 25iu of insulin a day is totally do able . you got to know your own body!!!!

    insulin use does not mean you have to force down the calories or carbs and get fat .. hell I take insulin pre workout with no carbs to lean out

    gotta love this shit guys !!!
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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    no its not how it works its how its generally preached to be safe I guess , but for a lot of guys they can run slin without over doing the carbs. its all about dialing it in ..

    this is an advanced protocol and I don't recommend it to anyone other then the advanced. but I'm not one to hold back BS and will openly say I've helped on this very forum an advanced person, (and am helping multiple guys) someone that is metabolizing the insulin and carbs very very well .
    they are on a diet and carbs are restricted , yet 25iu of insulin a day is totally do able . you got to know your own body!!!!

    insulin use does not mean you have to force down the calories or carbs and get fat .. hell I take insulin pre workout with no carbs to lean out

    gotta love this shit guys !!!
    Damn, I’m completely ignorant of how to use exogenous Slin. I just assumed guys would pound a meal or post workout and fortify it with 20-40 grams of carbs to keep from dropping blood sugars to low.

    You’re a huge wealth of information on bodybuilding protocols and methodology. I’ve literally been took to school daily since you started posting.

    This place has it all.
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

    "Juice slow, train smart, it's a long journey."
    BG

    "In a world full of pussies, being a redneck is not a bad thing."
    OB

    Body building is a way of life..........but can not get in the way of your life.
    BG

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    I have a tendency to nerd out on some of this stuff


    when I did HVAC, I nerded out on how to replace a 5million btu boiler with three twinned together smaller boilers staged , with an awesome controls package on how to stage these boilers based on outside are temp and building demand while also having a loop that took care of building hot water set at 120 degrees.

    I'm a nerd and bad ass all in one. you need to take your stock haybusa motorcycle and make it run low 8s in the quarter mile I'm your man (and I'll drive it for you too).

    and being I'm talking about myself it should be obvious that I had 5 days in a row workout out two a days and training and tonight I'm hitting that bourbon
    Nerding out left me like powerlifting. I saw what I was up against and turned back to the comforts of being a meathead. I have very strange knowledge. I can fix anything on the planet, but I don't delve deep like you guys. Brain is clogged with titties, engines, trees, my kids, exes and hoe's.

    Appreciate you all though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    and being I'm talking about myself it should be obvious that I had 5 days in a row workout out two a days and training and tonight I'm hitting that bourbon
    that was a horrible idea. going 5 days straight of two a day workouts and then drinking shots of bourbon going into my recovery day , wtf was I thinking, now everything is twice as sore and achy as it would have been had I stuck to shots of whey isolate

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    Quote Originally Posted by GearHeaded View Post
    that was a horrible idea. going 5 days straight of two a day workouts and then drinking shots of bourbon going into my recovery day , wtf was I thinking, now everything is twice as sore and achy as it would have been had I stuck to shots of whey isolate
    Haha, i got hammered xmas night and am steal dehydrated as hell from it. My legs cramp at nearly the first sign of bending or going down a stair...lol
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

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    This took a turn haha.

    Musclescience to answer your question. The average, overweight person that this diet is recommended too takes between 4-6 weeks to reach an efficient level of ketosis. Roughly 2-4 millimoler on blood reading. I did a couple of studies on this at school. Reaching therapeutic levels i.e. Alzheimer’s, autism, epilepsy can take even longer to achieve.

    Most people on here i guess are not average, working out hard and being lean already. You are able to lower your glycogen/glucose more rapidly. And if you are lean your body already has experience using fat for fuel.

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    I am following this now. I have run a type of keto strict diet before for 21 days and never had cravings for bread before and these were unreal. I have seen a lot of people talking about this now and I am very interested in the subject.

    I have not really done hard stuff much in the last 10+ years other than a once or twice a year. After last week drinking night that turned out bad, and turning 49, I am giving up alcohol for this next year. If all goes well, then I might just say fuck it and be a non drinker. Went out last night and had a great time not drinking watching some football. I had a few diet sodas and water and told the server I was driving. When the bar tab hit the table my bill was zero other than the tip.
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    It’s worth a shot. Ive done four months strict keto. Total body and mind transformation. However, its not for everyone like any diet. And i really do not thing its most conducive to gaining mass.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Clove1234 View Post
    It’s worth a shot. Ive done four months strict keto. Total body and mind transformation. However, its not for everyone like any diet. And i really do not thing its most conducive to gaining mass.
    I tried to bulk in Keto in the past, all that happened was that I got leaner...lol

    For me, I’m going to use it for cutting and maintance.
    If you can't explain it to a second grader, you probably don't understand it yourself. Albert Einstein

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    OB

    Body building is a way of life..........but can not get in the way of your life.
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  19. #19
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    My experience as well, you need fat to gain weight. The only way to hold onto fat is to have another source of fuel, carbs. Unless you are as gifted as some of the people that post on here who are 10% BF, want to gain mass and get leaner lol
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