04-05-2005, 10:35 AM #1Junior Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2004
whats the most amount of fat you can take in durning insulin window 5g or under right
just wondering because i will be using it am and postworkout...when i use it a am i was gonna make a shake with 50g protien 2packs oatmeal 30g dextrose.. i think there is like 5g fat in that shake....i could use grits it only has about 3gfat...i'm very lean and never over 8%bodyfat.. plus i'll be using gh 2iu when i wake up, then wait an hr. do my insulin shot humalog, IM, and have a shake with 50g whey isolate 30g dextrose and 2 packs bannana's n cream oatmeal... followed by my first meal 45min later 10egg whites 1cup oatmeal 2sl whole grain bread.. than wait an hour do 2iu gh and go train and do pw shot with 2scp protien 40g dextrose 1 packet strawberry n cream oatmeal.. 45min later 6oz chicken 2cups brown rice. 1hr later mrp.. then the rest of the night is all protien and fats....what do you think.. and then 2iu gh before bed... this way i'll spike my igf1 3 times.... i like to do it at night also because i don't sleep through the night because i get up to piss and eat every 2hr.. so my deep sleep gh never really kicks in....
04-05-2005, 01:45 PM #2
The only time you need to take Insulin is PWO. The less fat intake while insulin is active, the better. However, 5g of fat while insulin is active isn't really going to make much difference. So 5g of fat intake within the slin active period is fine.
If you are going to have oat meal, have that for your PPWO meal with some protein as well (perhaps grilled chicken or egg whites). As for your PWO nutrition, have your protein shake that consists of about 75g of protein and your "x" amount of dex.
Usually, immidietly post injection, people have "x" amount of dex, 5g of creatine and glutamine for additional benefits, then 15 min later have a protein shake. 1.25hrs later have your PPWO meal (oats and protein), then 2.00hrs later have another solid meal such as the PPWO meal.
So your insulin schedule should looks something like this:
Injection, "x" amount of insulin
immidietly post injcection, "x" amount of dex, 5g gluta and 5g creatine
15 min later 75g protein isolate
1.25hrs later, solid meal, I usually have boiled rice with grilled chicken. But if you want to have oats you may so, + some source of protein.
2.00hrs later, another solid meal same as the PPWO meal.
For my PWO nutrition, I have dex, creat, glutamine, then 15 min later I have protein. All these are 0g in fat.
For my PPWO meal I have boiled rice and grilled chicken. All these are very low in fat also.
For my PPPWO meal I have same as PPWO meal. Once again, all these are low in fat.
I also try and keep my carbohydrate intake in simple form so it gets digested faster, and especially while Insulin is active, the insulin will help push the nutrients into cells. This way I know there is little chance of any carbs being left over to be stored as fat.
Complex carbohydrates such as oats tend to take a little longer to digest, therefore, there is more chance of those carbs being left over later on to be stored as fat. So, I keep my carbohydrate intake in simple form.
If I was to use complex carbs, I would have to make sure not to have too much, hoping to have just the right amount that my body needs for recovery. Anything left over will be stored, and especially the type of nutrients being in complex form, there is even more chance of fat storage down the track.
Hope all that made sense.
04-05-2005, 01:55 PM #3
I am unsure if you are aware of the dextrose intake post injection, but incase you are not, you are supposed to consume 10g of dex for every 1IU of insulin . So 5IU would = to 50g of dex.
The glutamine and creatine intake always stays at 5 - 10g no matter how much insulin you take.
The protien intake 15 min later always stays between 75 - 100g, no matter how much insulin you take.
The only amount intake that changes is the dextrose amount. And that depends on how many IU you take (10g p/1IU).
My PPWO meal always consists of 50g carbs and 50g protein no matter how much insulin you take.
My PPPWO meal consists of 40g carbs and 50g protein no matter how much insulin you take.
By the time you have your next meal after PPPWO meal, insulin will not longer be active so you may eat as you usually do.
Don't intake fats while insulin is active or fall asleep and you will be fine. Try and stick with Humalog IM.
