Overtraining? Or something else?

So I have been on TRT for quite awhile and I am currently 10 weeks into a 400mg pw test cyp blast. Started at 170 lbs and I am now 194 lbs (food intake/diet is not a problem, i eat very clean and more than enough....unless eating too much possibly a problem?) I have gained a bit of body fat but nothing exponential.

My training is setup as such (and I think this might be the problem) I train eod and do light cardio or abs on the days between. So basicly I do upper body every 4 days and legs every 4 days. (almost 4 times a week weight training)

The strength/size gains have been incredible the first 8 or so weeks but the last 2+ weeks they have slowed down and it feels like my muscles are constantly sore/tired feeling. even after 4 days recovery with good rest and diet! it seems like overtraining has to be the reason? I have hit a brick wall.

For instance: I have gotten much stronger but when I try to do pull ups on upper body day I actually do less than I could before my cycle? They don't feel the same as they did before (sorry if that sounds strange but I dont know how else to describe it) I have been stuck doing the same weight/reps give or take for the past 2 weeks and it seems almost MORE difficult to maintain that each time I train now...let alone add more weight to my reps :madd:

So my question is am I overtraining?

Should i split up my muscle groups to different days to kind of give each muscle group more days to recover?

This is a ruff draft plan, let me know if this isn't optimal

Day 1: shoulders/back

Day 2: Legs

Day 3: bi's/tri's

Day 4: chest/ core

Day 5: cardio

Add a day or 2 of rest in when needed

The reason I havent had a plan like this before is because I really didnt need it. 4 days rest has always been fine and I had no problem getting a good solid upper body and lower body workout each session...but maybe overtraining isnt the problem? You would think on a blast my recovery would be quicker? I am lost and it is very frustrating. I switched up my routine completely when I started my blast by the way so I don't think doing the same routine for 10 weeks in a row is a problem yet?

All comments/advice are appreciated good and bad.
http://forums.steroid.com/members-cy...-400mg-pw.html (my blast/cycle thread)

Thanks in advance, the information I have learned from you guys on this forum is incredible.

How much are you eating? If your not eating enough then you are not going to keep gaining

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

How much are you eating? If your not eating enough then you are not going to keep gaining

---

I am eating well over 3000+ calories a day. I don't count my calories/macros everyday but I eat very clean(basicly the diet in my cycle thread with the changes you told me to make. took out the whole wheat bagels and I eat oatmeal instead and got rid of the mayo on the sandwich) and I eat a lot. I eat every 2-3 hours. I am without a doubt in a nice calorie surplus and getting more than 1.5g of protein per lb of bodyweight. My weight has been going up steadily but I am afraid I am just adding body fat now if I am not getting stronger?
First pic is from end of November 180lbs and the second pic is from Dec 29th right at 190lbs (will post a newer pic soon)
Attachment 161303Attachment 161304

Why are you eating that much. What are you trying to accomplish?

The reason you can do less pull ups now is because you are 24lbs heavier.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

Why are you eating that much. What are you trying to accomplish?

---

Build as much muscle as possible while I am blasting. If body fat became or becomes a problem, I will slow down on the eating for sure. I am just trying to make the most of the 12 weeks before I go back to a normal TRT dose.

But do you think overtraining could be the issue Bio? I am confused because I thought 4 days inbetween (especially while on a blast) would be enough to go back in the gym and kill it again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by The Deadlifting Dog

The reason you can do less pull ups now is because you are 24lbs heavier.

---

That is true, but it's not just pull ups. maybe saying that was a bad example. just making strength gains all of a sudden has become impossible and a challenge just to maintain what I have been doing for a few weeks now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

Build as much muscle as possible while I am blasting. If body fat became or becomes a problem, I will slow down on the eating for sure. I am just trying to make the most of the 12 weeks before I go back to a normal TRT dose. But do you think overtraining could be the issue Bio? I am confused because I thought 4 days inbetween (especially while on a blast) would be enough to go back in the gym and kill it again.

---

i think you would be much happier with your results if you cut weight. You haven't built enough of a base yet to try to bulk .Yes it looks like you are overtraining

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

i think you would be much happier with your results if you cut weight. You haven't built enough of a base yet to try to bulk .Yes it looks like you are overtraining

---

Ok. I am going to do what I should've been doing from the start and count/keep track of what I am eating. I'll try cutting calories and being more precise with the carbs/fats. I am going to take a week break from weight training as well to hopefully recover and I hope that will do the trick. Last night almost drove me crazy struggling to do the same weight I was doing weeks ago on almost every exercise.

Thanks for your help as always Bio, I appreciate it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

Ok. I am going to do what I should've been doing from the start and count/keep track of what I am eating. I'll try cutting calories and being more precise with the carbs/fats. I am going to take a week break from weight training as well to hopefully recover and I hope that will do the trick. Last night almost drove me crazy struggling to do the same weight I was doing weeks ago on almost every exercise. Thanks for your help as always Bio, I appreciate it.

