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  1. #1
    JuicyJim is offline Junior Member
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    why can't former pros like flex and titus keep their size?

    I've noticed a trend with a lot of bodybuilder's that retire, they shrink to the size of normal men. i know this has to do alot with the fact that their no longer running insane amounts of sauce, but i thought taking HGH was supposed to help bodybuilder's retain that mass(by actually creating new muscle tissue, as opposed to just adding on with aas) I saw recent photos of flex wheeler and it looks as if he never was a bodybuilder, he looked like some regular guy, and i know titus has his own reasons why he's doesn't look good, but damn he's smaller than me now.

    any thoughts why these guys aren't retaining their size, or atleast some of it

  2. #2
    Anabolios's Avatar
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    They arent as into the sport anymore so they dont emphasize their life on it...they dont train/eat/juice even close to as much

  3. #3
    JuicyJim is offline Junior Member
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    that makes sense, but let's say that hypothetically that Ronnie Coleman droped all the aas and just kept doing the HGH, and kept training and eating very well, do you think that then he could still keep most of that mass??

  4. #4
    Warrior's Avatar
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    It takes a lot of work, food and gear to get that size - your body hates to be that ineffecient (it sees it like dropping a V8 in a Chevette!)... and it takes a lot of calories and brutal training for your body to even begin to accept a lot of muscle weight... and being lean - low bodyfat at any weight to your system means possibility of death from starvation...

    If you stop feeding it the stimulis it needs - bye, bye muscle. And if you keep eating like you did - hello fat!

    I wouldn't call them "normal" - they are still athletes in good shape IMO...

  5. #5
    vitor is offline Anabolic Member
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    with normal hormone levels there is only so much that your body is able to keep. All gains over natrual-limit will be lost if you go natrual long enough. Steroid gains are not permenent!!

  6. #6
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    symatech is offline Retired Moderator
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    let's say that hypothetically that Ronnie Coleman droped all the aas and just kept doing the HGH, and kept training and eating very well, do you think that then he could still keep most of that mass??
    nope

  7. #7
    Dave321 is offline AR's Salad Tossing Connoisseur
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior
    It takes a lot of work, food and gear to get that size - your body hates to be that ineffecient (it sees it like dropping a V8 in a Chevette!)... and it takes a lot of calories and brutal training for your body to even begin to accept a lot of muscle weight... and being lean - low bodyfat at any weight to your system means possibility of death from starvation...

    If you stop feeding it the stimulis it needs - bye, bye muscle. And if you keep eating like you did - hello fat!

    I wouldn't call them "normal" - they are still athletes in good shape IMO...
    Completely agree!

  8. #8
    man-g is offline Associate Member
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    incredible good old lou still keeps his size....but i guess he still train/eat/sauces ;-)

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Warrior
    It takes a lot of work, food and gear to get that size - your body hates to be that ineffecient (it sees it like dropping a V8 in a Chevette!)... and it takes a lot of calories and brutal training for your body to even begin to accept a lot of muscle weight... and being lean - low bodyfat at any weight to your system means possibility of death from starvation...

    If you stop feeding it the stimulis it needs - bye, bye muscle. And if you keep eating like you did - hello fat!

    I wouldn't call them "normal" - they are still athletes in good shape IMO...
    I think Warrior has got the right idea. Maybe most of the BB's want to shrink down in an attempt to add a few more years to their life. Being huge can place a great stress on the heart for one thing.

  10. #10
    johnsiegal is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by powerliftmike
    I think Warrior has got the right idea. Maybe most of the BB's want to shrink down in an attempt to add a few more years to their life. Being huge can place a great stress on the heart for one thing.

    Mike is right...

    1) Holding that much mass is un-natural..and hard on the heart and body.

    2) Holding that much mass...is a TREMENDOUS amount of work (most of these guys are doing 20-30 sets per body part per week with MAX HEAVY WEIGHT....who the hell wants to train that hard in their 50's).

    3) After attaining your AAS max...where do you go from there? As time passes, you are going to get bored and exhausted. Lets face it.... if a Pro football athlete could keep going into his 50's and 60's...he'd do it.

  11. #11
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    If you could spend one day with them, one day of their training, EATING, cooking, sleeping, training, SAUCING, EATING routines, you'd see what it take to keep that size....who the hell would want that when you are out of the sport?

  12. #12
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    It takes a lot to stay that big

  13. #13
    JuicyJim is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by vitor
    with normal hormone levels there is only so much that your body is able to keep. All gains over natrual-limit will be lost if you go natrual long enough. Steroid gains are not permenent!!

    so your saying no matter what you will go back to pre-juice body size even if you train and eat great long after aas use?? kinda confused here because my roomate who is now a ****in beast after 2 years of jucing, he hasn't done a cycle in 6 months and is still just as big, so i don't know what to think.