04-05-2005, 07:21 PM #4Junior Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2004
first i think 75g protien at one time is a waste.. most of that gets converted to glucose witch is what carbs convert to.... i'm pretty good friends with jay cutler and he eats a ton of carbs with about 30g protien... the reason for the insulin in the morning IM is to take the body out of a catabolic state instantly and shuttle all of the nutrients into the muscle... if you shoot gh when you wake then take 50mg anadrol then 45min later shoot your insulin..so the anadrol is active when you take your insulin..and the big reason for using insulin before breakfast while on gh is because the gh makes you insulin resistant, so this gives your pancrease a break...
then right after insulin shot take in 30g protein from liquid egg whites combined with 30g dex. combined with 1 packet oatmeal... blended in a shake
now you have fast obsorbing carbs along with fast obsorbing protein and some slow obsorbing carbs.....
then 1hr later combine 30g protein from liquid eggwhites combined with 2 packs oatmeal usually i use oatmeal like bannan's n cream. they have a little sugar in them..so you have slow and fast obsorbing carbs..
wait another hour have 1 chicken breast with some brown rice or whole grain bread.. take one more anadrol and shoot gh
wait one 1hr then go train..
do insulin pwo.. then have 70g dex with 10g creating 10g glutimine..
wait 10 min then have 40g protien isolate
1hr later have 6oz ground turkey breast(only 1g fat) with 2 cups brown rice
1.5 hr later repeat...
2hrs later gh and only protien and fats for the rest of the day and night... now more carbs because you don't need them anymore...
i actually got leaner in the off season doing it this way.. and gained 20lbs of muscle in 1 year.
switch anadrol to dbol and then after a while switch to suspension
than repeat after like 6 weeks of being off all orals and insulin...
anything more than 1.5g protien per lbm is overkill, it just gets converted to glucose anyway.. jay cutler eats 800g carb 300g protein...
04-06-2005, 03:57 AM #5
Bro, PWO your body needs all the nutrients it can get. Without insulin , it can easily digest about 35 - 40g of protein. That is the amount of protein that most people have PWO even if they are not using insulin. However, because insulin will force feed your muscle cells with nutrients (meaning your body will be able to absorb more nutrients than usual faster), your body will obviously be able to digest more than 40g of protein (because of the insulin). So that is why it is recomended to take advatnage of what you eat while insulin is active and have a little bit more than usual, so that is why I say, take about 75g protein PWO. I and many other people have taken tests with a BG monitor, and even with 75g PWO and "x" amount of dex, BG was still not high. This means there is still plenty of room for nutrients. But you don't want too much as it will be stored.
If ASS is not present, insulin in the AM on OFF training days is beneficial to stave off catabolism. Now, I am not a GH expert, so apart from insulin dosing in the AM of OFF days, and dosing PWO, I don't know where else you could position the dosing of insulin that may be benefiting because GH is in the picture. As far as I know, no matter if you are using insulin alone or with another compound, insulin guideline (meaning: best time to dose, and how much) is still the same.
The carb/protein intake depends on if you are using insulin or not. If not you are not using insulin then 40g protein PWO is fine. But if you are using insulin, not having more than 40g of protein PWO defeats the purpose of using insulin in the first place. Because the reason why we use insulin is so to allow our body to be able to absorb more nutrients than usual, faster. So therefore, you have more nutrients = more protein.
If what you do works well for you then simply stick with that, but I am only telling you what a majority of people do and are happy with. I do the same thing also and can't complain.
Another thing, I doubt that Jay Cuttler has 30g of protein. I can bet my right leg that he has a lot more than that, alot more. If you are friends with him, then perhaps you should go to him for advice. That way you can get mixed opinions and make up your mind on what you want to do.
Good luck to you.
Last edited by Gear; 04-06-2005 at 04:02 AM.
04-06-2005, 06:31 AM #6Junior Member
- Join Date
- Apr 2004
jay cutler has 30g protien per meal but 13 meals a day... i got both of his video's ill burn you copies and sent them to.. there pretty good movies... send me your addy i'll send some of his video's.. plus i have like 7 other prettty good pro bodybuilder movie's...peace bro...
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