---

well remember this.... Never have a bad workout. There are going to be times you are not as strong because of either food, stress, sleep or whatever. Just cause your not feeling as strong does not mean you have to have a bad training session. Lighten the weight and tear the muscle tissue anyway. The muscle doesn't realize the weight you are lifting that's all in your head. It's all about forcing the muscle to grow. Even just hitting it with a different lift. Let me ask you this. How long has it been since you switched up your training?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

well remember this.... Never have a bad workout. There are going to be times you are not as strong because of either food, stress, sleep or whatever. Just cause your not feeling as strong does not mean you have to have a bad training session. Lighten the weight and tear the muscle tissue anyway. The muscle doesn't realize the weight you are lifting that's all in your head. It's all about forcing the muscle to grow. Even just hitting it with a different lift. Let me ask you this. How long has it been since you switched up your training?

---

I completely changed it right before I started the blast. So a little over 10 weeks of the same routine

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

I completely changed it right before I started the blast. So a little over 10 weeks of the same routine

---

its time to change it. I suggest changing it up every 4-6 weeks. That is why you are stalling

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

its time to change it. I suggest changing it up every 4-6 weeks. That is why you are stalling

---

Alright, I'll do that.

Not asking you to write me a full plan/routine but whats a good day to day layout of which muscles I should work? like Day 1: chest/shoulders Day 2: Legs etc. Or should I stick with what I have been doing for awhile? Full uper body 2x every 8 days and lower body 2x every 8 days(but change up the exercises/routine of course)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

Alright, I'll do that.

Not asking you to write me a full plan/routine but whats a good day to day layout of which muscles I should work? like Day 1: chest/shoulders Day 2: Legs etc. Or should I stick with what I have been doing for awhile? Full uper body 2x every 8 days and lower body 2x every 8 days(but change up the exercises/routine of course)

---

Well what type of training are you trying to do and how many days each week? What is your training experience?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

Well what type of training are you trying to do and how many days each week? What is your training experience?

---

Basically I have been trying to lift the heaviest weight I can handle for 6-8 reps simply put. I train every other day and the days in between when I am not training I do light cardio or abs if I am not resting. I haven't gotten into a specialty training yet.

Been lifting about 2 1/2 years but only been a member of a gym for a little under a year..but having said that I had all the free weights I needed at the house with a bench. I know my physique doesn't reflect 2+ years of training (lol) but low t for years (in the 100-150 total t range) and a 3-4 month period of all out weight loss where I lost what little muscle I had to begin with when I started TRT held me back quite a bit.

If you want my opinion you should go on a cut with your nutrition and work each muscle for 8-12 reps. Its lighter weight yes but less risk of injury when you are cutting weight. If you adjust your nutrition you will make huge gains in the next 90 days to 6 months

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

If you want my opinion you should go on a cut with your nutrition and work each muscle for 8-12 reps. Its lighter weight yes but less risk of injury when you are cutting weight. If you adjust your nutrition you will make huge gains in the next 90 days to 6 months

---

So, go on a cut (calorie deficit) go for 8-12 reps instead of 6-8 and once I lose enough body fat I should start a lean bulk is what you are suggesting? I just want to make 100% sure thats what you mean before I start

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

So, go on a cut (calorie deficit) go for 8-12 reps instead of 6-8 and once I lose enough body fat I should start a lean bulk is what you are suggesting? I just want to make 100% sure thats what you mean before I start

---

Yeah cut and get down to 12 percent or so before you consider bulking. You will look much heavier

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bio-Active

Yeah cut and get down to 12 percent or so before you consider bulking. You will look much heavier

---

Ok, that sounds good. One last thing and I will quit bugging you, if you had to guess what do you think my current bf% is?

I need to find a good/cheap place to get it done professionally, I refuse to pay some random person who works at the gym to do it because I have heard from multiple people they do it wrong and it's inaccurate.

Attachment 161305

(before someone asks the green tape is from donating blood earlier today, trying to avoid higher hct count)

I would say about 20 % but that is just a guess from one pic. Bottom line is you can safely loose 1-2 % bf each week with the right nutrition

Alright, I will start making the changes to my diet. Thanks again man

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

Alright, I will start making the changes to my diet. Thanks again man

---

take a look at the thread in the nutrition section called what are you eating right now, if you want to make huge gains and get lean it all starts with nutrition. In that thread you will see how strict some of us are

Update: Was 100% overtraining! Took a 8 days off from lifting and went on a cut durring those 8 days, lost about 3 lbs with a slight calorie deficit and cardio. Today when I lifted I broke ALL of my records for weight on EVERY lift even after an 8 day calorie deficit. Felt really good knowing what I had done wrong and having fixed it. Could not be happier about this

I guess only 4 days rest per muscle group caught up with me. Now since I know what the problem was I will change things to avoid this and give more days to recover

Now to continue my cut without losing my strength/muscle! Also doing a new routine next lift

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dj Screw

Update: Was 100% overtraining! Took a 8 days off from lifting and went on a cut durring those 8 days, lost about 3 lbs with a slight calorie deficit and cardio. Today when I lifted I broke ALL of my records for weight on EVERY lift even after an 8 day calorie deficit. Felt really good knowing what I had done wrong and having fixed it. Could not be happier about this

I guess only 4 days rest per muscle group caught up with me. Now since I know what the problem was I will change things to avoid this and give more days to recover

Now to continue my cut without losing my strength/muscle! Also doing a new routine next lift

---

Good job

Don't want to sound like an ass, but you don't look like you've trained at all.

Try cutting your routine down to 3 days per week and see how you feel in a month or so:

DAY1: CHEST/SHOULDERS/TRICEPS
DAY2: QUADS/HAMS/CALVES/ABS
DAY3: BACK/BICEPS/FOREARMS