  14. #14
    stupidhippo is offline Anabolic Member
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    I agree with some ppl here though on the fact that HGH + training diet etc isnt enough to keep the size the pros have. Muscle is being built and broken continously and various factors determine the balance of these reactions. Without AAS I believe there is no way that kind of mass can be maintained IMO. I dont believe in natural limit as such though, or the way people talk about it atleast.

  15. #15
    timtim is offline Member
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    so your saying no matter what you will go back to pre-juice body size even if you train and eat great long after aas use?? kinda confused here because my roomate who is now a ****in beast after 2 years of jucing, he hasn't done a cycle in 6 months and is still just as big, so i don't know what to think.
    does he diet? i train and diet year round on and off. i look very close to the same on and off because of the intense diet. the gear adds volume and fake looking cuts. without it you can still look very, very good. takes consistency and time.

  16. #16
    chest6's Avatar
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    its so hard to keep that size. It takes a lot of gear/food and training to MAINTAIN that size and even more to add size..once you get that big you have to fight for every lb you gain

  17. #17
    Remington's Avatar
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    id like to see a pic of some pros that arent juicing anymore. Cant seem to find any clear examples.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kurz
    If you could spend one day with them, one day of their training, EATING, cooking, sleeping, training, SAUCING, EATING routines, you'd see what it take to keep that size....who the hell would want that when you are out of the sport?


    agree, i spent only 6 hrs with lee preist just because i new his girl friend and kurz is right

  19. #19
    tranzit is offline Senior Member
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    From my experience it is very hard to maintain great mass, Also your back and knees do not fair well in your older years when you carry too much weight.

  20. #20
    Power Viking is offline Banned
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    I agree with a lot of what is being said here, but I still think its strange that these ex-pros aren`t a bit bigger. I can understand that they might go from superstar to amateur BB level, but some of these guys look like a semi-dedicated "civilian" who just works out 2-3 times a week after work.

    I think this can go both ways though. Jukko Aloha used to be the strongest man in the world. Now he looks like someone I could out-squat with both my hands on my back. Then you`ve got Odd Haugen who`s in his mid 50s and is still deadlifting 750 pounds ++ and benching about 500 lbs.
    Kazmaier also looks like a brute even though he`s older than dirt.
    I guess it differs. I know for a fact that Odd works out like a maniac utilizing westside training and setting goals for himself every day. I think he wants to be the first guy in history to total 1000 kgs at age 60. Sounds insane, but he might just make it. After all, who else works out that hard when they`re more than half a century old?

  21. #21
    Timm1704's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuicyJim
    so your saying no matter what you will go back to pre-juice body size even if you train and eat great long after aas use?? kinda confused here because my roomate who is now a ****in beast after 2 years of jucing, he hasn't done a cycle in 6 months and is still just as big, so i don't know what to think.
    he may be a beast compared to average humans, but put him next to a pro bodybuilder and he would look like a small child. the more insanely big a person gets, the harder it will be to keep that size

  22. #22
    JuicyJim is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Timm1704
    he may be a beast compared to average humans, but put him next to a pro bodybuilder and he would look like a small child. the more insanely big a person gets, the harder it will be to keep that size
    i hear what your saying but trust me he would not look like a child he's 6'3 275lbs 12%bf

  23. #23
    chest6's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuicyJim
    i hear what your saying but trust me he would not look like a child he's 6'3 275lbs 12%bf
    ronnie has come in at that weight 4 inches shorter and shredded. He would still look small.

  24. #24
    Myka's Avatar
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    titus doesnt have time too workout...hes too busy murdering slutty girls and burning their bodies in the trunk of his jaguar...

  25. #25
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    does anyone have a good before and after pic?

  26. #26
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    G-Force is offline Anabolic Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewKid
    titus doesnt have time too workout...hes too busy murdering slutty girls and burning their bodies in the trunk of his jaguar...


  27. #27
    chinups Guest
    Pics???

  28. #28
    Jimmya73's Avatar
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    i dont think flex wheeler can work out anyway, he has some type of kidney problem and has to be on dialysis. i think alot of the bodybuilders burn out and just quit lifting regularly. i recall an article where levrone said he doesnt actually lift anymore(althought he looks like he does)

  29. #29
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    Because they can't afford all of those expensive drugs after they stop
    competing and their endorsements deals dry up along with their backers...

    You ever read up on what some of the top pros say it costs them to get
    ready for a show? Plus why would they want to keep taking those kinds
    of doses and drugs after they are thru with competing?

    Simple as that...


    Quote Originally Posted by JuicyJim
    I've noticed a trend with a lot of bodybuilder's that retire, they shrink to the size of normal men. i know this has to do alot with the fact that their no longer running insane amounts of sauce, but i thought taking HGH was supposed to help bodybuilder's retain that mass(by actually creating new muscle tissue, as opposed to just adding on with aas) I saw recent photos of flex wheeler and it looks as if he never was a bodybuilder, he looked like some regular guy, and i know titus has his own reasons why he's doesn't look good, but damn he's smaller than me now.

    any thoughts why these guys aren't retaining their size, or atleast some of it

  30. #30
    simster1 is offline Associate Member
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    a good goal would be stay big and ripped when you are young then focus on staying lean and ripped when you are older jmo

  31. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by simster1
    a good goal would be stay big and ripped when you are young then focus on staying lean and ripped when you are older jmo
    There you go. Could not have said it better myself. Except that you do want to carry some muscle weight as you age.

  32. #32
    JuicyJim is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jimmya73
    i dont think flex wheeler can work out anyway, he has some type of kidney problem and has to be on dialysis. i think alot of the bodybuilders burn out and just quit lifting regularly. i recall an article where levrone said he doesnt actually lift anymore(althought he looks like he does)
    i'm calling bullshit on this because flex wheeler competed at the 2005 arnold classic last year in martial arts, and he was in good shape, google it to findout

    your probably thinking of Tom Prince, that guy got kidney problems because he started juicing early and never, and i mean NEVER TOOK TIME OFF

  33. #33
    Jimmya73's Avatar
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    i'm calling bullshit on this because flex wheeler competed at the 2005 arnold classic last year in martial arts, and he was in good shape, google it to findout

    your probably thinking of Tom Prince, that guy got kidney problems because he started juicing early and never, and i mean NEVER TOOK TIME OFF
    i don't know if calling bullshit would be the right thing to say, its not like im making shit up dude.
    but...yea you are right he did compete, but he is on dialysis every 3 or 4 days, and he definitely cant cycle if he has kidney problems. i got it halfway right, its in muscular development

    tom prince was in sort of the same boat with kindey problems i guess, he is a nutritionist now right

  34. #34
    Timm1704's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chest6
    ronnie has come in at that weight 4 inches shorter and shredded. He would still look small.
    ditto. in the off season most pro bbers are at that weight and bodyfat, but at a height of around 5'8. not hating on your friends, just saying that to see a PROFESSIONAL bodybuilder, in person, compared to a huge, ripped, inshape dude who doesnt compete for a living, then you would tell the difference.

  35. #35
    Warrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JuicyJim
    so your saying no matter what you will go back to pre-juice body size even if you train and eat great long after aas use?? kinda confused here because my roomate who is now a ****in beast after 2 years of jucing, he hasn't done a cycle in 6 months and is still just as big, so i don't know what to think.
    You are missing a key figure here - natural potential. Everyone's natural potential is a bit different... as well their ability to obtain outside resources (not including the drugs)... like professional strength coaches, nutritionists, specialized equipment. Once you are off the gear and back to a "normal" system with a normal recovery ability and normal endogenous androgen levels... you are at the mercy of a few more obstacles.

    I have seen many people jump on gear - only to lose it all after they get off because they never knew (or had any assistance to know) what it takes to hold the extra muscle mass they had acquired. We all see this happen. You can't jump to a lean 220 pounds but keep training like a lean 200-pounder. You can move to a new level with AAS - but it imposes new training requirements and stresses on the body (to include those that do not hypertrophy - like your CNS).

    On the same token, I have seen folks that can go on cycle, gain some nice weight and then come off and keep nearly all of it, no problem... because they had the knowledge and drive to train at that new level.

    One more curve ball: if you gain so much muscle that your body in a natural state can not retain it... each person is only capable of holding so much without any drugs - than you'd basically have to start some kinda bridging in between cycles...

    Don't forget - the guys on the pro-card stage are genetic freaks - they have all the moons aligning toward developing a monster physique... and add AAS to the mix and thats how you get the Olympians.

  36. #36
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    Wow I thought this question was a joke. Not only do they stop the drugs, but they stop the type of training they used to do, it's like any other job when you reitre you stop doing whatever your job was, some still do it to a certain extent, but not to the degree they did when they weren't retired

    JohnnyB

  37. #37
    Warrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnnyB
    Wow I thought this question was a joke. Not only do they stop the drugs, but they stop the type of training they used to do, it's like any other job when you reitre you stop doing whatever your job was, some still do it to a certain extent, but not to the degree they did when they weren't retired

    JohnnyB
    Its a pretty common thing for people not to familiar with muscle physiology. There are a lot of people in this world that think they can go to the gym, add some muscle, then walk away from it for a year and keep whatever difference they made... think New Year;s resolution lifters at the gym's now. It's kinda like the ol' b/s sayin' "muscle turns to fat." Muscle don't turn to fat... people that were bustin' ass then stop training - but keep eating like they were - they turn to fat... the calories got nothing to do but go into storage...

  38. #38
    Myka's Avatar
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    I have a strong dislike for new years resolutioners...

  39. #39
    Warrior's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NewKid
    I have a strong dislike for new years resolutioners...
    I like to throw the little 5-pound plates at them until they cry and run out of the gym...

  40. #40
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    i didnt really believe anybody still thought the muscle turns to fat thing, or vice versa as i hear more often anymore. people still suprise me though, a young skinny kid told me the other day told me he wanted to get fat so he could turn it into muscle and before i could stop myself i called him an idiot right there in the store. that would be like changing iron into gold, but some people are not real intelligent.

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